Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].

The talk will be given online on Sunday, 19 March 2023 from 13:35 EDT
(UTC-4) to 14:20 EDT. We will give an introduction to how Usenet works,
compare it to more recent forms of social media, and discuss what we can
learn from Usenet.

LibrePlanet is a conference about software freedom, and brings together
software developers, law and policy experts, activists, students, and
computer users to learn skills, celebrate free software accomplishments,
and face upcoming challenges together. Newcomers are always welcome.

The conference is free to attend online. Please register [3] in advance.

[1]: https://www.big-8.org/

[2]: https://libreplanet.org/2023/

[3]: https://my.fsf.org/civicrm/event/info?reset=1&id=106

--
Usenet Big-8 Management Board
https://www.big-8.org/
board@big-8.org

On 3/14/23 18:59, Usenet Big-8 Management Board wrote:
> Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
> talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
> social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].
>
> The talk will be given online on Sunday, 19 March 2023 from 13:35 EDT
> (UTC-4) to 14:20 EDT.  We will give an introduction to how Usenet works,
> compare it to more recent forms of social media, and discuss what we can
> learn from Usenet.
>
> LibrePlanet is a conference about software freedom, and brings together
> software developers, law and policy experts, activists, students, and
> computer users to learn skills, celebrate free software accomplishments,
> and face upcoming challenges together. Newcomers are always welcome.
>
> The conference is free to attend online. Please register [3] in advance.
>
>   [1]: https://www.big-8.org/
>
>   [2]: https://libreplanet.org/2023/
>
>   [3]: https://my.fsf.org/civicrm/event/info?reset=1&id=106
>

Have you considered recording the talks? Youtube bingers and podcast
junkies would find their way to it afterwards.

On 3/14/23 5:59 PM, Usenet Big-8 Management Board wrote:
> Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
> talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
> social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].

Per [2]:

March 18-19, 2023.

Per [3]:

Registration is closed for this event

&
Registration is temporarily closed. It will reopen on Friday, March
17th at 17:00 EST.

It seems like registration being (temporary) closed until the day before
the event is ... questionable at best.

> The talk will be given online on Sunday, 19 March 2023 from 13:35 EDT
> (UTC-4) to 14:20 EDT.  We will give an introduction to how Usenet works,
> compare it to more recent forms of social media, and discuss what we can
> learn from Usenet.

Will the talk(s) be recorded?

Will you please enlighten us as to what "moderation" is in the talks
context? It seems like it could easily be conflated with censorship.

I don't know how free from moderation ~> censorship that Usenet is. I
think that it's better than some other things. But like all things,
each news server / network can censor the articles that will be
accepted. -- Sure, people can vote with the proverbial feet of using a
different news server / service. I agree that in general, Usenet's
flood fill mechanism makes it difficult to completely cut off articles.
But it's not the panacea that some people want it to be.

My concern is mostly around accidental mis-statements that cause people
to believe something that's incorrect and the likely brouhaha that may
result.

--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

Usenet Big-8 Management Board <board@big-8.org> wrote:

>Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
>talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
>social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].

We're not a social network. We're above Facebook [spit] friend/unfriend crap.

>. . .

Greetings.

On 2023-03-14 18:32, G.K. wrote:
> On 3/14/23 18:59, Usenet Big-8 Management Board wrote:
>> Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
>> talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
>> social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].
>
> Have you considered recording the talks? Youtube bingers and podcast
> junkies would find their way to it afterwards.

Yes, the talk will be recorded by the LibrePlanet organizers and
published online by them shortly after the conference.

Regards,
Tristan

--
Usenet Big-8 Management Board
https://www.big-8.org/
board@big-8.org

Greetings.

On 2023-03-14 18:36, Grant Taylor wrote:
> It seems like registration being (temporary) closed until the day before
> the event is ... questionable at best.

Yeah -- I'm not sure what's up with that. Perhaps they are having
technical difficulties. I don't believe anything like that happened at
last year's LibrePlanet. In any case, ISTR registration was only
requested, not mandatory, last year, so the same may be true this year.
If you're unwilling or unable to register in time, you might find it
possible to watch the talks live anyway.

