I finally was able to remove the top cover after I
removed the optical drive. The push button is part
of the top cover actually. So I removed it and put
everything back together but it wouldn't start.

https://postimg.cc/1fxJYJV3

https://postimg.cc/gXCqQ2JT

https://postimg.cc/Mv8mYHgc

https://postimg.cc/0zVGxfjm

https://postimg.cc/5HGwQ2w2

Maybe I wasn't depressing the plunger but I thought
I was and I tried all sorts of things to fit in. It's in a
difficult location with a shelf right over it.

So I put the push button back on and put it back together
and it started.

What I can do as an experiment if you want is take
off the top cover again and try to start it without the top
cover on so it's easier to access the plunger and see if
it starts then. Of course I'll still have to put the top
cover back on. I just need something small and I think
wooden matches would be perfect.

Another thing that worries me is if the 8500 should fail
how will I get all my bookmarks and documents to the
780? I have the mrimgs of course but those are all for the
8500 and wouldn't work on the 780. Would I copy/paste?
What about my bookmarks?

I hope I don't loose the 8500 because of this push button
issue. It's a beautiful computer in every other respect.

Thoughts/suggestions

Robert

On Wed, 9 Feb 2022 at 15:56:57, Robert in CA <magineer02@yahoo.com>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>
>I finally was able to remove the top cover after I
>removed the optical drive. The push button is part
>of the top cover actually. So I removed it and put
>everything back together but it wouldn't start.
>
>https://postimg.cc/1fxJYJV3
>
>https://postimg.cc/gXCqQ2JT

I'm _guessing_ the actual switch is the square thing with an S on it.

When you had it in that condition, did it make a slight click if you
poked it with something? Switches usually do click a little.

>
>https://postimg.cc/Mv8mYHgc
>
>https://postimg.cc/0zVGxfjm
>
>https://postimg.cc/5HGwQ2w2
>
Would I be right in guessing that the little bit of transparent plastic
with a rectangle on it, that seems to glued to the back of the round
black plastic pushbutton, is what actually presses the switch? (I can't
see what its purpose is if not.)
>
>Maybe I wasn't depressing the plunger but I thought
>I was and I tried all sorts of things to fit in. It's in a

Straightened-out then bent paperclip?

>difficult location with a shelf right over it.

I take it you mean the PC is. Can you not take it out and stand it on a
table or chair or something, even the floor? Just for checking whether
the power switch makes it come alive, it doesn't matter if things aren't
connected, like monitor or even keyboard and mouse (only the power cord,
obviously!); If you're just seeing whether it powers up, just whether
the front panel power light comes on will suffice. (If it does come on,
turn it off again - probably at the power strip, or by yanking the cord
- within a second or two, so it doesn't get as far as starting to boot.)
>
>So I put the push button back on and put it back together
>and it started.

If it does so reliably, then you're home dry (-:
>
>What I can do as an experiment if you want is take
>off the top cover again and try to start it without the top
>cover on so it's easier to access the plunger and see if

If back together as above doesn't start _reliably_, then yes, do that.
If that then _does_ start reliably, you have isolated the problem to
being somewhere in the mechanical assembly.

>it starts then. Of course I'll still have to put the top
>cover back on. I just need something small and I think
>wooden matches would be perfect.

Or a cocktail stick, pencil, ...
>
>Another thing that worries me is if the 8500 should fail
>how will I get all my bookmarks and documents to the
>780? I have the mrimgs of course but those are all for the
>8500 and wouldn't work on the 780. Would I copy/paste?
>What about my bookmarks?
>
>I hope I don't loose the 8500 because of this push button
>issue. It's a beautiful computer in every other respect.

No, we're not going to let it! At least, not if it's just a misaligned
pushbutton or faulty fifty-cent switch. (Even if you have to pay $5
including carriage for the switch, or even $30 for the whole module.)
[]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

A good pun is its own reword.

On Wed, 9 Feb 2022 at 15:54:00, Robert in CA <magineer02@yahoo.com>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>Not sure about scraping wires now since they are
>so small, and I don't want to cause more damage.

