On 2021-08-02 10:35 p.m., T wrote:
> On 8/2/21 5:18 PM, Paul wrote:
>> T wrote:
>>> On 8/1/21 6:26 PM, boB wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2021 09:17:30 -0400, Rabid Roach <rabid@roa.ch> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> But nospamipedia and its infinite wealth of knowledge told me the
>>>>> vaccines are safe!
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-9480051/Medical-student-21-died-day-getting-J-J-vaccine.html>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/39-year-old-dies-after-astrazeneca-vaccine-a-second-dose-following-sinovac>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.the-sun.com/news/2305200/doctor-dies-36-others-develop-rare-blood-disorder-vaccines/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.chiangraitimes.com/thailand-national-news/woman-dies-after-second-vaccine-dose-under-mix-and-match-program/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://globalnews.ca/news/7835081/alberta-woman-death-astrazeneca-covid-vaccine/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://greekreporter.com/2021/06/18/greek-woman-dies-after-second-pfizer-vaccine/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Had these people never gotten the vaccine, they would still be alive
>>>>> today. But remember to do the right thing and get vaccinated, people!
>>>>>
>>>>> NOSPAMIPEDIA DEMANDS IT!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Vaccines are MUCH safer than getting Covid.
>>>
>>> It is not a vaccine.  It is an mRNA Therapy
>>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>>>
>>> Do you have any current data on your above
>>> statement?  Or are you just sharing your opinion?
>>>
>>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>>> now very low.
>>>
>>> I would love to see the comparison of death rates
>>> between "from" (NOT WITH) the commie flu and
>>> from the jab.
>>>
>>> So far in the states, over 4000 have been reported
>>> to have died from the jab, with an estimate of only
>>> about 13% reporting.
>>>
>>> Also, mRNA therapies have shown a lot of
>>> Antibody Dependent Enhancement (ADE) in the
>>> past and there have not been a long enough
>>> time period.  And this inofrmatino is not beinf
>>
>> It's a vaccine.
>>
>> Part of the job of the WHO, is to try to encourage
>> common terminologies.
>>
>> World Health Organization website:
>>
>> https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/vaccines-and-immunization-what-is-vaccination?adgroupsurvey={adgroupsurvey}&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI0oS-u6mN8gIV9XNvBB0StQshEAAYASAAEgJNXfD_BwE
>>
>>
>>    "What is vaccination?
>>
>>     Vaccines train your immune system to create antibodies,
>>     just as it does when it is exposed to a disease."
>>
>> *******
>>
>> The diagram each scientist produces, is a measure of
>> his or her interests.
>>
>> This first diagram, concentrates on the initial "cell-hijacking"
>> method of producing loose S-protein which has encoded, a modified
>> limited section of spike protein. (One of the amino acids is replaced
>> with an analog of it, to avoid some side effect they knew about in
>> advance. The spike protein also has other edits done to it. The
>> proprietary
>> vaccines have already been reverse-engineered by others, so the
>> exact sequence is known.)
>>
>> https://media.springernature.com/lw685/springer-static/image/art%3A10.1007%2Fs40588-021-00162-y/MediaObjects/40588_2021_162_Fig2_HTML.png?as=webp
>>
>>
>> ( https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s40588-021-00162-y.pdf )
>>
>> *******
>>
>> This second picture, shows more of the bodily response. The bottom half
>> of the diagram, shows the various portions of the immune system being
>> trained by the S-protein.
>>
>> [Save to disk...]
>>
>> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218962/bin/medscimonit-26-e924700-g001.jpg" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218962/bin/medscimonit-26-e924700-g001.jpg
>>
>>
>> ( https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218962/ )
>>
>> You would need to do a significant amount of web searches, to
>> decode all the various pieces in the bottom section of that
>> diagram (CD4, CD8, macrophage cells, memory B cells). One part
>> of that diagram, contains the memory portion that keeps the
>> training information for future infections, for when
>> production of specific antibodies is required. This is how
>> the body is "faster off the mark, the second time".
>>
>> Now, if you compare the two diagrams, you can see the scientists
>> kinda "dissed" the non-specialty part of the diagram. The first
>> diagram does a terrible job of representing the immune system
>> response. When all I had was the first diagram, I was kinda scratching
>> my head what they had in mind. The second diagram, bottom half, is
>> crystal by comparison.
>>
>>     Paul
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> I will give your that an mRNA therapy acts some
> what like a vaccine.
>
> But mRNA Therapy still lacks the inclusion of some
> or all the culprit so your body can create it's
> own antibodies against the culprit.  Not the
> fake ones mRNA Therapy jabs create and don't
> stick around.  This is why it is not a vaccine.
> Vaccine like, maybe.

You lack anything resembling a clue.

The proteins the mRNA vaccine instructs your body to produce create an
immune response.

The proteins disappear, but the immune system has learned the response
and that doesn't fade.

>
> mRNA therapy is fascinating stuff for sure. But
> it has a very bad track record.
>
> I saw a documentary on how the immune system works
> a few years ago.  I don't remember what it was
> called, but a layman's descriptions would be that a
> virus is covered with a bunch of locks (like door
> locks).  The immune system tries to pick these
> locks by trying trillions and trillions of keys
> in the lock holes.  Once it find a match, it leave
> the key in the lock with a flag on its end.  Then
> they immune system opens up a YUGE can of woop
> ass on whatever is attached to the flags.

Not quite.

The immune system responds to a virus by creating antibodies which bind
to the proteins on the surface of a virus that the virus uses to lock
onto the cells in the body.

If the person survives the infection, the immune system remembers the
formula for the antibodies and is able to much more rapidly produce them
if the same virus ever tries to gain a foothold in that person again.
>
> The current two jobs mRNA Therapy only artificially
> creates two flags.  And they don't stick around.

The mRNA vaccines just create the proteins that the immune system needs
to learn to recognize and make antibodies against.

That "knowledge" is retained in just the same way as if those proteins
were actually part of a whole virus.

> And some folks bodies actually attack the therapy,
> sometimes killing the human.  And other failed mRNA
> attempts have had to be shutdown due to the therapy
> creating Antibody Enhancement Dependance or ADE (what
> a weird name), meaning your body loses the ability
> to create its  own  antibodies against the intended
> target of the therapy.  Which mean you are a dead
> man walking.

