In article <sgte8s$l3r$1@gioia.aioe.org>, Robin Goodfellow
<Ancient-of-Days@Heaven.Net> wrote:

> My facts are always wrong because I make this shit up.

ftfy

In article <j0rYI.30272$rl3.14417@fx45.iad>, RabidHussar
<rabid@huss.ar> wrote:

> > In article <sgs9vb$enk$1@dont-email.me>, sms
> > <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
> >> Some apps are just not appropriate for some phones. My son's iPhone X
> >> will shut down if he runs Waze for more than around 20 minutes,
> >
> > bullshit.
> >
> > if that's even slightly true, the phone is defective or there's a *lot*
> > of details you're leaving out, or it's just flat out false.
> >
> >> and
> >> that's with the phone mounted on one of those vent phone holders with
> >> cold are blowing on it. I've gotten the over-heating warning "iPad has
> >> to cool down before you can use it" on my iPad Pro occasionally.
> >
> > waze does not cause the device to get hot.
>
> I have to agree that it is unlikely for Waze, by itself, to be
> responsible for that.

it's not waze that's causing it, assuming his story is even true.

i've been using waze for *years* on a variety of devices with no issues
whatsoever.

> However, as far as I know, the application is free
> and needs a way to monetize itself so it's possible that it does a lot
> of spying in the background to pay for itself.

there are ads based on the user's current location or along their route.

<https://www.waze.com/ads/>
<https://www.waze.com/business/>

> Otherwise, it is
> constantly receiving and sending data about wherever you are and that
> might require a lot more processing power than the iPhone is capable of.

sending/receiving data is not in any way an issue. that uses minimal
processing power, although it does incur a bit of a battery drain to
run the radios. it's also not constant, as would be with something like
streaming audio. it updates map and traffic data as needed.

like any navigation app, waze uses the gps, which is a big battery
drain. medium to long trips will need the phone to be connected to
power.

short trips might be able to avoid being connected to power, but short
trips are unlikely to need a navigation app.

In article <sgtepk$qnh$1@dont-email.me>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> > That's possible, but I can't imagine how a digital connection would
> > degrade the audio quality any more than an analog connection would. With
> > analog, degradation is guaranteed whereas with digital, the connection
> > is either made or isn't. If it is, it operates as well as it should.
>
> A wired digital connection using the Lightning or USB-C port would be
> fine. It's a Bluetooth digital connection that's the issue.

it's not an issue.

the signal path is digital from the phone to the d/a in the headset
itself. bluetooth has zero effect.

In article <sgtf0t$11d2$1@gioia.aioe.org>, Robin Goodfellow
<Ancient-of-Days@Heaven.Net> wrote:

> > that is true, however, some of them are fairly cheap (under $50) so the
> > net cost per year is almost nothing.
>
> Under $50 is almost nothing?

since math is difficult for you, here's the breakdown:

bluetooth headphones will last about 3-4 years before the user might
want to replace them because the battery doesn't last as long as it
once did. they still continue to work, just for shorter intervals.

$50 over 4 years is $12.50/yr, or just over $1 per month, for the
convenience of not needing to deal with tangled wires.

even if it's replaced in 2 years, which would be highly unusual, it's
still about $2/month.

> My 64GB Samsung Galaxy A32 5G from T-Mobile in May was $28 (tax only).
> It has more functionality than any iPhone ever sold at _any_ price!

it doesn't, and the issue is not phones, but *wireless* *headphones*.

In article <sgtgb6$8qu$1@dont-email.me>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

>
> sms is arong of course.

ftfy

> It wasn't that the degraded battery could
> not supply sufficient power,

it was, which affects all batteries in all devices.

> it was that the PMICs could not convert the
> power from the battery into sufficient power for the processor.

it was not, nor does that even make sense.

nothing can extract power out of a battery that can't provide it.

> Apple
> fixed this beginning with the iPhone 8 by adding a third PMIC.

nope. the iphone 8 was already done and the xs nearly so.

it's not possible for apple to make last minute hardware changes, where
last minute is 1-2 *years*.

> Here's an explanation for non-technical individuals:

technical individuals know that it's wrong.