Well, let's get to the point where you are reasonably sure it isn't just
misalignment of the plastic pushbutton. If you can put it together
without the pushbutton, and poking through the hole at the switch
reliably starts it, then it _is_ the pushbutton; if not, it's either the
switch or the PSU or motherboard. Rather than scraping the wires, if you
can push the switch out of the module and the terminals are exposed, you
may be able to short them there to test - maybe even if you can get at
the back of the switch without taking it out of the module. They might
have sleeving on though. If you can get at those, and shorting them
reliably starts the PC, then the switch is at fault.
>
>Yes were talking about two different problems.
>
>1. is that its having problems powering on normally like the 780
>which always powers on and has a different kind of switch vs the
>plunger type like the 8500 has.

1. See above.

>
>2. the black out screen is intermittent and I mentioned it to Paul
>before but it was always so fast I couldn't get a picture of it but it
>wold come up before the desktop and as Paul surmised its probably
>just still loading the drivers etc. It only happens once in awhile.
>
2. Sounds as if that's not really a problem at the moment.
>
>Thanks
>Robert
John
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

still kicking, just not as high! - "c!" in alt.comp.os.windows-10, 2021-4-2

The square thing with an S on it may be the switch
but the plunger is the round white thing.

I understand it now, the button pushes the plunger
(white round thing) and the clear plastic arm of the
button pushes the switch which activates it. That's
why it didn't and won't start by just pushing the plunger
alone. That's my guess.

No, I didn't notice any click.

Yes, I could move it for tests purposes but I don't like the
idea of pulling the cord or abnormal powering off. The
computer won't like that.

Robert

I can put it together to poke through the hole but as I said the way
the push button is made with the clear plastic arm which engages
the switch the same time the plunger is pushed means it won't work
by just pushing the plunger alone.

I think I can get the switch out if needed. It's held in by clips. There's
(white, red, blue, and yellow wires attached) So which color wires would I
short? Could I use a small screwdriver to short them? You sure this isn't
going to hurt the computer?

Robert

On 2/10/2022 1:06 AM, Robert in CA wrote:
>
>
> I can put it together to poke through the hole but as I said the way
> the push button is made with the clear plastic arm which engages
> the switch the same time the plunger is pushed means it won't work
> by just pushing the plunger alone.
>
> I think I can get the switch out if needed. It's held in by clips. There's
> (white, red, blue, and yellow wires attached) So which color wires would I
> short? Could I use a small screwdriver to short them? You sure this isn't
> going to hurt the computer?

The +5V and the Resistor "R" are items on the motherboard part of the diagram.
I could probably have done a better job of drawing this.

The materials on the right of that, are part of the cable assembly.

+ -
Two wires for LED. +5 -------R---+--- LED ----------+ (mobo driver grounds to light)
| |
LEDHOT LEDDRV
| |
X X

/
/
Two wires for switch. +5 -------R---+--+ +---------+ Ground
| |
(active low signal to PCH) PWR- GND
| |
X X

Trace and see.

There should be two wires to the LED, with just a LED on the ends.

And two wires to the Switch, with just the switch on the ends of the wires.

*******

Because these are FP header wires, electrically they try to make them safe.

*******

The most dangerous wire in a PC, is the speaker that makes the beep has
a +5V supply on one leg of the speaker, with NO fuse in the path (idiots!).
If the red wire to the speaker is pinched in the door on the PC, the red
wire turns into toaster wire, until it burns off :-)

There are two kinds of speakers. There is the round piezo beeper about the
size of a quarter. It's safe for a home user. No problem there. It's
the "transistor radio speaker" two inches in diameter with the paper cone,
that has the "hot" connection on one leg. Whether any company has remedied
this oversight, I don't know. I think it's possible to do a better job
than that, but that's just me. I first read of this, in a USENET group,
a warning to "don't pinch the RED wire, OK?".

The Optiplex 780 has an amp board strapped to the speaker, and it is
"different" and is not the usual cheap implementation. There are likely
more than just two wires to that one.

Paul

I get it about 2 wires for the LEDs and 2 wires for the
switch but which is which? There's blue, white, red and
yellow wires.