>> The talk will be given online on Sunday, 19 March 2023 from 13:35 EDT
>> (UTC-4) to 14:20 EDT.  We will give an introduction to how Usenet
>> works, compare it to more recent forms of social media, and discuss
>> what we can learn from Usenet.
>
> Will the talk(s) be recorded?

Yes, our talk (and probably most or all other talks at LibrePlanet) will
be recorded and published online after the conference.

> Will you please enlighten us as to what "moderation" is in the talks
> context?  It seems like it could easily be conflated with censorship.

We briefly describe how moderated newsgroups work, some of the problems
that Usenet's moderation system solves, and some of the problems that
Usenet's moderation system creates. We separately discuss the issue of
censorship in Usenet versus censorship in centralized social media networks.

The rest of the points you raise in your post are all valid ones, and
ones that we're aware of. Of course, it's possible to have a very long
and intricate discussion about censorship and Usenet, but since this is
only one of many topics we cover in the 40-minute talk, and because
we're pitching it mostly at people who aren't already familiar with
Usenet, we won't be going into too much detail.

Regards,
Tristan

--
Usenet Big-8 Management Board
https://www.big-8.org/
board@big-8.org

Greetings.

On 2023-03-14 20:24, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> We're not a social network. We're above Facebook [spit] friend/unfriend crap.

Yes, Usenet is not a "social network" in the way the term is commonly
understood today, and we do describe the distinctions -- including the
notion of "friending" -- in the talk. But at least in academic circles,
Usenet had been studied as a "social network" (using that exact term,
albeit in a more generic sense) years before Facebook and its ilk existed.

Regards,
Tristan

--
Usenet Big-8 Management Board
https://www.big-8.org/
board@big-8.org

Tristan Miller <tmiller@big-8.org> wrote:
>On 2023-03-14 20:24, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

>>We're not a social network. We're above Facebook [spit] friend/unfriend crap.

>Yes, Usenet is not a "social network" in the way the term is commonly
>understood today, and we do describe the distinctions -- including the
>notion of "friending" -- in the talk. But at least in academic circles,
>Usenet had been studied as a "social network" (using that exact term,
>albeit in a more generic sense) years before Facebook and its ilk existed.

We're just Usenet.

Tristan Miller <tmiller@big-8.org> wrote:
> Greetings.
>
> On 2023-03-14 18:32, G.K. wrote:
> > On 3/14/23 18:59, Usenet Big-8 Management Board wrote:
> >> Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
> >> talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
> >> social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].
> >
> > Have you considered recording the talks? Youtube bingers and podcast
> > junkies would find their way to it afterwards.
>
>
> Yes, the talk will be recorded by the LibrePlanet organizers and
> published online by them shortly after the conference.

Please do post the link when it's available.

This sounds like it'll be a good talk - there's not much been written
recently (in the last couple of decades) about the tech/sociology interplay
of Usenet, and lessons for the wider internet.

Theo

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> writes:
>This sounds like it'll be a good talk - there's not much been written
>recently (in the last couple of decades) about the tech/sociology interplay
>of Usenet, and lessons for the wider internet.

"The complexity of interaction analysis on Internet fora",
Wouter Roose, 2015:

|The data used for the research section of this dissertation
|was gathered from the following two Google Groups fora, which
|are freely accessible to anyone with a Google account:
|1. alt.usage.english
....
|2. de.etc.sprache.deutsch
..

Greetings.

On 2023-03-15 04:38, Theo wrote:
> Tristan Miller <tmiller@big-8.org> wrote:
>> On 2023-03-14 18:32, G.K. wrote:
>>> On 3/14/23 18:59, Usenet Big-8 Management Board wrote:
>>>> Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
>>>> talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
>>>> social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].
>>>
>>> Have you considered recording the talks? Youtube bingers and podcast
>>> junkies would find their way to it afterwards.
>>
>> Yes, the talk will be recorded by the LibrePlanet organizers and
>> published online by them shortly after the conference.
>
> Please do post the link when it's available.

OK, I'll try to remember to follow up here with a link.

> This sounds like it'll be a good talk - there's not much been written
> recently (in the last couple of decades) about the tech/sociology interplay
> of Usenet, and lessons for the wider internet.

