I had no idea that there was a Gemini newsgroup! Happy to see this
exists and is fairly active! (Compared to other newsgroups I'm in, anyway)

So. Hi!

----
Cobra! (gemini://cobradile.cities.yesterweb.org)

It's all we've got!

--
gemini://kwiecien.us/

and that's not a bad thing, bring back the text based net :d

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Kévin wrote:
> and that's not a bad thing, bring back the text based net :d

Don't think the "text-based 'net" ever really went away. Just that the
majority found the point-and-drool web and never really went farther :D

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--
|_|O|_| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|_|_|O| PGP: DDAB 23FB 19FA 7D85 1CC1 E067 6D65 70E5 4CE7 2860
|O|O|O|

Cobra! <cobradile@disroot.org> writes:

> I had no idea that there was a Gemini newsgroup! Happy to see this
> exists and is fairly active! (Compared to other newsgroups I'm in,
> anyway)
>
> So. Hi!
>
> ----
> Cobra! (gemini://cobradile.cities.yesterweb.org)
>

Hi, welcome aboard.

--
Ang kalayaan ay dili gihatag, ini'y giabot.
--
{gemini,gopher}://kalayaan.xyz

On 2022-02-15, Kévin <kevin@oh.mg> wrote:
> and that's not a bad thing, bring back the text based net :d

I like that Usenet is text-based, but I *really* like how well it operates as a
store-and-forward protocol (e-mail was great for this too... once).

I absolutely can envision a lifestyle where my net access depends on the day
being sunny or windy, so being able to spool up a bunch of things to read and
messages to send to the rest of the world will be clutch. I'm super excited by
ploum's work on Offpunk (which I haven't actually started using yet -- it's on
my list though).

Also, hello everybody!

--d

On 2022-05-14, dunne <degrowther@protonmail.com> wrote:
> I like that Usenet is text-based, but I *really* like how well it operates as a
> store-and-forward protocol (e-mail was great for this too... once).

Usenet's simplicity in flood-filling does make it a very resilient
protocol. That said, NNTP is pretty crufty as a protocol. It has both
stateful and stateless bits. The existing clients all speak variations
of the RFC. SMTP has pretty similar problems, from what I can tell. It
doesn't have a concept of hierarchy the way NNTP (loosely) does.

I realize that Usenet isn't the same as NNTP and that is a valid
distinction which is interesting to explore.

> I absolutely can envision a lifestyle where my net access depends on the day
> being sunny or windy, so being able to spool up a bunch of things to read and
> messages to send to the rest of the world will be clutch. I'm super excited by
> ploum's work on Offpunk (which I haven't actually started using yet -- it's on
> my list though).

I already do that now. I have a leafnode server on a private network
which pulls from a paid Usenet service (and aggregates some other
servers that I've written) which I access. Most of my clients use
slrnpull to maintain a local spool for their own reading/writing. I'm
frequently using this setup on trains/planes to read/write Usenet,
Reddit, and HN content (well write the first, I haven't setup writing
on the other two yet).

The two big problems are lack of phone UX and overzealous
firewalls. One can use termux on an Android phone but that's pretty
obnoxious as few terminal newsreaders are easily usable by phone
(reading is passable.) Firewalls are the worst and I've been behind
crappy hotel/cafe firewalls that block anything but TCP traffic on 443
and 80. I usually get around this by having my laptop tether to my
smartphone over mobile data, whereupon I fetch news, and then turn my
mobile data off. I can probably try to push a Wireguard tunnel through
udp2raw but I haven't bothered when I can resort to tethering.

>
> Also, hello everybody!
>
> --d

meff wrote:
>
> That said, NNTP is pretty crufty as a protocol. It has both
> stateful and stateless bits. The existing clients all speak variations
> of the RFC. SMTP has pretty similar problems, from what I can tell. It
> doesn't have a concept of hierarchy the way NNTP (loosely) does.

What I noticed recently is that many Internet application protocols are
fundamentally file transfer protocols: I have a file on my machine, and I
want to store or access it on another machine.

NNTP
HTTP
SMTP
POP
IMAP
FTP (obviously)
Gemini
Gopher
..... and others are all fundamentally file transfer

--
]DF$
The New Apple II User's Guide:
https://macgui.com/newa2guide/

On 2022-05-25, D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> wrote:
> meff wrote:
>>
>> That said, NNTP is pretty crufty as a protocol. It has both
>> stateful and stateless bits. The existing clients all speak variations
>> of the RFC. SMTP has pretty similar problems, from what I can tell. It
>> doesn't have a concept of hierarchy the way NNTP (loosely) does.
>
> What I noticed recently is that many Internet application protocols are
> fundamentally file transfer protocols: I have a file on my machine, and I
> want to store or access it on another machine.
>
> NNTP
> HTTP
> SMTP
> POP
> IMAP
> FTP (obviously)
> Gemini
> Gopher
> .... and others are all fundamentally file transfer

This is a good observation 🙂. File transfer protocols were some of
the earliest forms of RPC. Some of the original RPCs were developed as
OTT Modem protocols, like XMODEM and its descendants.

One of the reasons I like HTTP so much as a protocol is that it's
fundamentally stateless, which means it's basically a light layer of
human-readable ASCII framing atop arbitrary data. HTTP of course has
its warts. All I'd ever want from a network protocol is a bit of
framing around a bag of bytes. Something that gives me more
descriptive capabilities than the header of a single packet, and lets
me tie multiple packets together to a coherent "action". It's why I
hate protocols like SIP (and RTSP to some extent) which try to be very
opinionated on sending data.