Here's where we are as I understand it;

I was able to remove the top cover and tried
depressing the plunger but it would not start.

The reason is because if you look at the push
button it has a clear plastic attachment so that
when the button is depressed the plunger goes
down carrying the clear plastic piece with it
which makes contact with the switch not the
button/ plunger.

https://postimg.cc/0zVGxfjm

That's why it would not start when I depressed
the plunger because pressing the plunger does
nothing without the clear plastic piece which
activates the switch.

As far as shorting the wires I'm not sure we can
do that. If you look at the pictures they are fully
insulated and looks like they have covering on
their ends.

https://postimg.cc/gXCqQ2JT

https://postimg.cc/Mv8mYHgc

I'm also a little leery of removing the switch
assembly to do this. I don't want to damage
something that I can't fix.

My concern is the computer is running and working
now and I want to explore all other possibilities
before taking that step.

Thoughts/Suggestions?

Robert

On 2/10/2022 4:00 AM, Robert in CA wrote:
> I get it about 2 wires for the LEDs and 2 wires for the
> switch but which is which? There's blue, white, red and
> yellow wires.
>
> Here's where we are as I understand it;
>
> I was able to remove the top cover and tried
> depressing the plunger but it would not start.
>
> The reason is because if you look at the push
> button it has a clear plastic attachment so that
> when the button is depressed the plunger goes
> down carrying the clear plastic piece with it
> which makes contact with the switch not the
> button/ plunger.
>
> https://postimg.cc/0zVGxfjm
>
> That's why it would not start when I depressed
> the plunger because pressing the plunger does
> nothing without the clear plastic piece which
> activates the switch.
>
> As far as shorting the wires I'm not sure we can
> do that. If you look at the pictures they are fully
> insulated and looks like they have covering on
> their ends.
>
> https://postimg.cc/gXCqQ2JT
>
> https://postimg.cc/Mv8mYHgc
>
> I'm also a little leery of removing the switch
> assembly to do this. I don't want to damage
> something that I can't fix.
>
> My concern is the computer is running and working
> now and I want to explore all other possibilities
> before taking that step.
>
> Thoughts/Suggestions?
>
> Robert
>

The other point of leverage, is the header where it plugs
into the motherboard.

https://www.dell.com/community/XPS-Desktops/XPS-8700-does-not-power-on/td-p/7832109/page/2

In the diagram, the square pin is the keying pin and the
hole might be blocked on that pin. That might also help you
identify and verify the pin numbering mentioned on the Dell
forum thread. You can see that it's likely the blue wire is
part of the power switch.

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/3NwKcMT0/header-cable-assembly.gif

The keying pin should establish the pin numbering, and
the disagreement the participants are having on the
pin numbers which are for the power switch. But I can't tell
from that picture, how many wires are involved there,
or where they are going. It may or may not be a 2x3 group
of wires.

The pin header usually has a visible hole over each pin. The
hole exists, because the pins usually have a "lock" that
engages the hole and prevents the pin from coming out of
the shell.

That hole (or for that matter, the hole where the wire goes
into the shell), does not leave a lot of room for making
bootleg connections :-) So if you were thinking you could
get in there, that would be a real challenge. You might need
30ga wirewrap wire to get in there or something. And with
30ga, if you nick the wire while stripping it, it snaps
real easy. 26ga ww wire is more robust, but also too big
for a lot of "microscope work".

Paul

I think you an I agree even if we identify the wires to try shorting,
scrapping/stripping the wires is too risky. If you want, I can try
and remove the switch and see what all the wires are connected
to so we can at least identify them and go from there.

http://static.highspeedbackbone.net/pdf/DELL%20XPS%208500%20Desktop%20PC%20Manual.pdf

same as your link:

http://static.highspeedbackbone.net/pdf/DELL%20XPS%208500%20Desktop%20PC%20Manual.pdf

However, good news,! the computer powered on immediately. It
may be a fluke and I'll test it later today by powering it off/on again
which I normally do anyway. I'm thinking, hoping that when I removed
the push button and then put it back I realigned it so it works now. I
hope.

