On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 14:05:22 -0500, Joel wrote:

> That kind of stupidity is how you're transparently delusional, Jesus
> said about me that Yahweh gives me his "seal of approval". That's
> pretty strong words to say about one individual 2000 years in the
> fucking future. Clearly, my bisexuality and trans woman attraction
> doesn't send me to this imaginary "hell".

How about an AIDS clinic?

There was a very competent Java programmer that had a very helpful
website. Somehow I followed the wrong link and wound up in his other
world. It was like when you find a bloated raccoon that's been lying on
the side of the road for several days in August and is crawling with
maggots and other insect life. There's something in the human psyche that
triggers a horrid fascination.

rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

>> That kind of stupidity is how you're transparently delusional, Jesus
>> said about me that Yahweh gives me his "seal of approval". That's
>> pretty strong words to say about one individual 2000 years in the
>> fucking future. Clearly, my bisexuality and trans woman attraction
>> doesn't send me to this imaginary "hell".
>
>How about an AIDS clinic?
>
>There was a very competent Java programmer that had a very helpful
>website. Somehow I followed the wrong link and wound up in his other
>world. It was like when you find a bloated raccoon that's been lying on
>the side of the road for several days in August and is crawling with
>maggots and other insect life. There's something in the human psyche that
>triggers a horrid fascination.

What?

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 13:50:45 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> You ever seen anyone getting dragged to hell?

I had to go to Baltimore once...

"Relf" <Usenet@Jeff-Relf.Me> wrote:

>rBowman wondered:
>> how does a modern offering like LDS survive and thrive ?
>
>Can the pope tell the truth, candidly/freely ?
>Can Ahlstrom, AOC & Biden tell the truth ?
>
>Not if they want to retain their money & power.
>
>In other words: We're paid to lie.

I'm *brutally* honest. And that's why they'll never cancel me. I
don't need the executive power, someone else can be elected to that,
but they'll never be able to replace my oversight.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 13:50:45 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
>> You ever seen anyone getting dragged to hell?
>
>I had to go to Baltimore once...

I've been through B-more many times in the car I used to have, no one
tried to do anything to me, you may think it's too urban for you,
fine, don't judge it as if it's "hell", though.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 16:35:10 -0500, RabidPedagog wrote:

> Since you brought up Rust and since I don't program at all, I have to
> wonder why people are so reluctant to adopt Rust if it indeed has
> built-in memory protections.

Part of it is skepticism I think. Programmers have been burned by the
latest greatest over the years and have a wait and see attitude. I've
looked at it although I don't have a need for it. What struck me is some
of the syntax that seems gratuitous when looking at the languages it was
derived from. 'fn'? 'let'? Perhaps there is a valid lexical reason. It's
like R using =: for assignment and using = with a different connotation.

https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2024/02/27/memory-safe-programming-
languages/

"The White House is asking the technical community to switch to using
memory-safe programming languages – such as Rust, Python, Swift, C#, Java,
and Go – to prevent memory corruption vulnerabilities from entering the
digital ecosystem."

Okay, I'll play along -- Python and C# it is.

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 17:57:30 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> I still want to understand newer C++ constructs such as promises and
> futures. I'm not sure the C++ book market is keeping up, with the
> "retirement" of Scott Meyers. I have started to use lambdas... nothing
> like being able too look up a lambda function using a MIDI control
> status or a keystroke. Beats the snot out of a buncha "ifs" or a bigass
> "switch" statement.

Yeah, everybody came down with lambda envy. I haven't worked with promises
in C++ but I have used the similar constructs in C#. They can get painful
with 'you can't call await unless the function is tagged async, which you
can await in that other function unless...

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 19:32:50 -0500, Joel wrote:

> rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 13:50:45 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>
>>> You ever seen anyone getting dragged to hell?
>>
>>I had to go to Baltimore once...
>
>
> I've been through B-more many times in the car I used to have, no one
> tried to do anything to me, you may think it's too urban for you, fine,
> don't judge it as if it's "hell", though.

Long story. I took a break from programming and drove OTR for a few years.
One load was those ad inserts for the Sunday newspapers that people line
their parakeet cages with. Whole other rant on why they're printed in
Colorado and trucked cross country. I called to get directions and knew it
was going to be good when it included landmarks like 'left at the burned
out van'.

I get there and it is a store front operation aka a 'minority business'.
There isn't a loading dock and there aren't any employees. The guy is
walking up and down the block trying to recruit a workforce.