Cite please. I'm betting you read it from somewhere that hasn't got a
scintilla of science behind it.

>
> I sincerely hope ADE somehow does not kick in on
> this one, like it has on previous ones and kills
> millions.  And if it does start to kick in, if
> someone can come up with some kind of booster one
> every years for life for ADE victims.
>
> I would not want to be in the shoes of the folks
> who pushed out this untested therapy on humans
> in a mass clinical trial.  The choice was to
> rush it out and potential save a bunch of folks
> whilst risking the consequences of not testing or
> wait and watch a bunch of folks die.
>
> 18 months from now, we will know.  I hope you are
> still around my friend.  If not, I am going to
> repeat my threat of digging you up and making
> you answer my Windows questions!
>
> Paul, I can not tell you how much I want to be
> wrong and everyone with the jab turns out okay.
> Oh my God I hope I am wrong.

On 03/08/2021 06:35, T wrote:
> On 8/2/21 5:18 PM, Paul wrote:
>> T wrote:
>>> On 8/1/21 6:26 PM, boB wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2021 09:17:30 -0400, Rabid Roach <rabid@roa.ch> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> But nospamipedia and its infinite wealth of knowledge told me the
>>>>> vaccines are safe!
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-9480051/Medical-student-21-died-day-getting-J-J-vaccine.html>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/39-year-old-dies-after-astrazeneca-vaccine-a-second-dose-following-sinovac>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.the-sun.com/news/2305200/doctor-dies-36-others-develop-rare-blood-disorder-vaccines/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.chiangraitimes.com/thailand-national-news/woman-dies-after-second-vaccine-dose-under-mix-and-match-program/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://globalnews.ca/news/7835081/alberta-woman-death-astrazeneca-covid-vaccine/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://greekreporter.com/2021/06/18/greek-woman-dies-after-second-pfizer-vaccine/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Had these people never gotten the vaccine, they would still be alive
>>>>> today. But remember to do the right thing and get vaccinated, people!
>>>>>
>>>>> NOSPAMIPEDIA DEMANDS IT!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Vaccines are MUCH safer than getting Covid.
>>>
>>> It is not a vaccine.  It is an mRNA Therapy
>>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>>>
>>> Do you have any current data on your above
>>> statement?  Or are you just sharing your opinion?
>>>
>>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>>> now very low.
>>>
>>> I would love to see the comparison of death rates
>>> between "from" (NOT WITH) the commie flu and
>>> from the jab.
>>>
>>> So far in the states, over 4000 have been reported
>>> to have died from the jab, with an estimate of only
>>> about 13% reporting.
>>>
>>> Also, mRNA therapies have shown a lot of
>>> Antibody Dependent Enhancement (ADE) in the
>>> past and there have not been a long enough
>>> time period.  And this inofrmatino is not beinf
>>
>> It's a vaccine.
>>
>> Part of the job of the WHO, is to try to encourage
>> common terminologies.
>>
>> World Health Organization website:
>>
>> https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/vaccines-and-immunization-what-is-vaccination?adgroupsurvey={adgroupsurvey}&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI0oS-u6mN8gIV9XNvBB0StQshEAAYASAAEgJNXfD_BwE
>>
>>
>>    "What is vaccination?
>>
>>     Vaccines train your immune system to create antibodies,
>>     just as it does when it is exposed to a disease."
>>
>> *******
>>
>> The diagram each scientist produces, is a measure of
>> his or her interests.
>>
>> This first diagram, concentrates on the initial "cell-hijacking"
>> method of producing loose S-protein which has encoded, a modified
>> limited section of spike protein. (One of the amino acids is replaced
>> with an analog of it, to avoid some side effect they knew about in
>> advance. The spike protein also has other edits done to it. The
>> proprietary
>> vaccines have already been reverse-engineered by others, so the
>> exact sequence is known.)
>>
>> https://media.springernature.com/lw685/springer-static/image/art%3A10.1007%2Fs40588-021-00162-y/MediaObjects/40588_2021_162_Fig2_HTML.png?as=webp
>>
>>
>> ( https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s40588-021-00162-y.pdf )
>>
>> *******
>>
>> This second picture, shows more of the bodily response. The bottom half
>> of the diagram, shows the various portions of the immune system being
>> trained by the S-protein.
>>
>> [Save to disk...]
>>
>> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218962/bin/medscimonit-26-e924700-g001.jpg" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218962/bin/medscimonit-26-e924700-g001.jpg
>>
>>
>> ( https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218962/ )
>>
>> You would need to do a significant amount of web searches, to
>> decode all the various pieces in the bottom section of that
>> diagram (CD4, CD8, macrophage cells, memory B cells). One part
>> of that diagram, contains the memory portion that keeps the
>> training information for future infections, for when
>> production of specific antibodies is required. This is how
>> the body is "faster off the mark, the second time".
>>
>> Now, if you compare the two diagrams, you can see the scientists
>> kinda "dissed" the non-specialty part of the diagram. The first
>> diagram does a terrible job of representing the immune system
>> response. When all I had was the first diagram, I was kinda scratching
>> my head what they had in mind. The second diagram, bottom half, is
>> crystal by comparison.
>>
>>     Paul
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> I will give your that an mRNA therapy acts some
> what like a vaccine.
>
> But mRNA Therapy still lacks the inclusion of some
> or all the culprit so your body can create it's
> own antibodies against the culprit.  Not the
> fake ones mRNA Therapy jabs create and don't
> stick around.

Do actually believe that the contents of a traditional vaccine "stick
around"? They don't. The inactive toxin or attenuated virus are broken
down and disappear from your body pretty quickly. All that's left are
the antigen-specific T-cells and memory B cells. The mRNA vaccines are
exactly the same.

> This is why it is not a vaccine.
> Vaccine like, maybe.

Wow! Your expertise and arrogance knows no bounds! So you believe you
understand the science better than the WHO regarding how to define what
is or isn't vaccine.

Your belief is wrong. All clinicians and immunologist call the COVID
jabs "vaccines" which is what they are. Without a doubt.

>
> mRNA therapy is fascinating stuff for sure. But
> it has a very bad track record.

No it doesn't. Given that it's new. You can't complain elsewhere that
it's not properly tested and then also say it has a very bad track
record. Both cannot be true.

