On 05 Apr 2024, MRO said the following...
MR> anyways, having these people created huge problems unless they somehow
MR> got them away from other people and got them in a cushy position with
MR> little interaction with others.

reminds me of the thing they do in japan.. it's shameful to fire full employees (in a sense you failed them, they didn't fail you). they move their
offices, hide them away in hopes they quit or whatever.. so they end up
with employees who hang out and do nothing all day.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/25 (Windows/32)
* Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: fusion to MRO on Fri Apr 05 2024 10:37 am

fu> reminds me of the thing they do in japan.. it's shameful to fire full
fu> employees (in a sense you failed them, they didn't fail you). they move
fu> their offices, hide them away in hopes they quit or whatever.. so they end
fu> up with employees who hang out and do nothing all day.

That reminds me of some things I was reading a while ago on Japanese culture, talking about the work culture in Japan and how a lot of people stay at the office for long hours each workday. One thing I read was that a lot of people actually don't get a whole lot of work done (and partly because there isn't always enough work to be busy the whole time you're there), but in Japan it's important just to be seen at the office because it shows you're dedicated to the company.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

-=> Nightfox wrote to fusion <=-

Ni> That reminds me of some things I was reading a while ago on Japanese
Ni> culture, talking about the work culture in Japan and how a lot of
Ni> people stay at the office for long hours each workday.

I worked in tech for years, and one of the things that drove me crazy
were people who worked late.

There was a lot of hero worship around the "rock stars" who worked late
into the evening. I came in early, got a couple of hours of work in
before they'd show up, then leave at a normal time.

The Rock Stars would come in at 11, work an hour, then take a lunch.
Work until 7pm, then take that company sponsored dinner break for
anyone working late. Go back to work around 8:30pm, leave around 10 or
11. I don't know how much work got done after dinner.

All the while, they'd complain that the friday pastries/bagels/etc.
were gone by the time *they* got in, and complain when there weren't
charging spots open when they drove in right before noon.

They were the smart ones - they ended up working the same amount of
hours as me, with free dinner thrown in.

.... Apotheosis was the beginning before the beginning.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
� Synchronet � .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Sat Apr 06 2024 09:56 am

> There was a lot of hero worship around the "rock stars" who worked late
> into the evening. I came in early, got a couple of hours of work in

I was a "rock star" for a while at a past job.. My issue, though, was that I
couldn't get any actual work done while in the office because of either
meetings or just constant "drive-by"s that want to chat about weekend plans or
whatever. If I had to come in to the office, I liked to get there around 4 or
5am when nobody would be there for hours. I would get a bunch of work done,
then when people came in we'd have our meetings, then I would just go home at
lunch time :).

---
■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io

> I worked in tech for years, and one of the things that drove me crazy
> were people who worked late.

Same. Difference where I worked was they didn't get any of those
additional benefits you mentioned (like the dinner break) and I never heard
them complaining about food being gone. Instead, they'd complain when no
one showed up for their 5pm (or later) meetings.

Although a few were "rock stars" in the sense that they were good at what
they did, most of them were what I called "late-ees" who didn't seem to get
a whole lot done during regular business hours. IMHO, they were not
capable of keeping regular hours. They got just enough done to keep their
job, and those were the ones that complained the most.

* SLMR 2.1a * "It's a great asset... more inflation." - Joe Biden
---
� Synchronet � CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP

-=> phigan wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

ph> I was a "rock star" for a while at a past job.. My issue, though, was
ph> that I couldn't get any actual work done while in the office because of
ph> either meetings or just constant "drive-by"s that want to chat about
ph> weekend plans or whatever. If I had to come in to the office, I liked
ph> to get there around 4 or 5am when nobody would be there for hours. I
ph> would get a bunch of work done, then when people came in we'd have our
ph> meetings, then I would just go home at lunch time :).

Oddly enough, at my last open office job, the culture was the opposite.
We had phone booths for phone calls, and most people would send me a
slack message instead of walking up to my desk. It made for an
amazingly quiet environment that you could meet in a room if you wanted
to.

Other open offices were loud, drive by-ridden environments, even though
we had open spaces for people to meet.