These inserts are bundled on pallets which weigh about 500 pounds apiece
and are meant to be unloaded with a fork lift or at least a pallet jack.
Of course not having a loading dock they don't have either of those. What
they have is a two-wheel hand cart like you'd use to move a refrigerator.
So the procedure is to roll the pallets end over end until they fall off
the back of the truck, man handle onto the hand truck, and drag it inside.
I was waiting for the tires to blow since the load was a few hundred
pounds over their rating and they weren't exactly brand new.

Now the trailer is 53' long, which is a hell of a lot of rolling like a
dung beetle on meth, and I'm helping to expedite the process. At one point
I heard someone mutter 'First time I ever saw a white motherfucker work.'
I just wanted to get out of there while I still had 18 wheels.

That's my take on Baltimore. I've got similar stories about Pittsburg,
South Central, and other shit holes. I even made it to LA for the Rodney
King riots. The terminal was about a mile from DizzyWorld. I was reading
in the cab when the assholes had their evening fireworks display. I was
out of the truck with my trusty nine looking for a target before I
realized what it was.

rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

>> I've been through B-more many times in the car I used to have, no one
>> tried to do anything to me, you may think it's too urban for you, fine,
>> don't judge it as if it's "hell", though.
>
>Long story. I took a break from programming and drove OTR for a few years.
>One load was those ad inserts for the Sunday newspapers that people line
>their parakeet cages with. Whole other rant on why they're printed in
>Colorado and trucked cross country. I called to get directions and knew it
>was going to be good when it included landmarks like 'left at the burned
>out van'.
>
>I get there and it is a store front operation aka a 'minority business'.
>There isn't a loading dock and there aren't any employees. The guy is
>walking up and down the block trying to recruit a workforce.
>
>These inserts are bundled on pallets which weigh about 500 pounds apiece
>and are meant to be unloaded with a fork lift or at least a pallet jack.
>Of course not having a loading dock they don't have either of those. What
>they have is a two-wheel hand cart like you'd use to move a refrigerator.
>So the procedure is to roll the pallets end over end until they fall off
>the back of the truck, man handle onto the hand truck, and drag it inside.
>I was waiting for the tires to blow since the load was a few hundred
>pounds over their rating and they weren't exactly brand new.
>
>Now the trailer is 53' long, which is a hell of a lot of rolling like a
>dung beetle on meth, and I'm helping to expedite the process. At one point
>I heard someone mutter 'First time I ever saw a white motherfucker work.'
>I just wanted to get out of there while I still had 18 wheels.
>
>That's my take on Baltimore. I've got similar stories about Pittsburg,
>South Central, and other shit holes. I even made it to LA for the Rodney
>King riots. The terminal was about a mile from DizzyWorld. I was reading
>in the cab when the assholes had their evening fireworks display. I was
>out of the truck with my trusty nine looking for a target before I
>realized what it was.

It's true that Baltimore is a rough area in many ways. But I feel OK
there, being black inside. I guess it's just perspective.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On 2024-02-29, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 07:37:59 -0500, RabidPedagog wrote:
>
>> On 2024-02-28 8:56 p.m., rbowman wrote:
>>> On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 19:18:02 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Christian theology is true, Catholicism is a corruption of it.
>>>
>>> Without the Catholic Church Christianity would have died on the vine
>>> not the cross.
>>
>> Not necessarily. Much like Zoroastrianism, it would have had small
>> pockets of devout in some areas of the world.
>
> Run into any Mithraists lately? It had been a widespread religion with
> ties to Zoroastrianism but didn't survive Theodosius.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithraeum
>
> afaik there isn't any attempt to revive it unlike several of the other
> pre-Christian religions. It's an open question if it had any impact on the
> development of Christianity. Julian had attempted to bring it back but he
> was the last pagan emperor.
>
> I've had a discussion in another forum about Rust and its chance of
> success. PL/I and Ada had similar aspirations but remain on the fringes.
> Why one computer language takes off and another is condemned to obscurity
> is similar to religion.
>
> I'll offend everyone by saying the premises of all religions, with the
> possible exception of old school Buddhism, are extremely unlikely. Most
> have the aura of history but how does a modern offering like LDS survive
> and thrive? Falun Gong? Scientology? Some have a foot up when they are
> adopted by the powerful like Christianity and others are more of a grass
> roots movement.

And one is completely true and the others aren't.