So for now lets just see how it works

Robert

On Thu, 10 Feb 2022 at 01:00:58, Robert in CA <magineer02@yahoo.com>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>I get it about 2 wires for the LEDs and 2 wires for the
>switch but which is which? There's blue, white, red and
>yellow wires.

I can see in one of your pictures that one of the wires going to the LED
- which is at the end of the module - is yellow. (Where it's attached to
the LED, it has some black sleeving over the actual join.)
[]
>That's why it would not start when I depressed
>the plunger because pressing the plunger does
>nothing without the clear plastic piece which
>activates the switch.

I see, so if you reassemble the PC without what you are calling the
plunger - the round black plastic thing with the power symbol on it -
the actual switch is not in line with the hole, so you can't poke it.
>
>As far as shorting the wires I'm not sure we can
>do that. If you look at the pictures they are fully
>insulated and looks like they have covering on
>their ends.
>
>https://postimg.cc/gXCqQ2JT

That's the one where I can see that one of the wires to the LED - the
white thing on the right of that picture, or towards the front of the
PC, with the black strap over it - is yellow. I'm pretty sure I can see
that the other one is black, but do look to be sure. That eliminates two
of the wires.

Ah! I've just realised what's going on: the round white thing that's
under the plunger is the power LED, seen face on - it shines through the
power symbol on the plunger. (So the LED on the end - the one with
yellow and I think black wires - must be the hard disc LED.)

>
>https://postimg.cc/Mv8mYHgc

If I look closely at that, I can see the yellow and black wires
disappearing off into the distance, towards the HDD LED. The centre of
the picture seems to show the white and one of the reddish wires going
together to something, which I think will be the power LED, the one
under the plunger. They appear to have short lengths of black sleeving
over the LED legs too, same as the far LED. And in the foreground I can
see the blue wire, I think going to the switch, yet again with black
sleeving over the actual connection. I can't see the other reddish wire,
but I assume it goes to the other switch connection. The two reddish
wires aren't quite the same colour - one is more a dark pink - but I
can't see from your pictures; you should be able to tell though.
>
>I'm also a little leery of removing the switch
>assembly to do this. I don't want to damage
>something that I can't fix.

The diag. on page 90 in the PDF you posted a link to shows which
tags/tabs to squeeze. It looks as if it's the two narrower tabs on each
side. I think they're the ones where the little dimples in the metal
are. You can see from the one of your pictures that shows the underside
of the thing, that the tabs/tags won't have to be squeezed much to allow
the module just to be lifted off. Though there really isn't any point
unless you _are_ going to do so to identify which wires to shave.

But I see no reason why you can't operate the PC with just the plastic
parts (front and top panels, and the "plunger") removed, so you can
operate the switch directly; you've got that far to take the pictures.
[]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

/Downton Abbey/ presented a version of the past that appealed to anyone who
had ever bought a National Trust tea towel. - Alison Graham, RT 2015/11/7-13

What I call the plunger is the white round thing that
the push button (round black button with power symbol
on it) depresses.

However I did remove the button (with power symbol on
it ) and you're correct the switch was not aligned.

It looks like pink, white, blue, yellow and red or brown wires
to me and all have sleeves on them as you said. The yellow
and black wires terminate in the LED

https://postimg.cc/m1DJD1G6

https://postimg.cc/N5vRQq7R

https://postimg.cc/9DqbJtpB

https://postimg.cc/V5pbDyH3

I saw the release tabs for the switch as well on the last picture
and I agree it doesn't look like it would take much squeezing to
release the switch assembly but as you say there really isn't much
point unless were going to identify the wires to shave.

As I said it needs the plunger(with power sign) with the clear
plastic arm that's attached to it so when depressed its that
clear plastic arm that actually activates the switch.

In any case, I turned the computer off and then back on after
awhile and it started with no problem again. Granted, it's still
early but hopefully my taking out the push button(with power symbol)
and then re-seating it may of fixed it but I'll continue to monitor it
and lets hope for the best.

Robert

On 2/11/2022 12:02 AM, Robert in CA wrote:

> re-seating it may of fixed it but I'll continue to monitor it
> and lets hope for the best.
>
> Robert

That sounds fixed to me :-)

Paul

I powered it off and then back on a little
while later again and it came on. I had to
hold it down a little bit longer this last time
but nowhere near like before.