Now, I'm in California, my boss is in Boston, the headquarters is in
Houston and the main office is in Paris. All I need to deal with here
is walking dogs and urgent IT requests from my wife when she's also
WFH. :)

.... There are secrets within lies, answers within riddles.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
� Synchronet � .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Sat Apr 06 2024 09:56 am

PF> There was a lot of hero worship around the "rock stars" who worked late
PF> into the evening. I came in early, got a couple of hours of work in before
PF> they'd show up, then leave at a normal time.

PF> The Rock Stars would come in at 11, work an hour, then take a lunch. Work
PF> until 7pm, then take that company sponsored dinner break for anyone
PF> working late. Go back to work around 8:30pm, leave around 10 or 11. I
PF> don't know how much work got done after dinner.

Even with the breaks, I'm not sure I could be at work for 11-12 hours at a time like that, especially since I'm married.. After so many hours, I start to feel like my mind isn't quite in it like it is in the morning. Also, I like to be able to have dinner at home with my wife.

PF> They were the smart ones - they ended up working the same amount of hours
PF> as me, with free dinner thrown in.

A company-paid meal would be nice. I haven't worked at a company that did that.. For about 8 years, I worked at a company that had a couple of cafes on-site, but it wasn't even discounted or anything, and many meals there cost about as much as a restaurant meal.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: phigan to poindexter FORTRAN on Sun Apr 07 2024 03:15 am

ph> I was a "rock star" for a while at a past job.. My issue, though, was that
ph> I couldn't get any actual work done while in the office because of either
ph> meetings or just constant "drive-by"s that want to chat about weekend
ph> plans or whatever. If I had to come in to the office, I liked to get there
ph> around 4 or 5am when nobody would be there for hours. I would get a bunch
ph> of work done, then when people came in we'd have our meetings, then I
ph> would just go home at lunch time :).

Yeah, for a while at a past job, I often felt like I couldn't get much work done during my usual work hours due to meetins and being interrupted every 5-10 minutes with questions about various things. At my current job (I've been there since November), I've seen some people who have days filled with meetings, and I'm nervous about my schedule becoming that way.. I don't know how some people seem to think that can be an effective way to work.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: poindexter FORTRAN to phigan on Sun Apr 07 2024 08:36 am

PF> Oddly enough, at my last open office job, the culture was the opposite. We
PF> had phone booths for phone calls, and most people would send me a slack
PF> message instead of walking up to my desk. It made for an amazingly quiet
PF> environment that you could meet in a room if you wanted to.

I wish my current workplace was more like that. There's a person who sits in a cubicle very close to mine who seems to have online meetings much of the day, as he's almost always talking to someone. And sometimes people stop by his cubicle to talk to him too. If he has to talk to people so much, it would be nice if he could find a conference room or have his own office with a door he can close (though I'm not sure the office building has personal office rooms). Also, his keyboard is louder than usual and I hear him typing a lot, which doesn't help.. I've been wearing headphones listening to whitenoise and music a lot to drown out the noise so I can focus better.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Sun Apr 07 2024 01:57 pm

> PF> hours as me, with free dinner thrown in.
>
> A company-paid meal would be nice. I haven't worked at a company that did
> that.. For about 8 years, I worked at a company that had a couple of cafes
> on-site, but it wasn't even discounted or anything, and many meals there
> cost about as much as a restaurant meal.
>

companies need to start thinking of workers more.
that means decent pto, give us what we need to do our jobs, and perks like free meals is nice.

there's a whole generation of kids in the workforce with ADHD, poor work habits and other issues that aren't really valuable. valuable workers should be rewarded.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

-=> Quoting Phigan to Poindexter Fortran <=-

Ph> weekend plans or whatever. If I had to come in to the office, I liked
Ph> to get there around 4 or 5am when nobody would be there for hours. I
Ph> would get a bunch of work done, then when people came in we'd have our
Ph> meetings, then I would just go home at lunch time :).

I like having a flexable schedule myself. Today I'm going into the office
for 4:30 or 5:00. I want to get my work done so I can leave early and get
hoem before the eclipse. Just because I don't want to be on the road while
the idiots smash into each other.