--
[Self-centered, Woke] "pride is a life of self-destructive fakery, an
entrapment to a false and self-created matrix of twisted unreality."
"It was pride that changed angels into devils..." — St. Augustine

On 2024-02-29, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> RonB wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> On 2024-02-29, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> RabidPedagog wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> On 2024-02-29 2:54 a.m., RonB wrote:
>>>>> On 2024-02-29, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, 15 Feb 2024 20:46:53 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Catholicism is an abomination.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think you are free to believe in whatever sky fairies you like.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The trouble comes when you start insisting your sky fairy is the only true
>>>>>> sky fairy, all other sky fairies are false.
>>>>>
>>>>> You and your sky fairies. Get help.
>>>>>
>>>>>> That is not the path to religious tolerance.
>>>>>
>>>>> Toleration is external. You allow people to believe what they want, even
>>>>> when it's wrong. Toleration allows free will. But if you really believe that
>>>>> others can be right when they directly oppose the truths taught by your
>>>>> religion, that's not tolerance, that's capitulation. Either you believe in
>>>>> the truth of your religion, or you don't. If you don't, you really don't
>>>>> believe in anything.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life: no one comes unto the
>>>>> Father but by Me." No middle ground here.
>>>>
>>>> Joel Crump will have lots of time to think about which faith was the
>>>> right one when he dies and demons come to drag him to Hell. As far as I
>>>> know, no religion allows for homosexuality of any kind.
>>>
>>> No one is getting dragged to Hell.
>>
>> And you know this... how? By faith?
>
> You ever seen anyone getting dragged to hell?
> Hell, I don't even know where it is.
> Never seen one damn peer-reviewed paper about it.

And because you (personally) haven't seen it, it can't be true? I'm glad the
whole universe doesn't depend on what you've seen or haven't seen. There
wouldn't be much of it left then, would there?

>>> No need for it anyway, we've got nice pockets of it on Earth.
>>
>> Nothing on Earth equals hell. Although a lot evil bastards seem to be
>> "hellbent" on making Earth as hell-like as they can. As an atheist friend
>> once said, "the lowest depths of hell are reserved for pedophiles." Never
>> mind the contradiction, I think he got it right.
>>
>> 1 At that hour the disciples came to Jesus, saying: Who thinkest thou is
>> the greater in the kingdom of heaven? 2 And Jesus calling unto him a
>> little child, set him in the midst of them, 3 And said: Amen I say to
>> you, unless you be converted, and become as little children, you shall
>> not enter into the kingdom of heaven. 4 Whosoever therefore shall humble
>> himself as this little child, he is the greater in the kingdom of heaven.
>> 5 And he that shall receive one such little child in my name, receiveth
>> me. 6 But he that shall scandalize one of these little ones that believe
>> in me, it were better for him that a millstone should be hanged about his
>> neck, and that he should be drowned in the depth of the sea. 7 Woe to the
>> world because of scandals. For it must needs be that scandals come: but
>> nevertheless woe to that man by whom the scandal cometh. —St. Matthew 18.
>
> Better to be sure, and make the bastard's life hell on Earth.
>
> ObLinux:
>
> https://linuxhell.com/
>
> Welcome to Linux Hell

--
[Self-centered, Woke] "pride is a life of self-destructive fakery, an
entrapment to a false and self-created matrix of twisted unreality."
"It was pride that changed angels into devils..." — St. Augustine

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 18:53:00 -0500, RabidPedagog wrote:

> On 2024-02-29 4:55 p.m., candycanearter07 wrote:
>>> Since you brought up Rust and since I don't program at all, I have to
>>> wonder why people are so reluctant to adopt Rust if it indeed has
>>> built-in memory protections.
>>
>> The devs are controversial.
>
> Do they believe in two genders?

https://devclass.com/2023/05/31/more-rust-ructions-as-project-team-
confesses-failure-of-leadership-chat/

Nothing that dramatic, only garden variety pissing contests.

rbowman wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> <brevsnip>
>
> That's my take on Baltimore. I've got similar stories about Pittsburg,
> South Central, and other shit holes. I even made it to LA for the Rodney
> King riots. The terminal was about a mile from DizzyWorld. I was reading
> in the cab when the assholes had their evening fireworks display. I was
> out of the truck with my trusty nine looking for a target before I
> realized what it was.

Yeah, I was working at 3rd and Alvarado then. On the office's elevated patio
one could see smoke rising in various places.

Nearby was McArthur Park (cue Richard Harris's rendition). Not a place
to hang around.