You might be interested in the talk I gave at last year's LibrePlanet
[1], as well as an article/interview I co-authored in the latest issue
of Internet Histories [2]. These go into a lot more detail about the
technical/social interplay aspect of Usenet, in contrast to this year's
LibrePlanet talk, which is more of an overview of Usenet aimed at a
general audience not already familiar with the network. The Internet
Histories article was made Open Access for a limited time by the
publisher; if you find it's now behind a paywall, send me an e-mail and
I'll send you a preprint.

Regards,
Tristan

[1]: Tristan Miller. Revitalizing Usenet. Talk at LibrePlanet 2022, 19
March 2022. https://framatube.org/w/cnVrAigLdumUSpYPkuU7v4
https://media.libreplanet.org/u/libreplanet/m/revitalizing-usenet/

[2]: Tristan Miller, Camille Paloque-Bergès, and Avery Dame-Griff.
Remembering Netizens: An interview with Ronda Hauben, co-author of
Netizens: On the history and impact of Usenet and the Internet (1997).
Internet Histories: Digital Technology, Culture and Society, 7(1):76–98,
2022. ISSN 2470-1483. DOI: 10.1080/24701475.2022.2123120.

--
Usenet Big-8 Management Board
https://www.big-8.org/
board@big-8.org

On 3/14/23 9:33 PM, Tristan Miller wrote:
> Greetings.

Hi Tristan,

> Yeah -- I'm not sure what's up with that.

I'm going to apply a form of Hanlon's razor and assume that something is
not working the way that people want it to.

> Yes, our talk (and probably most or all other talks at LibrePlanet) will
> be recorded and published online after the conference.

Cool.

> We briefly describe how moderated newsgroups work, some of the problems
> that Usenet's moderation system solves, and some of the problems that
> Usenet's moderation system creates.  We separately discuss the issue of
> censorship in Usenet versus censorship in centralized social media
> networks.

Ok, that makes more sense.

> The rest of the points you raise in your post are all valid ones, and
> ones that we're aware of.  Of course, it's possible to have a very long
> and intricate discussion about censorship and Usenet, but since this is
> only one of many topics we cover in the 40-minute talk, and because
> we're pitching it mostly at people who aren't already familiar with
> Usenet, we won't be going into too much detail.

It sounds more like you're giving a State of the Usenet type talk and
not as much a here's how we propose to fix Usenet type talk which I
incorrectly assumed.

Thank you for the clarification Tristan.

--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

TOP POST! I agree with everything Good Guy wrote in his post! Time to see internet conscious people online like the old days! regards, Christian (Norway on a Windows laptop)

On Wednesday, March 15, 2023 at 2:50:00 AM UTC+1, 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
> On 15/03/2023 00:32, G.K. wrote:
>
> Have you considered recording the talks? Youtube bingers and podcast junkies would find their way to it afterwards.
> You must be joking mate. Richard Stallman hates YouTube, Amazon, Google, Microsoft or anything that makes money by selling software or services. Get real.
>
>
> Arrest
> Dictator Putin
>
> We Stand
> With Ukraine
>
> Stop Putin
> Ukraine Under Attack
>
>
>
> --
> https://contact.mainsite.tk

Dear all,

On 15/03/2023 00.59, Usenet Big-8 Management Board wrote:
> Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
> talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
> social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].
>
> The talk will be given online on Sunday, 19 March 2023 from 13:35 EDT
> (UTC-4) to 14:20 EDT.  We will give an introduction to how Usenet works,
> compare it to more recent forms of social media, and discuss what we can
> learn from Usenet.

Video and audio recordings of our talk, as well as the slides, are now
available to download or to view on LibrePlanet's website
<https://media.libreplanet.org/u/libreplanet/m/federation-and-moderation-usenet-as-the-original-decentralized-social-network-slides/>,
as well as on PeerTube <https://framatube.org/w/jJiSmtQUrZh3cizjUvoTBo>.

