...beautiful, my beautiful... Chinese Spy Balloon!!!

So this morning I am watching the local news (NBC affiliate), and they
mention that a UFO was sighted over Montana and US officials had determined
it was a spy balloon, likely from China. Apparently it wafted across the
US-Canadian border sometime mid-week.

They also said that the decision on what to do about it went all the way up
to President Biden, who said we couldn't shoot it down because it might "fall
and hurt someone."

Now, Montana is a very large and very sparsely populated state. Some of
the states it would have had to have crossed through to get to its current
position (apparently over Kansas City, MO) are also very sparsely
populated. Plenty of opportunity to shoot it down and have it likely not
fall on anything, except a corn field or a former government missle silo
site.

Now that they've waited until it is over more populated areas, they are going
to let it continue its flight across the country, until it reaches the Gulf
or the Atlantic or falls down on its own rather than shoot it down.

So, if you live in its path, you might want to go outside and give the
Chinese government something to look at. :(

Our government seems as clueless, and vulnerable, as they did right
before 9/11.

* SLMR 2.1a * His mind is not for rent / To any god or government

---
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Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
By: Dumas Walker to ALL on Fri Feb 03 2023 03:59 pm

> going to let it continue its flight across the country, until it reaches the
> Gulf
> or the Atlantic or falls down on its own rather than shoot it down.
>
> So, if you live in its path, you might want to go outside and give the
> Chinese government something to look at. :(
>
> Our government seems as clueless, and vulnerable, as they did right
> before 9/11.
>

exactly. very pathetic.

too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.
---
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-=> MRO wrote to Dumas Walker <=-

> going to let it continue its flight across the country, until it reaches the
> Gulf
> or the Atlantic or falls down on its own rather than shoot it down.
>
> So, if you live in its path, you might want to go outside and give the
> Chinese government something to look at. :(
>
> Our government seems as clueless, and vulnerable, as they did right
> before 9/11.

MR> exactly. very pathetic.
MR> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.

Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000 feet
altitude? Thanks.

Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.

.... Ignorance can be cured. Stupid is forever.
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
By: Gamgee to MRO on Fri Feb 03 2023 09:20 pm

MR>> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.

Ga> Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000 feet
Ga> altitude? Thanks.

Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.

Your local hobby shop should have one of those, right? ;)

Nightfox

---
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Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
By: Dumas Walker to ALL on Fri Feb 03 2023 03:59 pm

> ...beautiful, my beautiful... Chinese Spy Balloon!!!
>
> So this morning I am watching the local news (NBC affiliate), and they
> mention that a UFO was sighted over Montana and US officials had determined
> it was a spy balloon, likely from China. Apparently it wafted across the
> US-Canadian border sometime mid-week.
>
> They also said that the decision on what to do about it went all the way up
> to President Biden, who said we couldn't shoot it down because it might "fal
> and hurt someone."
>
> Now, Montana is a very large and very sparsely populated state. Some of
> the states it would have had to have crossed through to get to its current
> position (apparently over Kansas City, MO) are also very sparsely
> populated. Plenty of opportunity to shoot it down and have it likely not
> fall on anything, except a corn field or a former government missle silo
> site.
>
> Now that they've waited until it is over more populated areas, they are goin
> to let it continue its flight across the country, until it reaches the Gulf
> or the Atlantic or falls down on its own rather than shoot it down.
>
> So, if you live in its path, you might want to go outside and give the
> Chinese government something to look at. :(
>
> Our government seems as clueless, and vulnerable, as they did right
> before 9/11.
>
>
> * SLMR 2.1a * His mind is not for rent / To any god or government
>
I get th impression it's being left up to draw attention of other countries.
It's like saying to the world thta China must not have that good of satellite
surviellance if they rely on a big balloon.Of course, they claim it is a
weather balloon. No one believes that. Shame on China.

---
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-=> Nightfox wrote to Gamgee <=-

MR>> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.

Ga> Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000 feet
Ga> altitude? Thanks.

Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.

Ni> Your local hobby shop should have one of those, right? ;)

You'd think they would, but maybe they've had a rush on these lately,
with all the folks wanting to be the hero who takes this thing down.

I think it's pretty hard to find one with the Piercer accessory, though.
;-)

.... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.
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Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
By: Moondog to Dumas Walker on Sat Feb 04 2023 03:15 am

>
> I get th impression it's being left up to draw attention of other countries.
> It's like saying to the world thta China must not have that good of
> satellite surviellance if they rely on a big balloon.Of course, they claim
> it is a weather balloon. No one believes that. Shame on China.

maybe it's a way to test us. we showed them that we let it cross the entire united states until shooting it down on the east coast when it was finished.
---
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: Gamgee to MRO on Fri Feb 03 2023 09:20 pm

> -=> MRO wrote to Dumas Walker <=-
>
> > going to let it continue its flight across the country, until it reaches
> > Gulf
> > or the Atlantic or falls down on its own rather than shoot it down.
> >
> > So, if you live in its path, you might want to go outside and give the
> > Chinese government something to look at. :(
> >
> > Our government seems as clueless, and vulnerable, as they did right
> > before 9/11.
>
> MR> exactly. very pathetic.
> MR> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.
>
> Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000 feet
> altitude? Thanks.
>
> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.
>
>
>
> ... Ignorance can be cured. Stupid is forever.