But mostly LA was a fun place to live, a lot to do, great restaurants, the Op
Amp bookstore, the La Brea tar pits, so many different cultures represented.

But stressful, primarily due to traffic. And the Santa Ana winds if you lived
in the Valley.

--
You are not dead yet. But watch for further reports.

rbowman wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 16:35:10 -0500, RabidPedagog wrote:
>
>> Since you brought up Rust and since I don't program at all, I have to
>> wonder why people are so reluctant to adopt Rust if it indeed has
>> built-in memory protections.
>
> Part of it is skepticism I think. Programmers have been burned by the
> latest greatest over the years and have a wait and see attitude. I've
> looked at it although I don't have a need for it. What struck me is some
> of the syntax that seems gratuitous when looking at the languages it was
> derived from. 'fn'? 'let'? Perhaps there is a valid lexical reason. It's
> like R using =: for assignment and using = with a different connotation.

Heh, Algol and then Pascal used ":=" (assignment) and "=" (comparison).

> https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2024/02/27/memory-safe-programming-languages/
>
> "The White House is asking the technical community to switch to using
> memory-safe programming languages – such as Rust, Python, Swift, C#, Java,
> and Go – to prevent memory corruption vulnerabilities from entering the
> digital ecosystem."
>
> Okay, I'll play along -- Python and C# it is.

I'll stick with carefully-crafted C++, thankyouverymuch.

Are these the same people that mandated "Ada"? :-D

--
Let us endeavor so to live that when we come to die even the undertaker will be
sorry.
-- Mark Twain, "Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar"

RonB wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On 2024-02-29, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> RonB wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> On 2024-02-29, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> RabidPedagog wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2024-02-29 2:54 a.m., RonB wrote:
>>>>>> On 2024-02-29, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Thu, 15 Feb 2024 20:46:53 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Catholicism is an abomination.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you are free to believe in whatever sky fairies you like.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The trouble comes when you start insisting your sky fairy is the only true
>>>>>>> sky fairy, all other sky fairies are false.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You and your sky fairies. Get help.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That is not the path to religious tolerance.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Toleration is external. You allow people to believe what they want, even
>>>>>> when it's wrong. Toleration allows free will. But if you really believe that
>>>>>> others can be right when they directly oppose the truths taught by your
>>>>>> religion, that's not tolerance, that's capitulation. Either you believe in
>>>>>> the truth of your religion, or you don't. If you don't, you really don't
>>>>>> believe in anything.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life: no one comes unto the
>>>>>> Father but by Me." No middle ground here.
>>>>>
>>>>> Joel Crump will have lots of time to think about which faith was the
>>>>> right one when he dies and demons come to drag him to Hell. As far as I
>>>>> know, no religion allows for homosexuality of any kind.
>>>>
>>>> No one is getting dragged to Hell.
>>>
>>> And you know this... how? By faith?
>>
>> You ever seen anyone getting dragged to hell?
>> Hell, I don't even know where it is.
>> Never seen one damn peer-reviewed paper about it.
>
> And because you (personally) haven't seen it, it can't be true? I'm glad the
> whole universe doesn't depend on what you've seen or haven't seen. There
> wouldn't be much of it left then, would there?

Actually, it's because no one has seen demons, no one has dissected one or
found any demon coprolites, and I'm pretty sure no one has even properly
defined a demon, so that it can be investigated and be capable of either proof
or disproof. Same with Hell.

Now this leads to the question of how you know anything, when there's a long
chain of events between that thing and you. For example, do you really know if
there was a George Washington? You have to depend upon fallible historians.

How do you know there is an electron? Again, a chain of events that you must
depend on.

Although we once replicated the Millikan oil-drop experiment in high school.

(And burned pencils sharpened at both ends by attaching them to a bench power
supply)

--
Are you sure the back door is locked?

Relf wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> rBowman wondered:
>> how does a modern offering like LDS survive and thrive ?
>
> Can the pope tell the truth, candidly/freely ?
> Can Ahlstrom, AOC & Biden tell the truth ?
--------
> Not if they want to retain their money & power.

:-D

> In other words: We're paid to lie.

--
Do nothing unless you must, and when you must act -- hesitate.

On Fri, 1 Mar 2024 08:26:35 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> Heh, Algol and then Pascal used ":=" (assignment) and "=" (comparison).