Shawn

.... AI programmers only think they do it
___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
---
■ Synchronet ■ _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin)

-=> Quoting Mro to Nightfox <=-

Mr> companies need to start thinking of workers more.
Mr> there's a whole generation of kids in the workforce with ADHD, poor
Mr> work habits and other issues that aren't really valuable. valuable
Mr> workers should be rewarded. -!-

I couldn't agree with you more. If companies invested in their staff just
a small bit the turn over wouldn't be so insane. Our turnover would shock
you!

I spend at least an hour a day (if not more) doing paper work for people who
are either quitting or have been terminated for not coming to work, or who
are on Modified duty / LOA.

Shawn

.... Illiterate? Write Today for Free Help.
___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
---
■ Synchronet ■ _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin)

-=> Dumas Walker wrote to POINDEXTER FORTRAN <=-

DW> Although a few were "rock stars" in the sense that they were good at
DW> what they did

Since we're talking about work tropes, I've got to add in "fire
fighters".

I work in traditional IT operations, we followed structured processes
around systems, including understanding the underlying OSes,
networking, backups, and basic systems administration.

Every once in a while we'd get a User who'd stand up a system that got
slipped into production. They usually complained that IT wasn't
responsive enough, or more likely they didn't want to pay for a proper
system.

The system they stood up would be missing some primary component of a
proper server, like redundant power supplies, redundant disks, or
network throughput wasn't considered when servicing multiple users, or
in one case was sitting on someone desk and was *stolen*.

The User would come in and work a long weekend or an all-nighter
getting the system back up and running, and send out
self-congratulatory emails to stakeholders, who didn't know any better
and held the User to high regard.

"Best way not spend weekend repairing server, build it right first
place."

-- Mr. Miyagi, on alt.sysadmin.recovery

, most of them were what I called "late-ees" who didn't
DW> seem to get a whole lot done during regular business hours. IMHO, they
DW> were not capable of keeping regular hours. They got just enough done
DW> to keep their job, and those were the ones that complained the most.

DW> * SLMR 2.1a * "It's a great asset... more inflation." - Joe Biden
DW> ---
DW> Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net *
DW> Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP

.... Apotheosis was the beginning before the beginning.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
� Synchronet � .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

-=> Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

Ni> Even with the breaks, I'm not sure I could be at work for 11-12 hours
Ni> at a time like that, especially since I'm married.. After so many
Ni> hours, I start to feel like my mind isn't quite in it like it is in the
Ni> morning. Also, I like to be able to have dinner at home with my wife.

True. These were single, 20-somethings living in the city. I was married
with a wife and a dog taking the ferry across the bay to Oakland.

Ni> A company-paid meal would be nice. I haven't worked at a company that
Ni> did that.. For about 8 years, I worked at a company that had a couple
Ni> of cafes on-site, but it wasn't even discounted or anything, and many
Ni> meals there cost about as much as a restaurant meal.

I worked at one company with discounted prices, but the nice thing was
that decent coffee and soda was available all day for free. The offices
had stale Peets and dirty Bunn coffee makers.

That's one thing I appreciate working from home - the coffee here is
excellent!

.... HUNGER GAMES = DYSTOPIA FOR DUMMIES
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
� Synchronet � .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: MRO to Nightfox on Sun Apr 07 2024 07:27 pm

MR> companies need to start thinking of workers more. that means decent pto,
MR> give us what we need to do our jobs, and perks like free meals is nice.

That would be nice. While it's good to have a good paycheck, things like PTO and other perks are good too.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

> hoem before the eclipse. Just because I don't want to be on the road while
> the idiots smash into each other.

Not a bad plan. I learned from the last one that trying to travel on the
day of a eclipse is not a good idea -- urban style traffic jams out in the
middle of nowhere. ;)

* SLMR 2.1a * Mmmmmmm, Sloppy Joes....
---
� Synchronet � CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Mon Apr 08 2024 06:47 am

PF> I worked at one company with discounted prices, but the nice thing was
PF> that decent coffee and soda was available all day for free. The offices
PF> had stale Peets and dirty Bunn coffee makers.