In article <sgtgus$21a$1@gioia.aioe.org>, Ken Hart
<kwhart1@frontier.com> wrote:

> > regardless, no phone should overheat in a half-hour. that's bad.
>
> regardless, no phone should be throttled to half speed. that's bad.

the pixel 5a throttles to zero.

iphones are not throttled at all. they clip peaks, which is not the
same thing.

In article <WdrYI.44421$QzOf.9974@fx17.iad>, RabidHussar
<rabid@huss.ar> wrote:

> >> Wireless charging is convenient but slow and I would definitely be upset
> >> to be forced to rely on it.
> >
> > it's not significantly slower, and since most people charge overnight,
> > how long it takes doesn't matter.
>
> That's true. However, there are instances in a day where fast-charging
> is appreciated. Sometimes, an app decides that it wants to drain your
> battery and you find yourself with a phone that is at 25% or so after
> only two or three hours of mild use. In those cases, wireless charging
> is mostly useless to the user because of how slow it is.

that can happen, but it's not that common.

no system is ideal in every situation.

> > a portless phone is an interesting idea though. electric toothbrushes
> > have been doing it since forever. drop the toothbrush into the cradle.
>
> I always wondered how they charge but I imagine that the technology is
> not dissimilar to the wireless charging some phones use.

magnetic induction.

qi is a bit more sophisticated than a toothbrush, with the charger and
device being able to communicate with each other, but otherwise, it's
the same concept.

In article <slrnsj4i5n.1lft.g.kreme@m1mini.local>, Lewis
<g.kreme@kreme.dont-email.me> wrote:

> >> In article <sgs9vb$enk$1@dont-email.me>, sms
> >> <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
> >>> Some apps are just not appropriate for some phones. My son's iPhone X
> >>> will shut down if he runs Waze for more than around 20 minutes,

....

> The iPhone X will run Waze,. or any GPS app for hours with no problem.
> GPS apps do use up a lot of battery, so you will not get all day use
> when using GPS, which is why you plug them in in the car.

i used to use waze on a 3gs or 4 (don't remember which, it's been that
long), which has a tiny fraction of processing power that an iphone x
does.

On 2021-09-03 12:14 p.m., nospam wrote:
> In article <JZqYI.30271$rl3.16345@fx45.iad>, RabidHussar
> <rabid@huss.ar> wrote:
>
>>
>> Funny enough, most of my computing is done on an ASUS Zephyrus G14
>> nowadays. That thing is as the same size as a Macbook Pro but has a
>> RTX3060 within it in addition to a Ryzen 9 5900HS. You would expect it
>> to overheat like crazy but it doesn't.
>
> it has fans for cooling.

Well, yes... obviously.

>> One has to wonder how an _iPad_
>> manages to overheat with its lack of processing power.
>
> it doesn't overheat, plus recent ipads have a *lot* of processing power.
>
> the latest ipad pros use apple's m1 chip, the same as in a macbook pro
> and mac mini (which have fans).
>
> it's possible that it can overheat if it's in a hot vehicle (or even a
> hot room without air conditioning) and doing something processor
> intensive, but that can happen with many devices.
>
> in normal use, it doesn't overheat, even when playing processor
> intensive games or rendering videos.

Admittedly, the M1 is absolutely remarkable in terms of its processing
power. Someone in comp.os.linux.advocacy got a Macbook Air with it and
was so happy about its performance that he asked me to benchmark my very
powerful Ryzen 9 against his M1 in single core performance. I got to a
score of 3,100 or so and he got 4,000 with the M1. Very impressive.

--
@RabidHussar

On 2021-09-03 12:14 p.m., nospam wrote:
> In article <j0rYI.30272$rl3.14417@fx45.iad>, RabidHussar
> <rabid@huss.ar> wrote:
>
>>> In article <sgs9vb$enk$1@dont-email.me>, sms
>>> <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
>>>> Some apps are just not appropriate for some phones. My son's iPhone X
>>>> will shut down if he runs Waze for more than around 20 minutes,
>>>
>>> bullshit.
>>>
>>> if that's even slightly true, the phone is defective or there's a *lot*
>>> of details you're leaving out, or it's just flat out false.
>>>
>>>> and
>>>> that's with the phone mounted on one of those vent phone holders with
>>>> cold are blowing on it. I've gotten the over-heating warning "iPad has
>>>> to cool down before you can use it" on my iPad Pro occasionally.
>>>
>>> waze does not cause the device to get hot.
>>
>> I have to agree that it is unlikely for Waze, by itself, to be
>> responsible for that.
>
> it's not waze that's causing it, assuming his story is even true.
>
> i've been using waze for *years* on a variety of devices with no issues
> whatsoever.