Python dug it up in 3.8 and called it the walrus operator. I like the
concept even though it brings up bad memories. To mix languages

if (ptr = strchr(foo, 'z')) {
*ptr = 'Z'
}

wouldn't work in Python. You'd have to evaluate ptr then check for its
truthiness. That did introduce its share of bugs in C where == was what
was meant.

> I'll stick with carefully-crafted C++, thankyouverymuch.
>
> Are these the same people that mandated "Ada"? :-D

No, that's one thing in Rust's favor. Graydon Hoare (not Tony) brewed it
up at Mozilla and it eventually was adopted by other people. Ada was a DoD
project. You have to wonder if the F-35's software is written in Ada. It
definitely shows its Algol roots.

I'm not that crazy about C++ but that's more about what people have done
with it. At least in my edition of 'The C++ Programming Language'
Stroustrup is very restrained in his usage compared to 'you've got to use
every feature every time.' It also suffered from a lack of
standardization until the STL / Standard Library got ironed out.

On Fri, 1 Mar 2024 07:10:26 -0000 (UTC), RonB wrote:

> And one is completely true and the others aren't.

Eric Hoffer wrote a book about that.

On Fri, 01 Mar 2024 01:56:50 -0500, Joel wrote:

> It's true that Baltimore is a rough area in many ways. But I feel OK
> there, being black inside. I guess it's just perspective.

Yeah, until some bloods turn you inside out to check. They aren't
impressed by whiggers, cultural appropriation dontcha know.

You know it's a great place to live when rat fishing is a sport, and
that's the whyte peepul.

On 2024-03-01, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 1 Mar 2024 07:10:26 -0000 (UTC), RonB wrote:
>
>> And one is completely true and the others aren't.
>
> Eric Hoffer wrote a book about that.

Good for Eric Hoffer. Opinions are like ... everyone has one. I believe in
objective truth.

I think St. Thomas Aquinas wrote on this subject as well. In my opinion he
had a clearer grasp of reality.

--
[Self-centered, Woke] "pride is a life of self-destructive fakery, an
entrapment to a false and self-created matrix of twisted unreality."
"It was pride that changed angels into devils..." — St. Augustine

On Fri, 1 Mar 2024 08:17:55 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> But mostly LA was a fun place to live, a lot to do, great restaurants,
> the Op Amp bookstore, the La Brea tar pits, so many different cultures
> represented.

I didn't mind it. I carried a bicycle on the truck and for a while the
terminal was near State College and Ball Rd. It was a short hope to the
Santa Ana bike trail so I could either go down to the beach or the other
way to a little state park iirc. Santa Ana itself was a little sketchy
but I never had a problem. That was before it became a homeless
encampment.

What I found fascinating were the leftovers from the old days. There was a
field of strawberries not far from the terminal, probably an acre or two
plunked down in a commercial area. The terminal had been in La Mirada for
a while and there was a little dairy farm a couple of blocks north.

I regret I didn't get to see more of the attractions but there isn't a lot
of sightseeing you can do with a bobtail (just the tractor with out a
trailer) and overall the city wasn't bicycle friendly.

On 2024-03-01, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> RonB wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> On 2024-02-29, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> RonB wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> On 2024-02-29, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> RabidPedagog wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2024-02-29 2:54 a.m., RonB wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2024-02-29, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Thu, 15 Feb 2024 20:46:53 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Catholicism is an abomination.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think you are free to believe in whatever sky fairies you like.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The trouble comes when you start insisting your sky fairy is the only true
>>>>>>>> sky fairy, all other sky fairies are false.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You and your sky fairies. Get help.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That is not the path to religious tolerance.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Toleration is external. You allow people to believe what they want, even
>>>>>>> when it's wrong. Toleration allows free will. But if you really believe that
>>>>>>> others can be right when they directly oppose the truths taught by your
>>>>>>> religion, that's not tolerance, that's capitulation. Either you believe in
>>>>>>> the truth of your religion, or you don't. If you don't, you really don't
>>>>>>> believe in anything.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life: no one comes unto the
>>>>>>> Father but by Me." No middle ground here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Joel Crump will have lots of time to think about which faith was the
>>>>>> right one when he dies and demons come to drag him to Hell. As far as I
>>>>>> know, no religion allows for homosexuality of any kind.
>>>>>
>>>>> No one is getting dragged to Hell.
>>>>
>>>> And you know this... how? By faith?
>>>
>>> You ever seen anyone getting dragged to hell?
>>> Hell, I don't even know where it is.
>>> Never seen one damn peer-reviewed paper about it.
>>
>> And because you (personally) haven't seen it, it can't be true? I'm glad the
>> whole universe doesn't depend on what you've seen or haven't seen. There
>> wouldn't be much of it left then, would there?
>
> Actually, it's because no one has seen demons, no one has dissected one or
> found any demon coprolites, and I'm pretty sure no one has even properly
> defined a demon, so that it can be investigated and be capable of either proof
> or disproof. Same with Hell.