> I saw a documentary on how the immune system works
> a few years ago.  I don't remember what it was
> called, but a layman's descriptions would be that a
> virus is covered with a bunch of locks (like door
> locks).  The immune system tries to pick these
> locks by trying trillions and trillions of keys
> in the lock holes.  Once it find a match, it leave
> the key in the lock with a flag on its end.  Then
> they immune system opens up a YUGE can of woop
> ass on whatever is attached to the flags.

Close enough. Although, the "locks" are antigens which are what the
immune system recognises as being foreign. It does this either via
innate immunity or adaptive immunity. Adaptive immunity, as the name,
suggests, changes over time and is how we respond to repeated exposures
to diseases. As a child the adaptive response is very minimal hence why
childhood diseases can be very serious. If you survive then you won't
get them again as an adult as you've developed an adaptive response to
the measles, rubella, etc virus.

This is what vaccines target: adaptive immunity. WHich is why we're so
successful at effectively getting rid of what used to be common
childhood diseases.

It doesn't matter how viral antigens are presented to the body via a
vaccine as long as they help the body to recognise the real virus later
on. Hence, why the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are real vaccines just
like the AstraZeneca and J&J ones.

> The current two jobs mRNA Therapy only artificially
> creates two flags.

False. It produces almost the whole spike protein exposing many
antigenic sites (or epitopes) to a person's immune system.

> And they don't stick around.

They never do.

> And some folks bodies actually attack the therapy,
> sometimes killing the human.

False. Unless you can show proof. Not just that someone died after
getting the vaccine, but evidence that the vaccine CAUSED the death.

Just because someone dies after eating a twinky doesn't mean the twinky
killed them, unless the twinky got stuck in their throat and they choked
to death, for example.

On 03/08/2021 06:06, T wrote:
> On 8/2/21 9:27 PM, Roger Blake wrote:
>> Do you believe the lack of long-term testing or FDA approval for these
>> mRNA therapies to be a "conspiracy theory"?
>
> Hi Rodger,
>
> No I believe it is/was a gamble. Rush something out and save
> a lot of people and risk the consequences of not testing
> or wait and lose a lot of people. It is not a position
> I'd want to be in.
>
> I look for real science papers, especially randomized clinical trials.
> Unfortunately, this issue has been
> politicized and it never should have been.
You mean like this one on the AZ/Biontech vaccine early trials prior to
licencing:
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)32661-1/fulltext

"Between April 23 and Nov 4, 2020, 23 848 participants were enrolled and
11 636 participants (7548 in the UK, 4088 in Brazil) were included in
the interim primary efficacy analysis.
[..]
Overall vaccine efficacy across both groups was 70·4% (95·8% CI
54·8–80·6; 30 [0·5%] of 5807 vs 101 [1·7%] of 5829).
[..]
There were 74 341 person-months of safety follow-up (median 3·4 months,
IQR 1·3–4·8): 175 severe adverse events occurred in 168 participants, 84
events in the ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 group and 91 in the control group."

The vaccine is clearly effective against the virus - 3x fewer cases than
the control - and had fewer severe events than the control.

>
> I reject opinion pieces, no matter how many PhD's
> they have after their names. Everyone has to follow
> the scientific method. Pulling crap out your ear does
> not qualify.

That includes you as well.

>> I would not consider accepting any type of vaccine that did not have
full
>> FDA approval at the very least.
>
> And they sometimes it takes 10 years for them to pull a
> bad one.
>
> Based on the research papers I have read, I will
> never take an mRNA Therapy jab.
That's fine as no such thing exists.

> I would consider
> a real vaccine, maybe, if they can prove it works
> and it had a good track record, like the polio
> and small pox vaccines do.
Good. Read the above clinical trial for the non-mRNA AZ vaccine.

Here's another one. Between 88-91% effectiveness of the Pfizer and AZ
vaccines across the population of Scotland; 1.3m people.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00677-2/fulltext

"Mass roll-out of the first doses of the BNT162b2 mRNA and ChAdOx1
vaccines was associated with substantial reductions in the risk of
hospital admission due to COVID-19 in Scotland. "

> My biggest gripe about all this is the withholding
> of information by the Gleichschaltung crowd. Folks
> need to make an informed decision. My body; my
> choice.

You're not making an informed choice by only reaading things that
support your personal bias.

> Some of the information being withheld from the
> public: Randomized Clinical Trials on both
> Ivermectin and Yu Peng Feng (Jade Wind Screen).

Nothing's withheld:
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2777389
"The findings do not support the use of ivermectin for treatment of mild
COVID-19"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34181716/
"Conclusions: In comparison to SOC or placebo, IVM did not reduce
all-cause mortality, length of stay or viral clearance in RCTs in
COVID-19 patients with mostly mild disease. IVM did not have an effect
on AEs or severe AEs. IVM is not a viable option to treat COVID-19
patients."

A meta-analysis (the absolute gold standard in clinical research) of
many treatment combinations (incl. ivermectin).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8126885/
"The network meta-analysis showed in terms of all-cause mortality, when
compared to SC (standard care) or placebo, only corticosteroids
significantly reduced the mortality rate (RR 0.90, 95%CI 0.83, 0.97;
moderate certainty of evidence)."

Clinical trial registration of YPF:
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04668222
"Recruitment Status: Not yet recruiting"

The closest thing I could find re Chinese medicine was this dubious
"COVID-19" case report of a three-person family.
https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s11684-020-0757-x.pdf

I say dubious as 2/3 didn't test positive for COVID and had symptoms
which weren't consistent COVID (e.g. vomiting and diarrhea). They were
hospitalised in an isolation ward. The COVID case had different and
milder symptoms. All three were treated with standard medical care as
well as self-administered herbal treatments so there's no evidence to
support that the Chinese medicine had any effect.

> As far as the "conspiracy theory" crowd goes,
> it is sad they they are not following science on
> this.

You definitely aren't.

> And for those that have politicize this,
> they probably have done multiples more damage
> than the tinfoil hat crowd. They do not
> follow science either, but claim that they do.
> Trofim Lysenko was political hack, not a scientist.
>
> And Gleichschaltung is evil.

And you're a devotee of Godwin. Argument lost.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>It is not a vaccine. It is an mRNA Therapy
>(the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.

It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
do. It's a vaccine.

>I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>now very low.

The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
up.
>
>I would love to see the comparison of death rates
>between "from" (NOT WITH) the commie flu and
>from the jab.