The company I worked at with the cafes on-site also had free soda and coffee, which was nice.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: Re: People who work late
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Dumas Walker on Mon Apr 08 2024 06:43 am

>
> DW> Although a few were "rock stars" in the sense that they were good at
> DW> what they did
> fighters".
>
> I work in traditional IT operations, we followed structured processes
> around systems, including understanding the underlying OSes,
> networking, backups, and basic systems administration.
>
> Every once in a while we'd get a User who'd stand up a system that got

thankfully the 'rock star' stuff seems to have died down.
I only found a few jobs on indeed in my region that use the term.

one is a crummy job where you have to know a lot of trades and get paid poorly.
the other is some company called inet-web and they have horrible reviews.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: Nightfox to MRO on Mon Apr 08 2024 09:11 am

> Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
> By: MRO to Nightfox on Sun Apr 07 2024 07:27 pm
>
> MR> companies need to start thinking of workers more. that means decent
> MR> pto, give us what we need to do our jobs, and perks like free meals is
> MR> nice.
>
> That would be nice. While it's good to have a good paycheck, things like
> PTO and other perks are good too.
>

i dont even like taking off a lot. but pto you can use my the hour is great. you can take off early fridays, come in late when there's bad weather or whatever.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Eclipse travel
By: Dumas Walker to TINY on Mon Apr 08 2024 08:35 am

> > hoem before the eclipse. Just because I don't want to be on the road
> > while the idiots smash into each other.
>
> Not a bad plan. I learned from the last one that trying to travel on the
> day of a eclipse is not a good idea -- urban style traffic jams out in the
> middle of nowhere. ;)
>

i was literally working outside during the eclipse. we saw a lot of people walk out of businesses and stare into the sun.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Apr 08 2024 09:22 am

> Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
> By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Mon Apr 08 2024 06:47 am
>
> PF> I worked at one company with discounted prices, but the nice thing was
> PF> that decent coffee and soda was available all day for free. The offices
> PF> had stale Peets and dirty Bunn coffee makers.
>
> The company I worked at with the cafes on-site also had free soda and
> coffee, which was nice.
>

companies could atleast have some soda machines and make soda and water a quarter.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: MRO to Nightfox on Mon Apr 08 2024 04:26 pm

MR> companies could atleast have some soda machines and make soda and water a
MR> quarter.

Many companies I've seen have water for free. I've worked at a couple companies now (including my current company) that have water fountains, and also installed filtered water dispensers above the water fountains so you can bring your own water bottle (or reusable drink cup) and fill it with water any time at no cost.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
By: Nightfox to MRO on Mon Apr 08 2024 03:03 pm

> Re: Re: HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY
> By: MRO to Nightfox on Mon Apr 08 2024 04:26 pm
>
> MR> companies could atleast have some soda machines and make soda and water
> MR> a quarter.
>
> Many companies I've seen have water for free. I've worked at a couple
> companies now (including my current company) that have water fountains, and
> also installed filtered water dispensers above the water fountains so you
> can bring your own water bottle (or reusable drink cup) and fill it with
> water any time at no cost.
>

yeah i have seen it too. not good enough.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Hello MRO!

M> i was literally working outside during the eclipse. we saw a lot of people
M> walk out of businesses and stare into the sun. -+-

they weren't wearing the proper glasses? i guess their next
trip will be to the eye doctor.

at best, there was a sliver of a crescent at my location
between 3:15 and 3:32 EDT. the sky was very cloudy but the
eclipse was visible from time to time. i have some pictures i
should post.

i viewed it in conjunction with a pinhole viewer when the sun
poked through the clouds and it was simply not safe to look
directly at the event. the results were excellent. the whole
far end of the box projected a very large portion of the sky.
the moving clouds provided a greater sense of "real time" as
they passed over the sun.

--- OpenXP 5.0.58
* Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
� Synchronet � CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP

-=> Quoting Dumas Walker to Tiny <=-

DW> Not a bad plan. I learned from the last one that trying to travel on
DW> the day of a eclipse is not a good idea -- urban style traffic jams out
DW> in the middle of nowhere. ;)

It ended up being cloudy here. Of course an hour after it the clouds all
went away and it was a beautiful sunny evening. LOL

Shawn

.... Experience is what you get when you don't get what you wanted.
___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
---
■ Synchronet ■ _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin)