On 23/09/2021 20.10, T wrote:
> On 9/23/21 2:41 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> Think of it as an enterprise environment: staff should not be able to
>> install anything, no one is admin, except the admin. That way, even
>> windows survives years with no issues.
>
> In other words, turn it into an "appliance".
>
> :-D

Yes :-D

You can also look at it as "professional setup and maintenance". Same as
nowdays nobody maintains their own car (almost nobody) but takes the car
to the mechanic, why not take the computer to the professional, huh?

Why do we expect normal people to maintain their own computers?

Even more, why do we expect normal employees to keep their work
computers secure from all kind of hackers?

They are not trained for that.

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 23/09/2021 02.39, ...w¡ñ§±¤n wrote:
>> Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>
>>> Blatant example: Acrobat. There is no current version of acrobat reader,
>>> they ceased to produce it.
>>>
>>>
>> Guess it depends on how 'current version' is defined.
>>
>> Acrobat Reader is available in Continuous or Classic track
>
> Maybe you are missing that we were not talking of the Windows version of
> acrobat reader?
>
>> Both are 'current', document cloud based.
>> The former with ongoing access to service based tools and more frequent
>> program/feature updates.
>> The latter has no access to service based tools, few if any feature
>> updates, with only security and platform updates quarterly. Occasionally
>> security updates when necessary may be released and available interim of
>> the quarter updates.  Classic is the closest to earlier 11X build.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Unfortunately when the message title was changed the first post with the
new message title, the Linux information included in the original was
discarded and leaving only the final piece of your comment(including the
Blatant Example reference)...but that same new post continued on about
Adobe Reader's Continuous Release Version etc. - which would have to be
Windows or Mac version based on the version # released on Dec 18,
2019(2019.010.20064)

Sorry to have not tracked back 8 replies earlier to the original titled
post. :)

--
....w¡ñ§±¤n

Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
> On 22/09/2021 13.45, Chris wrote:
>> Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>>> On 21/09/2021 23.39, T wrote:
>>>> On 9/21/21 1:58 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>>> On 21/09/2021 22.51, T wrote:
>>>>>> On 9/21/21 7:32 AM, RabidHussar wrote:
>>>>>>> The tax software is probably useful considering how complicated it can
>>>>>>> be to sort things out at that level but few realized that these things
>>>>>>> were eventually going to become web applications which rendered the
>>>>>>> operating system choice irrelevant.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That would make it agnostic.  And creepy as all hell
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, it is what we have in Spain ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Does it rain in the plain?  (A bad reference to a
>>>> Broadway play.)
>>>
>>> I know. I did not know the first time I heard that reference from my
>>> British aunt, and I took it literally: it does not rain mainly in the plain.
>>
>> Although, there were right when they said that in Hertford, Hereford and
>> Hampshire hurricanes hardly ever happen ;)
>>
>>>>
>>>> You give private data on line, IT WILL BE HARVESTED.
>>>> The temptation is too great, despite the laws and
>>>> what the say.  Google has done this to us.
>>>
>>> You are mistaken :-)
>>
>> Correct.
>>
>>> Basically the government here already knows, the forms are already
>>> filled with the correct data and we basically only need to sign and pay
>>> (the income tax).
>>
>> It's the government website which either already has your data or will be
>> the custodian for it anyway so the website has little to no additional
>> risk.
>
> I think the data is not actually on the web site, but on mainframes
> behind running mainframe oses and programs. The web is just an interface.

No-one has mainframes nowadays, except some of the older banks. Everything
is on servers housed in data centres or even the cloud.

But it is a moot point as if you're using a website/webserver it'll always
have to some data. I mean how else can it show you your details?

> There have been a row of hacker attacks these past month, and AFAIK,
> this service is intact. Another ministry, work and social services, was
> attacked. The web was down for days and affected for weeks, but the
> actual big machines with the actual services are intact.

Well yeah. Never make the webserver the same machine as the database
server.

Chris wrote:

>
> No-one has mainframes nowadays, except some of the older banks. Everything
> is on servers housed in data centres or even the cloud.

"In fact, 96 of the world's largest 100 banks, nine out of 10 of the
world's largest insurance companies, 23 of the 25 largest retailers
in the United States, and 71 percent of the Fortune 500 use
IBM System z mainframes. Currently, there are 10,000 mainframes
actively being used around the world."

They're not entirely eliminated.

And they're not stodgy either. I see "5.2GHz" in the text here.
And one of the pictures shows what looks like a liquid cooling
system per blade.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Z

The architecture has at least two levels of virtualization,
it has novel caching strategies, and so on. A world of its own.
Not your traditional mainframes.