Hundreds of thousands of deaths from COVID. Handfuls (if any) from the
vaccine. Not remotely comparable.

--
Tim Slattery
tim <at> risingdove <dot> com

In article <20210803002405@news.eternal-september.org>, Roger Blake
<rogblake@iname.invalid> wrote:

> > the big problem is that a lot of people believe conspiracy theories and
> > quack doctors and reject reality.
>
> Do you believe the lack of long-term testing or FDA approval for these
> mRNA therapies to be a "conspiracy theory"?

both mrna and non-mrna covid vaccines have gone through full phase i,
ii & iii trials, beginning roughly 18 months ago when sars-cov-2 was
first sequenced, and with more volunteers than usual.

so far, more than 4 billion jabs worldwide have been administered, with
negligible side effects, certainly far less than actual covid.

the conspiracy theories to which i refer include that the vaccines
contain poison (the latest one), they make people magnetic, that
information about covid and treatments are being withheld, that it's a
secret bioweapon to overthrow the government, etc.

> I would not consider accepting any type of vaccine that did not have full
> FDA approval at the very least.

that's expected as soon as next month.

it's also doesn't matter, since it does not affect safety in any way.

<https://vaccine.unchealthcare.org/science/vaccine-approval/whats-the-di
fference-between-fda-emergency-use-authorization-and-fda-approval/>
In a public health emergency, manufacturing and approval of
vaccines can be streamlined through an Emergency Use Authorization
or EUA. An EUA does not affect vaccine safety, because it does not
impact development, such as research, clinical studies and the
studying of side effects and adverse reactions. Instead, it speeds
up manufacturing and administrative processes

In article <seaitk$thg$1@dont-email.me>, <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> No I believe it is/was a gamble. Rush something out and save
> a lot of people and risk the consequences of not testing
> or wait and lose a lot of people. It is not a position
> I'd want to be in.

it was not rushed. it went through full phase i, ii & iii trials, as
any other vaccine or medication would have.

the only difference was that the manufacturers took a *financial* risk
and started manufacturing doses *before* knowing whether the vaccines
would be safe and effective.

had the trials failed, the doses would have been discarded and the
companies would have taken a loss.

as it turned out, the vaccines are safe and effective, so that bet paid
off.

there was *no* safety risk to people.

> I look for real science papers, especially randomized clinical trials.

except that you don't. you even say below that you reject papers
written by those with phds.

> Unfortunately, this issue has been
> politicized and it never should have been.

that part is true, including by you.

> I reject opinion pieces, no matter how many PhD's
> they have after their names. Everyone has to follow
> the scientific method. Pulling crap out your ear does
> not qualify.

you reject anything that doesn't match your opinion.

> > I would not consider accepting any type of vaccine that did not have full
> > FDA approval at the very least.
>
> And they sometimes it takes 10 years for them to pull a
> bad one.

problems with vaccines show up within a few months, usually within days.

it's never taken 10 years to 'pull a bad one'.

it has taken 10 years to develop a vaccine, but that was with older
technology.

> Based on the research papers I have read, I will
> never take an mRNA Therapy jab. I would consider
> a real vaccine, maybe, if they can prove it works
> and it had a good track record, like the polio
> and small pox vaccines do.

they have proven it works, but if you are worried about mrna, there are
several covid vaccines that are not mrna.

> My biggest gripe about all this is the withholding
> of information by the Gleichschaltung crowd. Folks
> need to make an informed decision. My body; my
> choice.

yet you are against a woman having a choice what to do with her body
with respect to a pregnancy. you can't have it both ways.

the other problem is that your choice to not get a covid vaccine only
helps to further the spread of covid, which puts *other* people at
risk. your choice, *their* bodies.

> Some of the information being withheld from the
> public: Randomized Clinical Trials on both
> Ivermectin and Yu Peng Feng (Jade Wind Screen).

nothing is being withheld, and you claim to look for science, yet you
advocate herbal supplements??

> As far as the "conspiracy theory" crowd goes,
> it is sad they they are not following science on
> this.

what's sad is that people believe crazy conspiracy theories that are
easily disproven rather than actual science.

> And for those that have politicize this,
> they probably have done multiples more damage
> than the tinfoil hat crowd. They do not
> follow science either, but claim that they do.
> Trofim Lysenko was political hack, not a scientist.
>
> And Gleichschaltung is evil.

you claim to not want to politicize things, yet you do exactly that.

In article <seakil$gvd$1@dont-email.me>, <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>
> I will give your that an mRNA therapy acts some
> what like a vaccine.

it's not acting.

it *is* a vaccine. full. stop.

> But mRNA Therapy still lacks the inclusion of some
> or all the culprit so your body can create it's
> own antibodies against the culprit. Not the
> fake ones mRNA Therapy jabs create and don't
> stick around. This is why it is not a vaccine.
> Vaccine like, maybe.

there is nothing fake about the antibodies and they do stick around.

> mRNA therapy is fascinating stuff for sure. But
> it has a very bad track record.

actually, it has a very good track record.

> I saw a documentary on how the immune system works
> a few years ago. I don't remember what it was
> called, but a layman's descriptions would be that a
> virus is covered with a bunch of locks (like door
> locks). The immune system tries to pick these
> locks by trying trillions and trillions of keys
> in the lock holes. Once it find a match, it leave
> the key in the lock with a flag on its end. Then
> they immune system opens up a YUGE can of woop
> ass on whatever is attached to the flags.

that sounds like something intended for children.

> The current two jobs mRNA Therapy only artificially
> creates two flags. And they don't stick around.
> And some folks bodies actually attack the therapy,
> sometimes killing the human.

nope.

> And other failed mRNA
> attempts have had to be shutdown due to the therapy
> creating Antibody Enhancement Dependance or ADE (what
> a weird name), meaning your body loses the ability
> to create its own antibodies against the intended
> target of the therapy. Which mean you are a dead
> man walking.

there is no ade (link in another post).

> I sincerely hope ADE somehow does not kick in on
> this one, like it has on previous ones and kills
> millions. And if it does start to kick in, if
> someone can come up with some kind of booster one
> every years for life for ADE victims.

it doesn't work that way.