Regards,
Tristan

--
Usenet Big-8 Management Board
https://www.big-8.org/
board@big-8.org

On 2023-04-19, Tristan Miller wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> On 15/03/2023 00.59, Usenet Big-8 Management Board wrote:
>> Members of the Usenet Big-8 Management Board [1] will be delivering a
>> talk, "Federation and moderation: Usenet as the original decentralized
>> social network", at the hybrid LibrePlanet 2023 conference [2].
>>
>> The talk will be given online on Sunday, 19 March 2023 from 13:35 EDT
>> (UTC-4) to 14:20 EDT.  We will give an introduction to how Usenet works,
>> compare it to more recent forms of social media, and discuss what we can
>> learn from Usenet.
>
>
> Video and audio recordings of our talk, as well as the slides, are now
> available to download or to view on LibrePlanet's website
><https://media.libreplanet.org/u/libreplanet/m/federation-and-moderation-usenet-as-the-original-decentralized-social-network-slides/>,
> as well as on PeerTube <https://framatube.org/w/jJiSmtQUrZh3cizjUvoTBo>.
>
> Regards,
> Tristan
>

Thanks Tristan, great talk. Handy having an overview I can share with
folks interested in the topic.

I think the discussion at the end covered a thought I've had for a
while -- the modern "fediverse" would be better designed as web
frontends to a usenet backend.

You mentioned a decentralized reddit clone -- I actually read subreddits
in slrn with my own nntp gateway! It lets me subscribe to
reddit.programming or whatever -- it works great for me. Sadly, I've
heard they're going to terminate free API access, so it will probably
stop working soon :(

Tavis.

--
_o) $ lynx lock.cmpxchg8b.com
/\\ _o) _o) $ finger taviso@sdf.org
_\_V _( ) _( ) @taviso

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> Tristan Miller <tmiller@big-8.org> wrote:
> >On 2023-03-14 20:24, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>
> >>We're not a social network. We're above Facebook [spit] friend/unfriend crap
>
> >Yes, Usenet is not a "social network" in the way the term is commonly
> >understood today, and we do describe the distinctions -- including the
> >notion of "friending" -- in the talk. But at least in academic circles,
> >Usenet had been studied as a "social network" (using that exact term,
> >albeit in a more generic sense) years before Facebook and its ilk existed.
>
> We're just Usenet.

Greetings, Group.

Pardon me for jumping into to an old thread but I find this topic quite
interesting. I've changed the Subject: I hope this is not unwelcome.

What is Usenet?

My favourite analogy for Usenet is that it's like a town with a number
of pubs. Each pub has a group of regulars chatting among themselves.
Occasionally strangers walk in, have a beer at a table, say nothing,
then walk out. They're the lurkers. Sometimes a visitor will strike up
a conversation at the bar, offend somebody, and be kicked out. Another
might find a friendly ear and stay a while, perhaps come back another
time. They're the new blood every pub needs to be viable.

Sometimes there's no conversation to be had anywhere so that guy either
gives up drinking or goes home to drink alone and maybe mumble to
himself and just watch TV. If he's desperate, he might go on FarceBook
to tell everybody about what he had for breakfast or to show his latest
family photos.

I'm thirsty; would anybody else here like a beer?

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe, PA, FIBS - Professional Crastinator.
My pet rock Gordon just is.

Google Groups articles not seen unless poster is whitelisted.

In news.groups Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:
> Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>
>> Tristan Miller <tmiller@big-8.org> wrote:
>> >On 2023-03-14 20:24, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>
>> >>We're not a social network. We're above Facebook [spit] friend/unfriend crap
>>
>> >Yes, Usenet is not a "social network" in the way the term is commonly
>> >understood today, and we do describe the distinctions -- including the
>> >notion of "friending" -- in the talk. But at least in academic circles,
>> >Usenet had been studied as a "social network" (using that exact term,
>> >albeit in a more generic sense) years before Facebook and its ilk existed.
>>
>> We're just Usenet.
>
> Greetings, Group.
>
> Pardon me for jumping into to an old thread but I find this topic quite
> interesting. I've changed the Subject: I hope this is not unwelcome.
>
> What is Usenet?
>
> My favourite analogy for Usenet is that it's like a town with a number
> of pubs. Each pub has a group of regulars chatting among themselves.
>
> Occasionally strangers walk in, have a beer at a table, say nothing,
> then walk out. They're the lurkers. Sometimes a visitor will strike up
> a conversation at the bar, offend somebody, and be kicked out. Another
> might find a friendly ear and stay a while, perhaps come back another
> time. They're the new blood every pub needs to be viable.

Interesting analogy and I like beer too, but contrary to a pub, you
cannot actually *kick* anyone out of Usenet.