I recall it being a battery hog the last time I used it back in 2014 or
so but I figured that they would have optimized it by now.

>> However, as far as I know, the application is free
>> and needs a way to monetize itself so it's possible that it does a lot
>> of spying in the background to pay for itself.
>
> there are ads based on the user's current location or along their route.
>
> <https://www.waze.com/ads/>
> <https://www.waze.com/business/>

That makes sense.

>> Otherwise, it is
>> constantly receiving and sending data about wherever you are and that
>> might require a lot more processing power than the iPhone is capable of.
>
> sending/receiving data is not in any way an issue. that uses minimal
> processing power, although it does incur a bit of a battery drain to
> run the radios. it's also not constant, as would be with something like
> streaming audio. it updates map and traffic data as needed.
>
> like any navigation app, waze uses the gps, which is a big battery
> drain. medium to long trips will need the phone to be connected to
> power.
>
> short trips might be able to avoid being connected to power, but short
> trips are unlikely to need a navigation app.

What I can say for sure is that Waze's accuracy is second to none and
using it is often better than the GPS systems many cars are bundled
with. The only GPS I've used in a car that comes close to Waze is
whatever they put in the BMW 4 series, but Infiniti's is awful.

--
@RabidHussar

On 2021-09-03 12:15 p.m., nospam wrote:
> In article <WdrYI.44421$QzOf.9974@fx17.iad>, RabidHussar
> <rabid@huss.ar> wrote:
>
>>>> Wireless charging is convenient but slow and I would definitely be upset
>>>> to be forced to rely on it.
>>>
>>> it's not significantly slower, and since most people charge overnight,
>>> how long it takes doesn't matter.
>>
>> That's true. However, there are instances in a day where fast-charging
>> is appreciated. Sometimes, an app decides that it wants to drain your
>> battery and you find yourself with a phone that is at 25% or so after
>> only two or three hours of mild use. In those cases, wireless charging
>> is mostly useless to the user because of how slow it is.
>
> that can happen, but it's not that common.
>
> no system is ideal in every situation.

Other than having to carry a wire with you, I have trouble finding any
kind of issue with the fast-charging most Android devices currently
offer, to be honest.

>>> a portless phone is an interesting idea though. electric toothbrushes
>>> have been doing it since forever. drop the toothbrush into the cradle.
>>
>> I always wondered how they charge but I imagine that the technology is
>> not dissimilar to the wireless charging some phones use.
>
> magnetic induction.
>
> qi is a bit more sophisticated than a toothbrush, with the charger and
> device being able to communicate with each other, but otherwise, it's
> the same concept.

Excellent, thank you.

--
@RabidHussar

On 9/3/2021 9:02 AM, Ken Hart wrote:
> On 9/3/2021 9:52 AM, nospam wrote:
> nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> asked
>> regardless, no phone should overheat in a half-hour. that's bad.
>
> regardless, no phone should be throttled to half speed. that's bad.

Well at least with the iPhone throttling issue you could mitigate the
the problem with a new battery, originally $29, now more, but still a
lot less than buying a new phone.

We'll see if Google comes up with a fix that enables 4K recording
without causing the processor to heat up as much, but I have my doubts.
They chose a lower performance processor for the 5a, and recording 4K
video is very processor intensive so it's probably running at top speed
when recording. If they throttle the processor then they probably can't
do 4K video. Doing 4K video on a non-flagship phone is not even
something most consumers expect.

Maybe they can just remove the 4K recording capability and lower the
price, and offer refunds to anyone that wants to return the phone, and
rebates to those that don't care about 4K video.

Some people think that there is always a software fix for inherent
hardware issues, but the "Batterygate" issue with iPhone shows the
problem with this approach.

You also have the issue with iPhone 12 reception which still has no fix,
after almost a year
<https://www.reddit.com/r/verizon/comments/jgyd82/iphone_12_pro_dropping_to_no_service_in_areas_of/>.
My son once had an LG, G4, a great phone until it got so hot that one of
the components unsoldered itself from the board; eventually LG had to
offer refunds
<https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/lg-bootloop-settlement/>.

Unlike Batterygate, the Pixel issue should have been revealed in
testing, you always run apps that are called a "power virus" to see if
your thermal solution is sufficient. The report about the 5a becoming
"too hot to hold" reminded me of an early Windows XP Tablet device I saw
at a trade show in Taiwan. It ran so hot that the manufacturer suggested
that users wear gloves.

RabidHussar <rabid@huss.ar> asked
> However, there are instances in a day where fast-charging
> is appreciated.

FACTS:
My free ($28 in tax) 5G Galaxy A32 came with a 5AH battery & fast charger.
My less-than-half-priced iPhone 12 mini didn't come with _either_ of those.
<https://i.postimg.cc/YC1B906F/tmopromo01.jpg>

Worse than the puny iPhone 12 battery are the cheap components inside it.
(see references in the sig since my facts are never wrong)

Apple slowly strangles the functionality out of the iPhone, bit by bit.
Almost to the point where you have to buy back the very air you breathe.

ASSESSMENT:
Given the almost twice weekly randomly timed half-day to day-long PG&E power
outages we've been experiencing here in the Santa Cruz Mountains of
California, you'd be surprised at how convenient a big battery (standard in
most new Androids) and a fast charger is (also standard in most new
Androids) truly is.

*The (crippled) iPhone is always dead.*

Waking up to having had no power all night doesn't charge batteries.
But being back to full charge in only a few minutes does.

We also need Internet hotspot speed and FM radio during these power outages.
https://i.postimg.cc/zf9w1tGZ/speedtest07.jpg
--
References on the small _and_ cheap batteries in the iPhone 12 mini (since
apologists are desperate to refute all facts about Apple they don't like).
*Apple put cheap batteries and boards into the iPhone 12 for profit*
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/21/21394985/apple-iphone-12-battery-cost-5g-kuo
https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/08/21/apple-to-offset-cost-of-5g-iphone-components-with-cheaper-battery-tech
https://www.maticstoday.com/2020/08/21/why-apple-is-using-cheap-battery-parts-in-iphone-12/
https://9to5mac.com/2020/08/21/kuo-iphone-12-5g-component-cost/
https://www.pcmag.com/news/report-iphone-12-to-use-smaller-cheaper-battery
https://www.macrumors.com/2020/08/20/kuo-iphone-12-battery-board/
https://www.timesnownews.com/technology-science/article/apple-opting-for-cheaper-battery-parts-to-cut-costs-on-5g-iphone-12-analyst-ming-chi-kuo/640657
https://techlog360.com/apple-will-use-cheaper-parts-in-the-iphone-12/

In article <LrsYI.16667$YW.13956@fx05.iad>, RabidHussar <rabid@huss.ar>
wrote:

>
> I recall it being a battery hog the last time I used it back in 2014 or
> so but I figured that they would have optimized it by now.

it's the gps.

any app that uses the gps at maximum accuracy, which waze requires, is
going to see a significant battery hit. there's no getting around that.

the impact can be reduced if the gps accuracy is reduced, but that's
not an option for navigation apps such as waze.

lower accuracy is an option for something like a weather app, which
only needs to know a nearby major city.

In article <sgtk5o$616$1@dont-email.me>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> Well at least with the iPhone throttling issue you could mitigate the
> the problem with a new battery, originally $29, now more, but still a
> lot less than buying a new phone.

more than mitigation. a new battery can source maximum demands, so no
clipping will occur.

> We'll see if Google comes up with a fix that enables 4K recording
> without causing the processor to heat up as much, but I have my doubts.
> They chose a lower performance processor for the 5a, and recording 4K
> video is very processor intensive so it's probably running at top speed
> when recording. If they throttle the processor then they probably can't
> do 4K video. Doing 4K video on a non-flagship phone is not even
> something most consumers expect.

so far, it appears to be a hardware issue, which means it's going to be
rather difficult and expensive to fix.

> Maybe they can just remove the 4K recording capability and lower the
> price, and offer refunds to anyone that wants to return the phone, and
> rebates to those that don't care about 4K video.

that would be an incredibly bad idea, guaranteeing that future pixel
sales will be deeply impacted, and not in a good way.