> I would not want to be in the shoes of the folks
> who pushed out this untested therapy on humans
> in a mass clinical trial. The choice was to
> rush it out and potential save a bunch of folks
> whilst risking the consequences of not testing or
> wait and watch a bunch of folks die.

nope. it's been extensively tested, having gone through full phase i,
ii & iii trials. nothing has been rushed.

> 18 months from now, we will know. I hope you are
> still around my friend. If not, I am going to
> repeat my threat of digging you up and making
> you answer my Windows questions!
>
> Paul, I can not tell you how much I want to be
> wrong and everyone with the jab turns out okay.
> Oh my God I hope I am wrong.

no worries. you are wrong. very, very wrong.

In article <seb547$spi$1@dont-email.me>, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com>
wrote:

> > I would not want to be in the shoes of the folks
> > who pushed out this untested therapy on humans
> > in a mass clinical trial.
>
> They are not untested. Each vaccine was tested on thousands of people
> before being licenced. No less than normal. One big difference this time
> around was with patient recruitment which is usually quite slow.
> Normally it can take months to get the right number of volunteers. With
> COVID ppl very rapidly volunteered so trials could start right away.

that, and because covid was spreading so rapidly, it didn't take long
to reach the endpoint of the trial.

On 8/3/21 7:59 AM, Tim Slattery wrote:
> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>
>> It is not a vaccine. It is an mRNA Therapy
>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>
> It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
> do. It's a vaccine.

Hi Tim,

You are being lied to. It is not a vaccine as it does
not contain any part of the virus. It also does not
train your immune system. It attempts to replace
a function of it tricking your immune system into producing
antibodies that disappear in a year or less. Your
body DOES NOT have the information to do it itself
afterwards. With a real vaccine, your body does
remember and does have the tools.

The effect of the mRNA therapy is
temporary. And if Antibody Dependent Enhancement
(ADE) kicks in, as it has very often with other mRNA
therapies, you will not be able to produce your own
antibodies to the Commie Flu and your will die.

Will it this time? We literally DO NOT KNOW.
This is a massive human trial. We will know
in 18 months.

>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>> now very low.

>
> The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
> up.

You are being lied to again. The weekly rolling death
rate is very low and 10 times lower than heart disease.

What you are being lied to about is the magnitude
of the increase. It is minor. And every country it
has gone through got past it in two weeks. And
death rates did not increase.

Oh Hospital admissions are up doubled. Ya, lets all
hide under our beds. It went up from 2 to 4!

>>
>> I would love to see the comparison of death rates
>> between "from" (NOT WITH) the commie flu and
>>from the jab.
>
> Hundreds of thousands of deaths from COVID. Handfuls (if any) from the
> vaccine. Not remotely comparable.

The data I am after is the death rates from the
vaccine versus the death rates from (NOT WITH)
the commie flow of all variants. The rolling
weekly death rates do not show any kind of
a crisis at all. They did a year ago, but
not now.

Over 4000 deaths reported from the jab with
an approximate 13% reporting rate in the
US. EVERYONE knows of someone that has had
a life threatening reaction to the the jab.
Far less that the symptoms of the actual commie
flu.

Tim, the commie flu is only dangerous to those
with a co-morbidity. We need to bend over
backwards to protect them. And not just
from the commie flu, ANY bug will kill
these people.

10 times the death rates from heart disease.
Higher death rates from auto accidents and
crime. And we obsess on the commie flu.
We need to get our priorities stright.

-T

On 2021-08-03 2:11 p.m., T wrote:
> On 8/3/21 7:59 AM, Tim Slattery wrote:
>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> It is not a vaccine.  It is an mRNA Therapy
>>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>>
>> It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
>> do. It's a vaccine.
>
> Hi Tim,
>
> You are being lied to.  It is not a vaccine as it does
> not contain any part of the virus.

It contains instructions which cause your own cells to create a protein
spike from the surface of the virus.

> It also does not
> train your immune system.

Those created proteins train your immune system;

> It attempts to replace
> a function of it tricking your immune system into producing
> antibodies that disappear in a year or less.

And WHY do they disappear? Or rather, why does the process that creates
those antibodies behave any differently than the normal immune response
which does remember how to create the antibodies again in the future?

>  Your
> body DOES NOT have the information to do it itself
> afterwards.

Why not?

> With a real vaccine, your body does
> remember and does have the tools.

What makes it different?

>
> The effect of the mRNA therapy is
> temporary.  And if Antibody Dependent Enhancement
> (ADE) kicks in, as it has very often with other mRNA
> therapies, you will not be able to produce your own
> antibodies to the Commie Flu and your will die.

Cite any example of this.

>
> Will it this time?  We literally DO NOT KNOW.
> This is a massive human trial.  We will know
> in 18 months.
>
>>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>>> now very low.
>
>>
>> The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
>> up.
>
> You are being lied to again.  The weekly rolling death
> rate is very low and 10 times lower than heart disease.

The weekly death rate is lagging a little more than a month behind the
case rate.

>
> What you are being lied to about is the magnitude
> of the increase.  It is minor.  And every country it
> has gone through got past it in two weeks.  And
> death rates did not increase.

You're wrong.

On 2021-08-03, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
> The vaccine is clearly effective against the virus - 3x fewer cases than
> the control - and had fewer severe events than the control.

That says nothing about the long-term effects.

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Blake (Posts from Google Groups killfiled due to excess spam.)

18 Reasons I won't be vaccinated -- https://tinyurl.com/ebty2dx3
Covid vaccines: experimental biology -- https://tinyurl.com/57mncfm5
The fraud of "Climate Change" -- https://RealClimateScience.com
Don't talk to cops! -- https://DontTalkToCops.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On 2021-08-03, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> there was *no* safety risk to people.

That is a lie. How do you know what effects they will have on the people
who have taken them in 5-10 years?

When a vaccine has full FDA approval I'll consider it. Not before.

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Blake (Posts from Google Groups killfiled due to excess spam.)

18 Reasons I won't be vaccinated -- https://tinyurl.com/ebty2dx3
Covid vaccines: experimental biology -- https://tinyurl.com/57mncfm5
The fraud of "Climate Change" -- https://RealClimateScience.com
Don't talk to cops! -- https://DontTalkToCops.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In article <secbed$qrs$1@dont-email.me>, <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> >> It is not a vaccine. It is an mRNA Therapy
> >> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
> >
> > It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
> > do. It's a vaccine.
>
> Hi Tim,
>
> You are being lied to. It is not a vaccine as it does
> not contain any part of the virus. It also does not
> train your immune system. It attempts to replace
> a function of it tricking your immune system into producing
> antibodies that disappear in a year or less. Your
> body DOES NOT have the information to do it itself
> afterwards. With a real vaccine, your body does
> remember and does have the tools.

all false.