So (3) successful startups today.

So maybe that fixed it?

Many thanks for all your good help and Johns.

Robert

"Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote

| That sounds fixed to me :-)
| What a relief. But I know it won't be long
before Robert posts again in xp.general to ask why
the cover on his Win10 computer is loose... and it
will be another 100 posts in which he won't hesitate in
the slightest to waste your time.

On Thu, 10 Feb 2022 at 21:02:39, Robert in CA <magineer02@yahoo.com>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>What I call the plunger is the white round thing that
>the push button (round black button with power symbol
>on it) depresses.

I think that "white round thing" is in fact not part of the switch at
all - and isn't intended to move at all, though it may move a little if
it's not actually glued in place.

I think it is the top of an LED! Or, at least, the diffuser for one.
Which shines through the power symbol on the push button. I think the
actual _switch_ is the thing with a square silvery outline and four
black circles, with its little button - with S on it - inside a little
square sleeve for some reason - which is actually pressed by that
transparent bit of plastic glued/fused to the back of the pushbutton.
>
>However I did remove the button (with power symbol on
>it ) and you're correct the switch was not aligned.
>
>It looks like pink, white, blue, yellow and red or brown wires
>to me and all have sleeves on them as you said. The yellow
>and black wires terminate in the LED

I think there are _six_ wires altogether - two to each LED, and two to
the switch. As you say, black and yellow to the LED at the end (probably
the HDD-access LED - is there some symbol [usually looks like an old
drum drive!] on the case next to where it shines through, or it might
shine _through_ such a symbol?). I think it's white and pink (?) to the
LED in the middle of the assembly - the round white one that shines
through the pushbutton to show the power is on - and blue and the
remaining wire to the switch itself.
>
>https://postimg.cc/m1DJD1G6
>
>https://postimg.cc/N5vRQq7R
>
>https://postimg.cc/9DqbJtpB

In the above three, especially the last one, I am pretty sure I can see
six wires - black, white, blue, yellow, and two reddish.
>
>https://postimg.cc/V5pbDyH3
>
>I saw the release tabs for the switch as well on the last picture
>and I agree it doesn't look like it would take much squeezing to
>release the switch assembly but as you say there really isn't much
>point unless were going to identify the wires to shave.

Though having got this far I'd be inclined to do it just so I know! They
might be easier to release - or one pair might - by squeezing from below
rather than above. (But hopefully not important if everything's working
again anyway.)
>
>As I said it needs the plunger(with power sign) with the clear
>plastic arm that's attached to it so when depressed its that
>clear plastic arm that actually activates the switch.

so you've come to the same conclusion I did as to what is the actual
switch.
>
>In any case, I turned the computer off and then back on after
>awhile and it started with no problem again. Granted, it's still

It only needs a momentary contact to signal the motherboard/power supply
to start. The only time it ever needs to make contact for longer is if
you were to turn the PC _off_ by holding in the power button, which
you'd normally only do if it has locked up and you can't tell it to shut
down from Windows.

>early but hopefully my taking out the push button(with power symbol)

Hopefully. Another thing that occurs to me is that the square surround
of the actual switch pushbutton (the thing with the S on it) might have
become stiffer with time - is it rubbery?. If so, you might cut it back
a bit with a sharp knife, and/or put a dab of glue or something on the
bit of the clear plastic that actually presses the switch to build it up
(down) to give it a better chance of depressing the switch. (If you do
the latter, make sure it has set hard before reassembly - you don't want
unset glue around a switch!)