I forget where in the gemini-sphere I saw it but someone is working o na
client that just fetches content at predefined times for offline
consumption.

Which honestly kinda interests me given my personal history. However
that client is TUI which would kinda kill it for tablets/smart phones
(which I see s the best clients for such.) Anyone know if lagrange can
do running arcives of a given capsule?

On 5/14/22 1:12 PM, dunne wrote:
> On 2022-02-15, Kévin <kevin@oh.mg> wrote:
>> and that's not a bad thing, bring back the text based net :d
>
> I like that Usenet is text-based, but I *really* like how well it operates as a
> store-and-forward protocol (e-mail was great for this too... once).
>
> I absolutely can envision a lifestyle where my net access depends on the day
> being sunny or windy, so being able to spool up a bunch of things to read and
> messages to send to the rest of the world will be clutch. I'm super excited by
> ploum's work on Offpunk (which I haven't actually started using yet -- it's on
> my list though).
>
> Also, hello everybody!
>
> --d

On 2022-11-02, Andrew <singletona082@gmail.com> wrote:
> I forget where in the gemini-sphere I saw it but someone is working o na
> client that just fetches content at predefined times for offline
> consumption.
>
> Which honestly kinda interests me given my personal history. However
> that client is TUI which would kinda kill it for tablets/smart phones
> (which I see s the best clients for such.) Anyone know if lagrange can
> do running arcives of a given capsule?

It was probably offpunk? https://notabug.org/ploum/offpunk/

That's it. Thank you.

Still wish there was a graphical version, or just Lagrange subsuming
this as part of its feature set (mostly because lagrange has
windows/linux and android clients more so than 'i like lagrange')

On 11/11/2022 10:28 AM, TJP wrote:
> It was probably offpunk? https://notabug.org/ploum/offpunk/

Sorry if I'm late to the party...

Does anybody know what it would take to get gemini support into lynx
https/gopher/ftp/nntp/wais browser?

I found some exploratory conversation on the lynx mailing list from 2020
(visiblink, dcav, etc participated), but if I remember right gemini was
being heavily bikeshedded then, and now has settled into a more-or-less
finished protocol.

Has anyone tried submitting a patch, corresponding with the maintainer,
or forking it since then?

Anna

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On 2023-01-06, Anna K wrote:
> Sorry if I'm late to the party...
>
> Does anybody know what it would take to get gemini support into lynx
> https/gopher/ftp/nntp/wais browser?

Writing the support in for the gmi protocol, and as you noted,
submitting the relevant pull request for the patch.

One of those "it's probably easier said than done" scenarios (not that
I'd necessarily expect it's overly difficult -- I've just never looked
at the lynx source, nor that deeply into the gmi protocol itself).

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--
|_|O|_|
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: DDAB 23FB 19FA 7D85 1CC1 E067 6D65 70E5 4CE7 2860

I like elinks

--
gemini://kwiecien.us/

On Fri, 6 Jan 2023 15:48:09 -0500
Anna K <agk@sdf.invalid> wrote:

> Sorry if I'm late to the party...
>
> Does anybody know what it would take to get gemini support into lynx
> https/gopher/ftp/nntp/wais browser?
>
> I found some exploratory conversation on the lynx mailing list from
> 2020 (visiblink, dcav, etc participated), but if I remember right
> gemini was being heavily bikeshedded then, and now has settled into a
> more-or-less finished protocol.
>
> Has anyone tried submitting a patch, corresponding with the
> maintainer, or forking it since then?
>
> Anna

I don't really know. I asked the question on the mailing list and they
responded that someone should submit a patch. That's fair. I can
program in C, but not well enough to risk every lynx user's security...

So at this point, I make use of Michael Lazar's gemini proxy. It works
quite well.

Just add https://portal.mozz.us/gemini/ before the gemini address in
your bookmarks. It's a workaround, but it's good enough.

Visiblink <visiblink@mail.invalid> wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Jan 2023 15:48:09 -0500
> Anna K <agk@sdf.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> I found some exploratory conversation on the lynx mailing list from
>> 2020 (visiblink, dcav, etc participated), but if I remember right
>> gemini was being heavily bikeshedded then, and now has settled into a
>> more-or-less finished protocol.
>>
>> Has anyone tried submitting a patch, corresponding with the
>> maintainer, or forking it since then?
>
> I don't really know. I asked the question on the mailing list and they
> responded that someone should submit a patch. That's fair. I can
> program in C, but not well enough to risk every lynx user's security...

In theory the lynxcgi URL is like a basic plug-in system, so you
could potentially write a Gemini plug-in for Lynx.

https://lynx.invisible-island.net/lynx_help/lynx_url_support.html#cgi_url

It's very much like the Dillo plug-in system. Dillo has a Gemini
plug-in which is actually just a Bash script that fetches Gemini
pages and converts them to HTML. So it shouldn't be hard to adapt
that to work with Lynx.

Dillo-Gemini plug-in:
https://git.scuttlebot.io/%25V0D7DtSnZyyAp1NbgOJF2ZAFMeUy9eXwyClCEKYUYAI%3D.sha256

The only difficulty is that it doesn't look like Lynx can associate
new protocols to lynxcgi scripts, so gemini:// links wouldn't work
directly like in Dillo. It seem you'd have to make a HTML form
similar to a Gemini proxy website, and always enter Gemini URLs
into that instead of into Lynx directly.

--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#

I genuinely did not know Dillo had a gemini plugin. That is neat as all
get out. Also a fun demonstration of how little you need for gemini.

'Here, convert this to HTML so browser knows what it's looking at.'

'Why? dedicated browsers are a thing.'

'Why not? We can do it, so we will.'