Commercial GPS modules are limited by the gov't regarding operation range.
hy are restricted in speed and altitude. They don't want home brew guided
mnissiles.
20 years ago a New Zealander made aclaim it is possible to build a cruise
missile for under $15000 at the time, and he wasn't taken very seriously. He
started a build log, leaving out technical stuff to a minimum. When he
scheduled a flightplan with the New Zealand version of the FAA, they took him
seriously. And so did the US. He sells high end model planes and he was
restricted in selling certain technology to customers in the Middle East. In
order to function with commercial GPS chips, he kept his flight plan to
lower altitudes and lower speeds. In stead of making a mach 4 missile he
made a WWII style pulse jet similar to a V-1 rocket. It would fly along at
300-400 mph and fly a level course along several waypoints (low altitude
object avoidance, fly below radar.)

---
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: Nightfox to Gamgee on Fri Feb 03 2023 10:30 pm

> Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
> By: Gamgee to MRO on Fri Feb 03 2023 09:20 pm
>
> MR>> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.
>
> Ga> Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000 feet
> Ga> altitude? Thanks.
>
> Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.
>
> Your local hobby shop should have one of those, right? ;)
>
> Nightfox
>
Civiliian GPS is hobbled so it has an altitude and speed restriction. The gov
't is afraid of people making ballistic missiles.

---
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> I get th impression it's being left up to draw attention of other countries.
> It's like saying to the world thta China must not have that good of satellite
> surviellance if they rely on a big balloon.Of course, they claim it is a
> weather balloon. No one believes that. Shame on China.

If you are able to fly balloons over your target, and nothing happens, why
waste money to launch a satellite? I have heard the weather balloon claim
as well as that it might have been launched by a non-government entity but,
yeah, no one believes that.

There are supposedly now two of them.

The weather has been very clear in some of the areas it was sighted in.
Makes me wonder if it happens more often than we know, and it was only
exposed because civilians noticed it this time.

* SLMR 2.1a * Do ministers do more than lay people?

---
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> Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.

> Your local hobby shop should have one of those, right? ;)

It would be pretty hilarious if the government says they cannot bring it
down safely and then some Joe Schmo brings it down with some hobby
equipment. :D

* SLMR 2.1a * Those who live by the sword... kill those who don't.

---
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: Moondog to Nightfox on Sat Feb 04 2023 12:20 pm

> Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
> By: Nightfox to Gamgee on Fri Feb 03 2023 10:30 pm
>
> > Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
> > By: Gamgee to MRO on Fri Feb 03 2023 09:20 pm
>
> > MR>> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.
>
> > Ga> Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000
> > Ga> feet altitude? Thanks.
>
> > Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.

oh i see my buddy gamgee who i block is replying to me.
I'm sure the govt has drones that can fly that high. also the altitude
from the balloon was changing. the govt certainly has unmanned aircraft that can intercept a balloon the size of 3 school buses.

BALLOON SO HARD! SO HARD TO GET BALLOON!

i can tell you voted for biden, gamgee.

> Civiliian GPS is hobbled so it has an altitude and speed restriction. The
> gov 't is afraid of people making ballistic missiles.

people could see the huge balloon. it was also somewhat manuverable.
---
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: Dumas Walker to NIGHTFOX on Sat Feb 04 2023 10:58 am

> > Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.
>
> > Your local hobby shop should have one of those, right? ;)
>
> It would be pretty hilarious if the government says they cannot bring it
> down safely and then some Joe Schmo brings it down with some hobby
> equipment. :D
>

honestly i was expecting elon musk to do something.
just for laughs.
---
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-=> Moondog wrote to Gamgee <=-

> MR> exactly. very pathetic.
> MR> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.

> Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000 feet
> altitude? Thanks.
>
> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.

Mo> Commercial GPS modules are limited by the gov't regarding
Mo> operation range. hy are restricted in speed and altitude. They
Mo> don't want home brew guided mnissiles.
Mo> 20 years ago a New Zealander made aclaim it is possible to build
Mo> a cruise missile for under $15000 at the time, and he wasn't
Mo> taken very seriously. He started a build log, leaving out
Mo> technical stuff to a minimum. When he scheduled a flightplan
Mo> with the New Zealand version of the FAA, they took him seriously.
Mo> And so did the US. He sells high end model planes and he was
Mo> restricted in selling certain technology to customers in the
Mo> Middle East. In order to function with commercial GPS chips, he
Mo> kept his flight plan to lower altitudes and lower speeds. In
Mo> stead of making a mach 4 missile he made a WWII style pulse jet
Mo> similar to a V-1 rocket. It would fly along at 300-400 mph and
Mo> fly a level course along several waypoints (low altitude object
Mo> avoidance, fly below radar.)