>and then re-seating it may of fixed it but I'll continue to monitor it

"May of"? Shame on you (-:

>and lets hope for the best.
>
>Robert
>
Indeed.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

I hate petitions, they're the modern-day equivalent of villagers with
pitchforks and flaming torches. - Alison Graham RT 2016/2/20-26

On Fri, 11 Feb 2022 at 07:50:42, Mayayana <mayayana@invalid.nospam>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>"Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote
>
>
>| That sounds fixed to me :-)
>|
> What a relief. But I know it won't be long
>before Robert posts again in xp.general to ask why
>the cover on his Win10 computer is loose... and it
>will be another 100 posts in which he won't hesitate in
>the slightest to waste your time.
>
>
I know what you're suggesting, but I think he's genuine, unlike he who
shall be nameless (or rather multi-named).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

A biochemist walks into a student bar and says to the barman: "I'd like a pint
of adenosine triphosphate, please." "Certainly," says the barman, "that'll be
ATP." (Quoted in) The Independent, 2013-7-13 [UK-specific, and dated]

I powered it on again today
and although it did take a
little time it did start.

I'll keep monitoring it but I
believe we've fixed it.

Thanks,
Robert

"J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote

| > What a relief. But I know it won't be long
| >before Robert posts again in xp.general to ask why
| >the cover on his Win10 computer is loose... and it
| >will be another 100 posts in which he won't hesitate in
| >the slightest to waste your time.
| >
| >
| I know what you're suggesting, but I think he's genuine, unlike he who
| shall be nameless (or rather multi-named).
|

Genuinely self-absorbed and genuinely shameless in
wasting other peoples' time. Maybe he's old and has
trouble concentrating? Fair enough. But that doesn't
justify lack of consideration.

Nevertheless, while you're here... I've been counting
the tines in my two toothbrushes. If I'm not mistaken
it's 120 in one and 116 in the other. Would you please
count all the tines in all your toothbrushes and post
a picture? I just want to make sure my count is in the
right ballpark. Thanks so much. :)

On Fri, 11 Feb 2022 at 11:15:08, Robert in CA <magineer02@yahoo.com>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>I powered it on again today
>and although it did take a
>little time it did start.
>
>I'll keep monitoring it but I
>believe we've fixed it.
>
>Thanks,
>Robert

By "start", do you mean "the light in the pushbutton came on", or do you
mean desktop appeared on screen? There should be no delay to the first;
the second could be delayed by lots of things.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

How could you be expected to know that picnics were originally held indoors,
or that a slow loris has poisonous elbows?
- Sandi Toksvig on QI, in RT 2018/9/15-21

By start I mean the computer booted.
Sometimes I have to hold the button
down for awhile and sometimes it starts
immediately.

What had happened was that I was having to
hold it down for an abnormally long period of
time to start.

After I removed the plunger/push button (with
power symbol on it) from the top cover and then
replaced it, it may of re-seated it on the two pins
holding it and now works better.

It's better we didn't scrap the wires because they
all had sleeves and there's a good chance I may
have damaged them. Let hope it continues to work
without the problem returning.

In passing, I'm not a troll or whatever the implication.

Robert

I was wrong and too quick on the draw.
The problem came back. I shut it down
earlier and this last time was like before
and took an abnormally long time to boot.

I noticed that it had been taking longer and
longer to boot.

I think it revolves around the plunger(with power
symbol) with the clear plastic arm connecting to
the switch and for awhile it was. but for some
reason it isn't anymore.

I'm just guessing, but what do you think of
adding washers under the(2) pins where the
plunger slides down and is connected to the
top cover. Would that give it a better connection?

https://postimg.cc/vD15CGZv

https://postimg.cc/WdVrDr69

other than that I really don't know what to do
at this point to improve connection.

Thoughts/Suggestions
Robert

On 2/12/2022 11:39 PM, Robert in CA wrote:
> I was wrong and too quick on the draw.
> The problem came back. I shut it down
> earlier and this last time was like before
> and took an abnormally long time to boot.
>
> I noticed that it had been taking longer and
> longer to boot.
>
> I think it revolves around the plunger(with power
> symbol) with the clear plastic arm connecting to
> the switch and for awhile it was. but for some
> reason it isn't anymore.
>
> I'm just guessing, but what do you think of
> adding washers under the(2) pins where the
> plunger slides down and is connected to the
> top cover. Would that give it a better connection?
>
> https://postimg.cc/vD15CGZv
>
> https://postimg.cc/WdVrDr69
>
> other than that I really don't know what to do
> at this point to improve connection.
>
> Thoughts/Suggestions
> Robert

There's five pages of nonsense here (disgruntled customer
posts mixed with repair suggestions).

https://www.dell.com/community/XPS-Desktops/XPS-8700-power-button-does-not-work/td-p/5808419/page/2

I still don't understand what that plastic assembly is supposed
to achieve. It looks like there is an offset between where
the button operates and where the switch is placed.
If the plastic bends, then perhaps not enough force is
transferred to the switch.