> Some people think that there is always a software fix for inherent
> hardware issues, but the "Batterygate" issue with iPhone shows the
> problem with this approach.

it was a software fix.

your claims that it was not are false.

android phones had the same issue. cameras have the same issue.

everything with a battery has the same issue, if the battery is pushed
to its limits.

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> In article <sgrd2u.bns.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>, Frank Slootweg
> <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote:
>
> > > sms filters out and insults anyone who tells him he's wrong,
> >
> > false.
>
> not false.

<whoosh>^2. severe case of sarchasm.

qed. hth. hand. eod.

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> asked
> android phones had the same issue. cameras have the same issue.
>
> everything with a battery has the same issue, if the battery is pushed
> to its limits.

What you're NOT saying is how puny & crappy the iPhone batteries are.
By design.

In message <sgtgb6$8qu$1@dont-email.me> sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
> It wasn't that the degraded battery could not supply sufficient power,
> it was that the PMICs could not convert the power

This is complete and utter nonsense and yet another example of your
being a complete idiot.

--
He glanced cautiously at the dancing shapes, which made weird and
worrying shapes on the far wall - strange biped animals, eldritch
underground things... Carrot sighed. 'Stop making shadow
pictures, Detritus.'

Lewis <g.kreme@kreme.dont-email.me> asked
> This is complete and utter nonsense and yet another example of your
> being a complete idiot.

If it wasn't the power control and it's not the battery chemistry,
then what was it that forced Apple to _secretly slash performance_?

And how did that also force Apple to _secretly backdate_ release notes?

And then, how did both those things force Apple to _lie about them_?

*What logic do you use to explain those incontrovertible facts, Lewis?*

In article <sgtudo$it7$1@gioia.aioe.org>, Robin Goodfellow
<Ancient-of-Days@Heaven.Net> wrote:

>
> If it wasn't the power control and it's not the battery chemistry,

it was and still is the battery chemistry, as has been explained to you
and others multiple times.

this affects *all* batteries.

RabidHussar <rabid@huss.ar> asked
> I think I've only owned one Android phone which didn't have FM on it.

Here, in the Santa Cruz Mountains of California, PG&E has been shutting off
our power for hours (to days) twice a week for the entire month of August.

FM radio comes in handy.
So do the huge Android batteries.
As does the properly sized super fast charger that came in the box.

All nice things that my new iPhone 12 minu lacks.
Which is why the _Android phones are working_ - and *the iPhones are dead*.

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> asked
> any app that uses the gps at maximum accuracy, which waze requires

Hmmmmmm...

You can easily set Android's location radios' accuracy a number of ways.

Are you saying iOS can't set the accuracy to what the _users_ want it to be?

Why don't you just set iOS' LOCATION accuracy to what _you_ want it to be?

On 2021-09-03 1:05 p.m., Robin Goodfellow wrote:
> nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> asked
>> any app that uses the gps at maximum accuracy, which waze requires
>
> Hmmmmmm...
>
> You can easily set Android's location radios' accuracy a number of ways.

Show this.

>
> Are you saying iOS can't set the accuracy to what the _users_ want it to be?
>
> Why don't you just set iOS' LOCATION accuracy to what _you_ want it to be?
>

RabidHussar <rabid@huss.ar> asked
> Admittedly, the M1 is absolutely remarkable in terms of its processing
> power.

Name a _single_ SOC Apple has designed that does NOT have unfixable flaws?
https://www.google.com/search?q=apple+m1+flaw

In article <news:slrnsj4hrp.1lft.g.kreme@m1mini.local>, Lewis
<g.kreme@kreme.dont-email.me> wrote:
Lewis <g.kreme@kreme.dont-email.me> asked
> Goggle released an astonishingly shitty phonew with serious problems. If
> thi s were Apple you would have posted 10,000 messages along with your
> cohort of shitbag trolls, but no, google releases a phone with 30 minute
> battery life and you're making excuses for them.

Apple released an astonishingly shitty iPhone with serious problems.

If this were Android you would have posted 10,000 messages along with your
cohort of shitbag trolls, but no, Apple releases an iPhone with atrocious
throttling issues and then lies about it and you're making excuses for them.