> Sometimes there's no conversation to be had anywhere so that guy either
> gives up drinking or goes home to drink alone and maybe mumble to
> himself and just watch TV. If he's desperate, he might go on FarceBook
> to tell everybody about what he had for breakfast or to show his latest
> family photos.
>
> I'm thirsty; would anybody else here like a beer?

Here is another one:
Perhaps Usenet is like a [medieval]city with squares where groups of people
are chatting. Sometimes they are plenty, sometimes almost none. Sometimes
city administration tries to set/change *Rules and Holy Standards of Chat*
(like how to correclty introduce oneself in public, what dialect to use
etc.) which many don't want to comply with. There are many old-timers
and many just come and go. Some even speak different language which you
can hear but cannot understand. Occasionally, some wacky guy appears
screaming thus interrupting the talks and scattering flyers around (which
not many seem to bother reading). All kinds of city chaos.

How do you like it?

--
Best regards,
DrunkenThon.

Sn!pe wrote:
....
> What is Usenet?
....
> I'm thirsty; would anybody else here like a beer?

Yes.

I like your pub analogy. To some extent it applies to all "social
media" systems. And for those who get their panties in a wad about
applying "social media" to Usenet ... tough. Some of us have a much
more broad definition of that term than equating it with Facebook and
its ilk.

In my mind, "social media" started with email, and took a step up with
listserv. Then there were a bunch of steps to get to the place we are
today, including bulletin board systems, proprietary forums like
CompuServe, the ever-popular AOL, and web-based misinformation farms
that we have today.

Usenet was certainly one of many steps from the days of hand-written
letters to pen pals to where we are today. Technology moves on,
building on concepts that morph into different concepts. One day we
will be saying that about Facebook, although it rather boggles my mind
to consider what will be the norm by then.

By the way, this thread and the many similar ones recently posted don't
belong in news.groups, which is supposed to be for discussing newsgroups
themselves. I suppose that by posting this followup I am signing on to
the "more is better" philosophy where the content of "active" newsgroups
these days is material from other sources. At least this is original
content, even if it's in the wrong place.

DrunkenThon <drunkenthon@gmail.com> wrote:

> In news.groups Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> >> Tristan Miller <tmiller@big-8.org> wrote:
> >> >On 2023-03-14 20:24, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> >>
> >> >> We're not a social network. We're above Facebook [spit]
> >> >> friend/unfriend crap
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > Yes, Usenet is not a "social network" in the way the term is commonly
> >> > understood today, and we do describe the distinctions -- including the
> >> > notion of "friending" -- in the talk. But at least in academic circles,
> >> > Usenet had been studied as a "social network" (using that exact term,
> >> > albeit in a more generic sense) years before Facebook and its ilk existed
> >> >
> >>
> >> We're just Usenet.
> >>
> >
> > Greetings, Group.
> >
> > Pardon me for jumping into to an old thread but I find this topic quite
> > interesting. I've changed the Subject: I hope this is not unwelcome.
> >
> > What is Usenet?
> >
> > My favourite analogy for Usenet is that it's like a town with a number
> > of pubs. Each pub has a group of regulars chatting among themselves.
> >
> > Occasionally strangers walk in, have a beer at a table, say nothing,
> > then walk out. They're the lurkers. Sometimes a visitor will strike up
> > a conversation at the bar, offend somebody, and be kicked out. Another
> > might find a friendly ear and stay a while, perhaps come back another
> > time. They're the new blood every pub needs to be viable.
> >
>
> Interesting analogy and I like beer too, but contrary to a pub, you
> cannot actually *kick* anyone out of Usenet.
>

Yes indeed, but you can certainly be ostracised out of a group. It's a
simple matter of the group metaphorically turning their backs to the
interloper.

> >
> > Sometimes there's no conversation to be had anywhere so that guy either
> > gives up drinking or goes home to drink alone and maybe mumble to
> > himself and just watch TV. If he's desperate, he might go on FarceBook
> > to tell everybody about what he had for breakfast or to show his latest
> > family photos.
> >
> > I'm thirsty; would anybody else here like a beer?
> >
>
> Here is another one:
> Perhaps Usenet is like a [medieval]city with squares where groups of people
> are chatting. Sometimes they are plenty, sometimes almost none. Sometimes
> city administration tries to set/change *Rules and Holy Standards of Chat*
> (like how to correclty introduce oneself in public, what dialect to use
> etc.) which many don't want to comply with.
>

IMO it's just important to be polite and treat people as if you were
face to face rather than keyboard to keyboard. Then again, offense is
more often taken than given.