Actually people have seen demons. They've also experienced supernatural
miracles — like Fatima (thousands in that case). Just because you, out of
hand, reject what they have witnessed doesn't mean they're wrong (or liars)
and you're (somehow, by default) right. It just means you're calling people
liars because you, personally, don't believe what they say. Back to square
one. Just because YOU (personally) haven't seen a demon, doesn't mean nobody
has.

Read St. Thomas Aquinas and other Doctors of the Church on demons. Read
interviews from exorcists. Get back to me when you've filled the void of
your ignorance on this subject. St. Thomas worked at defining EVERY aspect
of the Catholic religion, including the substance and reality of demons.

> Now this leads to the question of how you know anything, when there's a long
> chain of events between that thing and you. For example, do you really know if
> there was a George Washington? You have to depend upon fallible historians.

I don't knee-jerk reject history. And I believe in objective truth. Problem
solved.

> How do you know there is an electron? Again, a chain of events that you must
> depend on.

I don't believe that scientists have completely figured out the atom. I
think when (if) they can "drill down" further they'll find smaller and
smaller elements.

> Although we once replicated the Millikan oil-drop experiment in high school.
>
> (And burned pencils sharpened at both ends by attaching them to a bench power
> supply)

Okay. What does that have to do with demons?

--
[Self-centered, Woke] "pride is a life of self-destructive fakery, an
entrapment to a false and self-created matrix of twisted unreality."
"It was pride that changed angels into devils..." — St. Augustine

rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

>> It's true that Baltimore is a rough area in many ways. But I feel OK
>> there, being black inside. I guess it's just perspective.
>
>Yeah, until some bloods turn you inside out to check. They aren't
>impressed by whiggers, cultural appropriation dontcha know.
>
>You know it's a great place to live when rat fishing is a sport, and
>that's the whyte peepul.

I'm not a wigger, I'm an oddball. I was never Caucasian until this
lifetime.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Fri, 1 Mar 2024 19:46:09 -0000 (UTC), RonB wrote:

> I don't believe that scientists have completely figured out the atom. I
> think when (if) they can "drill down" further they'll find smaller and
> smaller elements.

It's turtles all the way down...

rbowman wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On Fri, 1 Mar 2024 08:26:35 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
>
>> Heh, Algol and then Pascal used ":=" (assignment) and "=" (comparison).
>
> Python dug it up in 3.8 and called it the walrus operator. I like the
> concept even though it brings up bad memories. To mix languages
>
> if (ptr = strchr(foo, 'z')) {
> *ptr = 'Z'
> }
>
> wouldn't work in Python. You'd have to evaluate ptr then check for its
> truthiness. That did introduce its share of bugs in C where == was what
> was meant.
>
>> I'll stick with carefully-crafted C++, thankyouverymuch.
>>
>> Are these the same people that mandated "Ada"? :-D
>
> No, that's one thing in Rust's favor. Graydon Hoare (not Tony) brewed it
> up at Mozilla and it eventually was adopted by other people. Ada was a DoD
> project. You have to wonder if the F-35's software is written in Ada. It
> definitely shows its Algol roots.
>
> I'm not that crazy about C++ but that's more about what people have done
> with it. At least in my edition of 'The C++ Programming Language'
> Stroustrup is very restrained in his usage compared to 'you've got to use
> every feature every time.' It also suffered from a lack of
> standardization until the STL / Standard Library got ironed out.

Every time I try another language, I find it has things missing that C++ has.
Or it has incorporated some concept from C++ but in a stilted way. Like
this one:

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/csharp/language-reference/statements/using

When the control leaves the block of the using statement, an acquired
IDisposable instance is disposed. In particular, the using statement ensures
that a disposable instance is disposed even if an exception occurs within
the block of the using statement.

RAII Microsoff style :-)

I do like Bjarne's writing style, and his often pithy statements. His book has
a nice chapter on "Avoiding Programming".

Also:

https://www.stroustrup.com/quotes.html

"When was the last time you checked the return value of printf?"

--
You will experience a strong urge to do good; but it will pass.