Some people have replaced CMOS battery and power supply.
One other person convinced Dell Support to change the motherboard.

There is a report the Normally Open switch measures
15 ohms when it closes. Which is way too high for a
switch. The switch should be a fraction of an ohm when
it closes. Like 0.1 ohm or less.

A low CMOS battery has been known to stop a PC from posting.
but not every PC does that. This is a function of the SuperIO.
Some SuperIO have a battery channel and they check the voltage.
If the voltage drops too low, then even though sufficient +5V
is there to start a session, the stupid thing denies the request.

Sometimes a brand new CMOS battery can be defective. I bought a
defective one at the "Mall Battery Shop" -- presumably old stock.

Using a voltmeter on the 20 volt scale, the top of the CMOS
battery should read 3.1V with respect to chassis ground. Below
2.3V spells trouble. But for the SuperIO to block a switch
request, sometimes the battery has to be right down to zero.
And not all SuperIO are even equipped to do that. I've never
seen this response here, on my junk PCs with their dead CMOS
batteries.

A washer isn't going to help the problem, unless it
brings the switch, closer to whatever functions as a
plunger.

Paul

One thing I will say whoever designed the case
could of made it allot easier to remove the top cover
without having to remove the optical drive.

The plunger (with power symbol) is designed as a spring
to depress so the clear plastic arm makes contact with the
switch. The top left and lower right holes are where it slides
down on pins of the top cover. The other hole (top right) is
a guide if I remember.

https://postimg.cc/WdVrDr69

Ok, how about for a start we change the battery? It just so
happens I have CR2032 battery still in the package, so change
it?

Robert

Ummmmm, I just read in the manual that if I change the battery
it will set my BIOS back to the default settings. So is it OK to do this?

I don't even know what my setting are or suppose to be? It said it hit F2
when I see the F2 on the screen after the Dell symbol to check my BIOS
So I restarted the computer but I didn't see any F2?

So what should I do?

Robert

On 2/13/2022 10:30 AM, Robert in CA wrote:
> Ummmmm, I just read in the manual that if I change the battery
> it will set my BIOS back to the default settings. So is it OK to do this?
>
> I don't even know what my setting are or suppose to be? It said it hit F2
> when I see the F2 on the screen after the Dell symbol to check my BIOS
> So I restarted the computer but I didn't see any F2?
>
> So what should I do?
>
> Robert
>

To answer that question, what have you changed in there ?

You've likely used SATA port controls at some point.
But running with one HDD and one DVD drive, the controls
could be back to default.

Other than that, it's boot order (optical drive, HDD).
Again, mostly default.

*******

My two PCs here have "bios profile save" and can restore
settings on demand. In the BIOS, I type "1" in the
restore field and hit return, it says "do you want to
reload profile", I click yes in there. That's the UEFI BIOS.

The only problem with "bios profile save", is the saved
info tends to be invalidated if you do a BIOS flash update.
Which hasn't happened on either machine.

The older machines don't have that. Restoring settings on
the year 2000 PC is actually a bit easier than some
of the others, but there are still some cryptic settings
you have to do manually.

*******

I measure the CMOS battery, to tell it is time to change
it. +3.1V is new, +2.3V or less is time-to-replace. The
red multimeter lead, touches the top of the battery case,
the black lead touches shiny conductive metal on the chassis.
That way, you can measure battery state, without removal.

All power should be off when you replace it.

the battery clips range from "Easy" to "Dastardly". You don't
want the battery flopping around all over the PCB if you can
help it. Unplugging the computer, ensures there is no live
+5VSB inside the PC.

The spent Panasonic I just checked, a magnetic wand picks it up.
The "+" should be visible from the outside, when it is installed.

Paul