>
> There are many old-timers
> and many just come and go. Some even speak different language which you
> can hear but cannot understand. Occasionally, some wacky guy appears
> screaming thus interrupting the talks and scattering flyers around (which
> not many seem to bother reading). All kinds of city chaos.
>
> How do you like it?
>

Yes, I think that's quite apposite; here, have a lunatic's flyer.
Can I tempt you to a beer while we explore this further?

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe, PA, FIBS - Professional Crastinator.
My pet rock Gordon just is.

Google Groups articles not seen unless poster is whitelisted.

Steve Bonine <spb@pobox.com> wrote:

> Sn!pe wrote:
> ...
> > What is Usenet?
> ...
> > I'm thirsty; would anybody else here like a beer?
>
> Yes.
>
> I like your pub analogy. To some extent it applies to all "social
> media" systems. And for those who get their panties in a wad about
> applying "social media" to Usenet ... tough. Some of us have a much
> more broad definition of that term than equating it with Facebook and
> its ilk.
>
> In my mind, "social media" started with email, and took a step up with
> listserv. Then there were a bunch of steps to get to the place we are
> today, including bulletin board systems, proprietary forums like
> CompuServe, the ever-popular AOL, and web-based misinformation farms
> that we have today.
>

I was on Compu$erve to begin with. Fortunately, I took the leap into
Usenet before AOL borged C$ with all the negative consequences that that
had; Eternal September indeed.

>
> Usenet was certainly one of many steps from the days of hand-written
> letters to pen pals to where we are today. Technology moves on,
> building on concepts that morph into different concepts. One day we
> will be saying that about Facebook, although it rather boggles my mind
> to consider what will be the norm by then.
>
> By the way, this thread and the many similar ones recently posted don't
> belong in news.groups, which is supposed to be for discussing newsgroups
> themselves. I suppose that by posting this followup I am signing on to
> the "more is better" philosophy where the content of "active" newsgroups
> these days is material from other sources. At least this is original
> content, even if it's in the wrong place.
>

Apologies. I picked up this thread in alt.fan.usenet, to which I've
just subscribed. I'll set followups to there.

Thanks for your response, Steve.

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe, PA, FIBS - Professional Crastinator.
My pet rock Gordon just is.

Google Groups articles not seen unless poster is whitelisted.

In news.groups Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:
> DrunkenThon <drunkenthon@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> In news.groups Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>> >> Tristan Miller <tmiller@big-8.org> wrote:
>> >> >On 2023-03-14 20:24, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >> We're not a social network. We're above Facebook [spit]
>> >> >> friend/unfriend crap
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > Yes, Usenet is not a "social network" in the way the term is commonly
>> >> > understood today, and we do describe the distinctions -- including the
>> >> > notion of "friending" -- in the talk. But at least in academic circles,
>> >> > Usenet had been studied as a "social network" (using that exact term,
>> >> > albeit in a more generic sense) years before Facebook and its ilk existed
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> We're just Usenet.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Greetings, Group.
>> >
>> > Pardon me for jumping into to an old thread but I find this topic quite
>> > interesting. I've changed the Subject: I hope this is not unwelcome.
>> >
>> > What is Usenet?
>> >
>> > My favourite analogy for Usenet is that it's like a town with a number
>> > of pubs. Each pub has a group of regulars chatting among themselves.
>> >
>> > Occasionally strangers walk in, have a beer at a table, say nothing,
>> > then walk out. They're the lurkers. Sometimes a visitor will strike up
>> > a conversation at the bar, offend somebody, and be kicked out. Another
>> > might find a friendly ear and stay a while, perhaps come back another
>> > time. They're the new blood every pub needs to be viable.
>> >
>>
>> Interesting analogy and I like beer too, but contrary to a pub, you
>> cannot actually *kick* anyone out of Usenet.
>>
>
> Yes indeed, but you can certainly be ostracised out of a group. It's a
> simple matter of the group metaphorically turning their backs to the
> interloper.
>
>> >
>> > Sometimes there's no conversation to be had anywhere so that guy either
>> > gives up drinking or goes home to drink alone and maybe mumble to
>> > himself and just watch TV. If he's desperate, he might go on FarceBook
>> > to tell everybody about what he had for breakfast or to show his latest
>> > family photos.
>> >
>> > I'm thirsty; would anybody else here like a beer?
>> >
>>
>> Here is another one:
>> Perhaps Usenet is like a [medieval]city with squares where groups of people
>> are chatting. Sometimes they are plenty, sometimes almost none. Sometimes
>> city administration tries to set/change *Rules and Holy Standards of Chat*
>> (like how to correclty introduce oneself in public, what dialect to use
>> etc.) which many don't want to comply with.
>>
>
> IMO it's just important to be polite and treat people as if you were
> face to face rather than keyboard to keyboard. Then again, offense is
> more often taken than given.