Paul

On 24/09/2021 10.00, Paul wrote:
> Chris wrote:
>
>>
>> No-one has mainframes nowadays, except some of the older banks.
>> Everything
>> is on servers housed in data centres or even the cloud.
>
> "In fact, 96 of the world's largest 100 banks, nine out of 10 of the
>  world's largest insurance companies, 23 of the 25 largest retailers
>  in the United States, and 71 percent of the Fortune 500 use
>  IBM System z mainframes. Currently, there are 10,000 mainframes
>  actively being used around the world."

And governments :-)

> They're not entirely eliminated.
>
> And they're not stodgy either. I see "5.2GHz" in the text here.
> And one of the pictures shows what looks like a liquid cooling
> system per blade.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Z
>
> The architecture has at least two levels of virtualization,
> it has novel caching strategies, and so on. A world of its own.
> Not your traditional mainframes.
>
>    Paul

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

On 24/09/2021 06.11, ...w¡ñ§±¤n wrote:
> Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 23/09/2021 02.39, ...w¡ñ§±¤n wrote:
>>> Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>
>>>> Blatant example: Acrobat. There is no current version of acrobat
>>>> reader,
>>>> they ceased to produce it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Guess it depends on how 'current version' is defined.
>>>
>>> Acrobat Reader is available in Continuous or Classic track
>>
>> Maybe you are missing that we were not talking of the Windows version of
>> acrobat reader?
>>
>>> Both are 'current', document cloud based.
>>> The former with ongoing access to service based tools and more frequent
>>> program/feature updates.
>>> The latter has no access to service based tools, few if any feature
>>> updates, with only security and platform updates quarterly. Occasionally
>>> security updates when necessary may be released and available interim of
>>> the quarter updates.  Classic is the closest to earlier 11X build.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
> Unfortunately when the message title was changed the first post with the
> new message title, the Linux information included in the original was
> discarded and leaving only the final piece of your comment(including the
> Blatant Example reference)...but that same new post continued on about
> Adobe Reader's Continuous Release Version etc. - which would have to be
> Windows or Mac version based on the version # released on Dec 18,
> 2019(2019.010.20064)
>
> Sorry to have not tracked back 8 replies earlier to the original titled
> post. :)
>

:-D

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
> Chris wrote:
>
>>
>> No-one has mainframes nowadays, except some of the older banks. Everything
>> is on servers housed in data centres or even the cloud.
>
> "In fact, 96 of the world's largest 100 banks, nine out of 10 of the
> world's largest insurance companies, 23 of the 25 largest retailers
> in the United States, and 71 percent of the Fortune 500 use
> IBM System z mainframes. Currently, there are 10,000 mainframes
> actively being used around the world."
>
> They're not entirely eliminated.
>
> And they're not stodgy either. I see "5.2GHz" in the text here.
> And one of the pictures shows what looks like a liquid cooling
> system per blade.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Z
>
> The architecture has at least two levels of virtualization,
> it has novel caching strategies, and so on. A world of its own.
> Not your traditional mainframes.

Indeed not. Very impressive stuff. I doubt any of them run webservers,
though.

On 9/23/21 3:05 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> In other words, turn it into an "appliance".
>>
>> :-D
> Yes:-D
>
>
> You can also look at it as "professional setup and maintenance". Same as
> nowdays nobody maintains their own car (almost nobody) but takes the car
> to the mechanic, why not take the computer to the professional, huh?
>
> Why do we expect normal people to maintain their own computers?
>
> Even more, why do we expect normal employees to keep their work
> computers secure from all kind of hackers?
>
> They are not trained for that.

Hi Carlos,

Wonderful point. 1+

Problem with car mechanics (and computer consultants)
is everyone is suspicious of them selling them
things they don't need. (I trust mine, he is very
honest and very competent.) As a computer consultant,
you have to get past the suspicion zone and enter
the trust zone.

One of the things I have learned the hard way is to
not recommend things too soon: backup, UPS, antivirus,
PCI (Payment Card Industry), etc.. Until you are out
of the suspicion zone and into the trust zone, they
think you are trying to sell them a disgronifier.

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=disgronifier

Tip: We have wonderful thunder storm in the summer.
They frequently knock power out. Soon as power comes
back on, call them and ask them if they want your
to install UPS's on their system. You only have a
two day windows after a power outage.

I mistakenly recommended UPS's too soon to one customer
and he almost did not call me back. Well, until he lost
a computer to a power outage. Should have listened to
me, but he did not. But I got paid to redo everything
on the new computer he bought. He still does not have
UPS's. It will NEVER happen again. HAHA

I have seen folks so cheap and/or distrusting that
they just threw away their computer and did not
replace it or bought an Apple and that opens up
a whole new can of worms.

This is going to sound harsh, but one has to realize
that other judge you primarily based on their own
behavior. So if they think you are dishonest out
the door, then they are probably dishonest themselves.
It is probably best to avoid them.

Anyone need a disgronifier, oops, TMP module installed
on their computer?

:-)

-T