> The effect of the mRNA therapy is
> temporary. And if Antibody Dependent Enhancement
> (ADE) kicks in, as it has very often with other mRNA
> therapies, you will not be able to produce your own
> antibodies to the Commie Flu and your will die.

also false.

> Will it this time? We literally DO NOT KNOW.
> This is a massive human trial. We will know
> in 18 months.

it's already been about 18 months since phase i trials began.

since then, there have been ~4 million jabs worldwide.

what more do you think will happen in the next 18 months?

> >> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
> >> now very low.
>
> >
> > The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
> > up.
>
> You are being lied to again. The weekly rolling death
> rate is very low and 10 times lower than heart disease.

bogus comparison, and the death rate is a lagging indicator. covid
cases and hospitalizations are climbing, especially in florida, where
it's about to turn really ugly, especially since the idiot governor is
putting his political aspirations ahead of the safety of those who live
in florida.

> What you are being lied to about is the magnitude
> of the increase. It is minor.

nobody is lying and it is *not* minor.

> And every country it
> has gone through got past it in two weeks. And
> death rates did not increase.

that is *very* wrong.

> Oh Hospital admissions are up doubled. Ya, lets all
> hide under our beds. It went up from 2 to 4!

doubling of hospitalizations is a very bad indicator. florida has more
than 1000 new hospitalizations per day, continuing to break its all
time record. at the rate it's going, it will double again in about a
week.

> Over 4000 deaths reported from the jab with
> an approximate 13% reporting rate in the
> US. EVERYONE knows of someone that has had
> a life threatening reaction to the the jab.
> Far less that the symptoms of the actual commie
> flu.

no, not everyone.

almost nobody has had an adverse reaction at all, let alone a life
threatening one.

> Tim, the commie flu is only dangerous to those
> with a co-morbidity.

very much false.

> We need to bend over
> backwards to protect them.

then wear a mask, get a vaccine, socially distance and stop pushing
bogus remedies such as ivermectin and herbal supplements.

> And not just
> from the commie flu, ANY bug will kill
> these people.

nope. if that were true, they'd already be dead.

> 10 times the death rates from heart disease.
> Higher death rates from auto accidents and
> crime.

bogus comparisons. those are not contagious.

> And we obsess on the commie flu.

because it's dangerous and stop calling it that.

> We need to get our priorities stright.

you certainly do.

On 2021-08-03 6:04 p.m., nospam wrote:
> In article <secbed$qrs$1@dont-email.me>, <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>>>> It is not a vaccine. It is an mRNA Therapy
>>>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>>>
>>> It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
>>> do. It's a vaccine.
>>
>> Hi Tim,
>>
>> You are being lied to. It is not a vaccine as it does
>> not contain any part of the virus. It also does not
>> train your immune system. It attempts to replace
>> a function of it tricking your immune system into producing
>> antibodies that disappear in a year or less. Your
>> body DOES NOT have the information to do it itself
>> afterwards. With a real vaccine, your body does
>> remember and does have the tools.
>
> all false.
>
>> The effect of the mRNA therapy is
>> temporary. And if Antibody Dependent Enhancement
>> (ADE) kicks in, as it has very often with other mRNA
>> therapies, you will not be able to produce your own
>> antibodies to the Commie Flu and your will die.
>
> also false.
>
>> Will it this time? We literally DO NOT KNOW.
>> This is a massive human trial. We will know
>> in 18 months.
>
> it's already been about 18 months since phase i trials began.
>
> since then, there have been ~4 million jabs worldwide.
>
> what more do you think will happen in the next 18 months?
>
>>>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>>>> now very low.
>>
>>>
>>> The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
>>> up.
>>
>> You are being lied to again. The weekly rolling death
>> rate is very low and 10 times lower than heart disease.
>
> bogus comparison, and the death rate is a lagging indicator. covid
> cases and hospitalizations are climbing, especially in florida, where
> it's about to turn really ugly, especially since the idiot governor is
> putting his political aspirations ahead of the safety of those who live
> in florida.
>
>> What you are being lied to about is the magnitude
>> of the increase. It is minor.
>
> nobody is lying and it is *not* minor.
>
>> And every country it
>> has gone through got past it in two weeks. And
>> death rates did not increase.
>
> that is *very* wrong.
>
>> Oh Hospital admissions are up doubled. Ya, lets all
>> hide under our beds. It went up from 2 to 4!
>
> doubling of hospitalizations is a very bad indicator. florida has more
> than 1000 new hospitalizations per day, continuing to break its all
> time record. at the rate it's going, it will double again in about a
> week.
>
>
>
>> Over 4000 deaths reported from the jab with
>> an approximate 13% reporting rate in the
>> US. EVERYONE knows of someone that has had
>> a life threatening reaction to the the jab.
>> Far less that the symptoms of the actual commie
>> flu.
>
> no, not everyone.
>
> almost nobody has had an adverse reaction at all, let alone a life
> threatening one.
>
>> Tim, the commie flu is only dangerous to those
>> with a co-morbidity.
>
> very much false.
>
>> We need to bend over
>> backwards to protect them.
>
> then wear a mask, get a vaccine, socially distance and stop pushing
> bogus remedies such as ivermectin and herbal supplements.
>
>> And not just
>> from the commie flu, ANY bug will kill
>> these people.
>
> nope. if that were true, they'd already be dead.
>
>> 10 times the death rates from heart disease.
>> Higher death rates from auto accidents and
>> crime.
>
> bogus comparisons. those are not contagious.
>
>> And we obsess on the commie flu.
>
> because it's dangerous and stop calling it that.
>
>> We need to get our priorities stright.
>
> you certainly do.
>

What gutters does T grovel in to pick up all this false shit and babble
it out like an insane parrot, He has become quite demented and
dangerous. :-(

Rene

Roger Blake wrote:
> On 2021-08-03, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
>> The vaccine is clearly effective against the virus - 3x fewer cases than
>> the control - and had fewer severe events than the control.
>
> That says nothing about the long-term effects.
>

I think you're saying those vaccines I had as a kid,
will now kick in to grow a third eyeball ?

All I can say is: Neat.

"I ain't superstitious.
Black cat crossed my trail.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqpclYuZabs

Paul

On 8/3/21 7:06 PM, Paul wrote:
> Roger Blake wrote:
>> On 2021-08-03, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> The vaccine is clearly effective against the virus - 3x fewer cases
>>> than the control - and had fewer severe events than the control.
>>
>> That says nothing about the long-term effects.
>>
>
> I think you're saying those vaccines I had as a kid,
> will now kick in to grow a third eyeball ?
>
> All I can say is:  Neat.
>
> "I ain't superstitious.
>  Black cat crossed my trail.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqpclYuZabs
>
>    Paul

Oh come on Paul. That is not what he is talking
about. He is talking about the long term side
effects of the therapy, such as Antibody Dependent Enhancement.

And that polio vaccine you took as a kid was fully
tested before it rolled out. This mRNA terapy
was not.

On 8/3/21 3:57 PM, Roger Blake wrote:
> On 2021-08-03, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>> there was *no* safety risk to people.
>
> That is a lie. How do you know what effects they will have on the people
> who have taken them in 5-10 years?
>
> When a vaccine has full FDA approval I'll consider it. Not before.
>

1+. An outright lie.

Not to mention the 4000 and possibly 10 times that
many in the US that died from therapy already.

On 8/3/21 2:11 PM, T wrote:
> On 8/3/21 7:59 AM, Tim Slattery wrote:
>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> It is not a vaccine.  It is an mRNA Therapy
>>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>>
>> It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
>> do. It's a vaccine.
>
> Hi Tim,
>
> You are being lied to.  It is not a vaccine as it does
> not contain any part of the virus.  It also does not
> train your immune system.  It attempts to replace
> a function of it tricking your immune system into producing
> antibodies that disappear in a year or less.  Your
> body DOES NOT have the information to do it itself
> afterwards.  With a real vaccine, your body does
> remember and does have the tools.
>
> The effect of the mRNA therapy is
> temporary.  And if Antibody Dependent Enhancement
> (ADE) kicks in, as it has very often with other mRNA
> therapies, you will not be able to produce your own
> antibodies to the Commie Flu and your will die.
>
> Will it this time?  We literally DO NOT KNOW.
> This is a massive human trial.  We will know
> in 18 months.
>
>>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>>> now very low.
>
>>
>> The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
>> up.
>
> You are being lied to again.  The weekly rolling death
> rate is very low and 10 times lower than heart disease.
>
> What you are being lied to about is the magnitude
> of the increase.  It is minor.  And every country it
> has gone through got past it in two weeks.  And
> death rates did not increase.
>
> Oh Hospital admissions are up doubled.  Ya, lets all
> hide under our beds.  It went up from 2 to 4!
>
>>>
>>> I would love to see the comparison of death rates
>>> between "from" (NOT WITH) the commie flu and
>>> from the jab.
>>
>> Hundreds of thousands of deaths from COVID. Handfuls (if any) from the
>> vaccine. Not remotely comparable.
>
> The data I am after is the death rates from the
> vaccine versus the death rates from (NOT WITH)
> the commie flow of all variants.  The rolling
> weekly death rates do not show any kind of
> a crisis at all.  They did a year ago, but
> not now.
>
> Over 4000 deaths reported from the jab with
> an approximate 13% reporting rate in the
> US.  EVERYONE knows of someone that has had
> a life threatening reaction to the the jab.
> Far less that the symptoms of the actual commie
> flu.
>
> Tim, the commie flu is only dangerous to those
> with a co-morbidity.  We need to bend over
> backwards to protect them.  And not just
> from the commie flu, ANY bug will kill
> these people.
>
> 10 times the death rates from heart disease.
> Higher death rates from auto accidents and
> crime.  And we obsess on the commie flu.
> We need to get our priorities stright.
>
> -T

Hi Paul,

Accidentally lost your Ad Hominem attack.
My main references are from

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

-T

On 2021-08-03 10:49 p.m., T wrote:
> On 8/3/21 3:57 PM, Roger Blake wrote:
>> On 2021-08-03, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>>> there was *no* safety risk to people.
>>
>> That is a lie. How do you know what effects they will have on the people
>> who have taken them in 5-10 years?
>>
>> When a vaccine has full FDA approval I'll consider it. Not before.
>>
>
> 1+.  An outright lie.
>
> Not to mention the 4000 and possibly 10 times that
> many in the US that died from therapy already.
>

Cites please!

On 2021-08-03 10:48 p.m., T wrote:
> On 8/3/21 7:06 PM, Paul wrote:
>> Roger Blake wrote:
>>> On 2021-08-03, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> The vaccine is clearly effective against the virus - 3x fewer cases
>>>> than the control - and had fewer severe events than the control.
>>>
>>> That says nothing about the long-term effects.
>>>
>>
>> I think you're saying those vaccines I had as a kid,
>> will now kick in to grow a third eyeball ?
>>
>> All I can say is:  Neat.
>>
>> "I ain't superstitious.
>>   Black cat crossed my trail.
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqpclYuZabs
>>
>>     Paul
>
> Oh come on Paul.  That is not what he is talking
> about.  He is talking about the long term side
> effects of the therapy, such as Antibody Dependent Enhancement.
>
> And that polio vaccine you took as a kid was fully
> tested before it rolled out.  This mRNA terapy
> was not.
>

Ummmm... ...no.

Actually, you wrong.

On 2021-08-03 10:51 p.m., T wrote:
> On 8/3/21 2:11 PM, T wrote:
>> On 8/3/21 7:59 AM, Tim Slattery wrote:
>>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> It is not a vaccine.  It is an mRNA Therapy
>>>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>>>
>>> It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
>>> do. It's a vaccine.
>>
>> Hi Tim,
>>
>> You are being lied to.  It is not a vaccine as it does
>> not contain any part of the virus.  It also does not
>> train your immune system.  It attempts to replace
>> a function of it tricking your immune system into producing
>> antibodies that disappear in a year or less.  Your
>> body DOES NOT have the information to do it itself
>> afterwards.  With a real vaccine, your body does
>> remember and does have the tools.
>>
>> The effect of the mRNA therapy is
>> temporary.  And if Antibody Dependent Enhancement
>> (ADE) kicks in, as it has very often with other mRNA
>> therapies, you will not be able to produce your own
>> antibodies to the Commie Flu and your will die.
>>
>> Will it this time?  We literally DO NOT KNOW.
>> This is a massive human trial.  We will know
>> in 18 months.
>>
>>>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>>>> now very low.
>>
>>>
>>> The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
>>> up.
>>
>> You are being lied to again.  The weekly rolling death
>> rate is very low and 10 times lower than heart disease.
>>
>> What you are being lied to about is the magnitude
>> of the increase.  It is minor.  And every country it
>> has gone through got past it in two weeks.  And
>> death rates did not increase.
>>
>> Oh Hospital admissions are up doubled.  Ya, lets all
>> hide under our beds.  It went up from 2 to 4!
>>
>>>>
>>>> I would love to see the comparison of death rates
>>>> between "from" (NOT WITH) the commie flu and
>>>> from the jab.
>>>
>>> Hundreds of thousands of deaths from COVID. Handfuls (if any) from the
>>> vaccine. Not remotely comparable.
>>
>> The data I am after is the death rates from the
>> vaccine versus the death rates from (NOT WITH)
>> the commie flow of all variants.  The rolling
>> weekly death rates do not show any kind of
>> a crisis at all.  They did a year ago, but
>> not now.
>>
>> Over 4000 deaths reported from the jab with
>> an approximate 13% reporting rate in the
>> US.  EVERYONE knows of someone that has had
>> a life threatening reaction to the the jab.
>> Far less that the symptoms of the actual commie
>> flu.
>>
>> Tim, the commie flu is only dangerous to those
>> with a co-morbidity.  We need to bend over
>> backwards to protect them.  And not just
>> from the commie flu, ANY bug will kill
>> these people.
>>
>> 10 times the death rates from heart disease.
>> Higher death rates from auto accidents and
>> crime.  And we obsess on the commie flu.
>> We need to get our priorities stright.
>>
>> -T
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> Accidentally lost your Ad Hominem attack.
> My main references are from
>
>     pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Not good enough by half.

On 8/3/21 10:51 PM, T wrote:
> Hi Paul,
>
> Accidentally lost your Ad Hominem attack.
> My main references are from
>
>     pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
>
> -T

Woops. The Ad Hominem attack was Rene, not Paul.
Sorry Paul.

:'(

-T

T wrote:
> On 8/3/21 2:11 PM, T wrote:
>> On 8/3/21 7:59 AM, Tim Slattery wrote:
>>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> It is not a vaccine. It is an mRNA Therapy
>>>> (the "Jab") being mischaracterized as a vaccine.
>>>
>>> It trains your immune system to attack the virus. That's what vaccines
>>> do. It's a vaccine.
>>
>> Hi Tim,
>>
>> You are being lied to. It is not a vaccine as it does
>> not contain any part of the virus. It also does not
>> train your immune system. It attempts to replace
>> a function of it tricking your immune system into producing
>> antibodies that disappear in a year or less. Your
>> body DOES NOT have the information to do it itself
>> afterwards. With a real vaccine, your body does
>> remember and does have the tools.
>>
>> The effect of the mRNA therapy is
>> temporary. And if Antibody Dependent Enhancement
>> (ADE) kicks in, as it has very often with other mRNA
>> therapies, you will not be able to produce your own
>> antibodies to the Commie Flu and your will die.
>>
>> Will it this time? We literally DO NOT KNOW.
>> This is a massive human trial. We will know
>> in 18 months.
>>
>>>> I ask, because death rate for the commie flu are
>>>> now very low.
>>
>>>
>>> The Delta variant is ramping up. Hospital admissions and deaths are
>>> up.
>>
>> You are being lied to again. The weekly rolling death
>> rate is very low and 10 times lower than heart disease.
>>
>> What you are being lied to about is the magnitude
>> of the increase. It is minor. And every country it
>> has gone through got past it in two weeks. And
>> death rates did not increase.
>>
>> Oh Hospital admissions are up doubled. Ya, lets all
>> hide under our beds. It went up from 2 to 4!
>>
>>>>
>>>> I would love to see the comparison of death rates
>>>> between "from" (NOT WITH) the commie flu and
>>>> from the jab.
>>>
>>> Hundreds of thousands of deaths from COVID. Handfuls (if any) from the
>>> vaccine. Not remotely comparable.
>>
>> The data I am after is the death rates from the
>> vaccine versus the death rates from (NOT WITH)
>> the commie flow of all variants. The rolling
>> weekly death rates do not show any kind of
>> a crisis at all. They did a year ago, but
>> not now.
>>
>> Over 4000 deaths reported from the jab with
>> an approximate 13% reporting rate in the
>> US. EVERYONE knows of someone that has had
>> a life threatening reaction to the the jab.
>> Far less that the symptoms of the actual commie
>> flu.
>>
>> Tim, the commie flu is only dangerous to those
>> with a co-morbidity. We need to bend over
>> backwards to protect them. And not just
>> from the commie flu, ANY bug will kill
>> these people.
>>
>> 10 times the death rates from heart disease.
>> Higher death rates from auto accidents and
>> crime. And we obsess on the commie flu.
>> We need to get our priorities stright.
>>
>> -T
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> Accidentally lost your Ad Hominem attack.
> My main references are from
>
> pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
>
> -T

Who are you replying to ???

I can't tell where that comment is intended to go.

On my newsreader, it looks like you're replying to yourself,
but that probably wasn't what you had in mind.

Paul

>> Hi Paul,
>>
>> Accidentally lost your Ad Hominem attack.
>> My main references are from
>>
>>     pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
>>
>> -T
>
> Who are you replying to ???
>
> I can't tell where that comment is intended to go.
>
> On my newsreader, it looks like you're replying to yourself,
> but that probably wasn't what you had in mind.
>
>    Paul

That was to Rene. I accidentally put your name down.

Roger Blake <rogblake@iname.invalid> wrote:
> On 2021-08-03, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
>> The vaccine is clearly effective against the virus - 3x fewer cases than
>> the control - and had fewer severe events than the control.
>
> That says nothing about the long-term effects.

Given that all vaccines are supremely safe and have no long term effects,
occam's razor suggests that COVID is no different.

The long term effects of COVID are already known and can be really bad for
many.
https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/post-covid-syndrome-long-covid/