True, but those are the rules of conduct. People generally try to follow
them (more or less), bit that somewhat depends on discipline, erudition,
education (even the mood sometimes) etc, i.e. more of a personal matter.
By *Rules and Holy Standards of Chat* I meant different RFCs and literally
the *standards* themselves (the technical part).

>> There are many old-timers
>> and many just come and go. Some even speak different language which you
>> can hear but cannot understand. Occasionally, some wacky guy appears
>> screaming thus interrupting the talks and scattering flyers around (which
>> not many seem to bother reading). All kinds of city chaos.
>>
>> How do you like it?
>>
>
> Yes, I think that's quite apposite; here, have a lunatic's flyer.

Well, you can refuse to take it (or I just couldn't understand the
"lunatic's flyer" metaphor) :)

> Can I tempt you to a beer while we explore this further?

Sure, let's have some.

--
Best regards,
DrunkenThon.

Sn!pe <snipeco.1@gmail.com> wrote:

>>. . .

>IMO it's just important to be polite and treat people as if you were
>face to face rather than keyboard to keyboard. Then again, offense is
>more often taken than given.

People are tempted to smack me in person, too.

DrunkenThon <drunkenthon@gmail.com> wrote:
[...]
> >> There are many old-timers
> >> and many just come and go. Some even speak different language which you
> >> can hear but cannot understand. Occasionally, some wacky guy appears
> >> screaming thus interrupting the talks and scattering flyers around (which
> >> not many seem to bother reading). All kinds of city chaos.
> >>
> >> How do you like it?
> >>
> >
> > Yes, I think that's quite apposite; here, have a lunatic's flyer.
> >
>
> Well, you can refuse to take it (or I just couldn't understand the
> "lunatic's flyer" metaphor) :
[...]

That was just me alluding to "Occasionally, some wacky guy appears
screaming thus interrupting the talks and scattering flyers around
(which not many seem to bother reading)." I could do that job. :)

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe, PA, FIBS - Professional Crastinator.
My pet rock Gordon just is.

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[afu only]

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> Sn!pe <snipeco.1@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>. . .
>
> >IMO it's just important to be polite and treat people as if you were
> >face to face rather than keyboard to keyboard. Then again, offense is
> >more often taken than given.
>
> People are tempted to smack me in person, too.

I wonder why that might be... :)

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe, PA, FIBS - Professional Crastinator.
My pet rock Gordon just is.

Google Groups articles not seen unless poster is whitelisted.

In news.groups Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:
> DrunkenThon <drunkenthon@gmail.com> wrote:
> [...]
>> >> There are many old-timers
>> >> and many just come and go. Some even speak different language which you
>> >> can hear but cannot understand. Occasionally, some wacky guy appears
>> >> screaming thus interrupting the talks and scattering flyers around (which
>> >> not many seem to bother reading). All kinds of city chaos.
>> >>
>> >> How do you like it?
>> >>
>> >
>> > Yes, I think that's quite apposite; here, have a lunatic's flyer.
>> >
>>
>> Well, you can refuse to take it (or I just couldn't understand the
>> "lunatic's flyer" metaphor) :
> [...]
>
> That was just me alluding to "Occasionally, some wacky guy appears
> screaming thus interrupting the talks and scattering flyers around
> (which not many seem to bother reading)." I could do that job. :)

Oh, I see. But that wacky guy was my silly analogy to spam, of course. ;)

--
Best regards,
DrunkenThon.