Cool story. Not sure what it's got to do with the topic under
discussion..., but still cool.

.... Diplomacy is saying 'Nice Doggy' until you find a rock.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
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> > It would be pretty hilarious if the government says they cannot bring it
> > down safely and then some Joe Schmo brings it down with some hobby
> > equipment. :D

> honestly i was expecting elon musk to do something.
> just for laughs.

If someone had the tech to go up that high, grab it, and bring it back, it
would probably be him. Now that it has happened, it would not surprise me
if he doesn't figure out how to do it.

* SLMR 2.1a * On the other hand, you have different fingers.

---
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> Cool story. Not sure what it's got to do with the topic under
> discussion..., but still cool.

Using non-government technology to bring the balloon down was how I think
we got to this. It is an interesting story for sure.

* SLMR 2.1a * /////////// POLICE TAGLINE - DO NOT CROSS \\\\\\\\\\\\\

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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: Dumas Walker to MRO on Sun Feb 05 2023 09:57 am

> > > It would be pretty hilarious if the government says they cannot bring
> > > it down safely and then some Joe Schmo brings it down with some hobby
> > > equipment. :D
>
> > honestly i was expecting elon musk to do something.
> > just for laughs.
>
> If someone had the tech to go up that high, grab it, and bring it back, it
> would probably be him. Now that it has happened, it would not surprise me
> if he doesn't figure out how to do it.
>

it's just a balloon that went up high. despite the us govt actions, it's not impossible to take down.
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-=> Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

> Cool story. Not sure what it's got to do with the topic under
> discussion..., but still cool.

DW> Using non-government technology to bring the balloon down was how
DW> I think we got to this. It is an interesting story for sure.

Yes, maybe that was the angle. I thought it was more about how to get a
non-government aircraft/device up to the balloon, which was at 60,000+
feet of altitude. There aren't many (any?) planes that can fly that
high, and the original "idea" was to use a "drone"... ;-)

.... Diplomacy is saying 'Nice Doggy' until you find a rock.
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-=> MRO wrote to Dumas Walker <=-

> > > It would be pretty hilarious if the government says they cannot bring
> > > it down safely and then some Joe Schmo brings it down with some hobby
> > > equipment. :D

> > honestly i was expecting elon musk to do something.
> > just for laughs.

> If someone had the tech to go up that high, grab it, and bring it back, it
> would probably be him. Now that it has happened, it would not surprise me
> if he doesn't figure out how to do it.

MR> it's just a balloon that went up high. despite the us govt
MR> actions, it's not impossible to take down.

Again I ask - what hobby/non-govt equipment can get up to 60000+ feet,
and then take it down?

.... Just because it's dead doesn't mean it can't move.
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Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
By: MRO to Moondog on Sat Feb 04 2023 02:36 pm

> Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
> By: Moondog to Dumas Walker on Sat Feb 04 2023 03:15 am
>
> >
> > I get th impression it's being left up to draw attention of other countri
> > It's like saying to the world thta China must not have that good of
> > satellite surviellance if they rely on a big balloon.Of course, they clai
> > it is a weather balloon. No one believes that. Shame on China.
>
> maybe it's a way to test us. we showed them that we let it cross the entire

It's route was over a bunch of sites they could easily keep track of with
satellite. A ballon would take weeks to get here over the North Pole and
Canada so if they wanted to catch or observe something special, they would
have to have ample time to know what and where to look for. It was left up
there to draw attention to the antics of the Chinese government. Any signals
that came from it could've been captured and decrypted by the CIA.

---
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Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
By: Dumas Walker to MOONDOG on Sat Feb 04 2023 10:13 am

> > I get th impression it's being left up to draw attention of other countrie
> > It's like saying to the world thta China must not have that good of satell
> > surviellance if they rely on a big balloon.Of course, they claim it is a
> > weather balloon. No one believes that. Shame on China.
>
> If you are able to fly balloons over your target, and nothing happens, why
> waste money to launch a satellite? I have heard the weather balloon claim
> as well as that it might have been launched by a non-government entity but,
> yeah, no one believes that.
>
> There are supposedly now two of them.
>
> The weather has been very clear in some of the areas it was sighted in.
> Makes me wonder if it happens more often than we know, and it was only
> exposed because civilians noticed it this time.
>
>
> * SLMR 2.1a * Do ministers do more than lay people?
>

The satellites already exist. The idea behind drones and recon aircraft is
to view events in real time. That is what is screwy behind using a balloon.
It takes days if not weeks to float a ballon over the North Pole , and it's
path is victim to the weather patterns. You would have to know of an event
well before floating a ballon with intent to capture something you couldn't
observe using satellite.

---
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: Dumas Walker to NIGHTFOX on Sat Feb 04 2023 10:58 am

> > Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.
>
> > Your local hobby shop should have one of those, right? ;)
>
> It would be pretty hilarious if the government says they cannot bring it
> down safely and then some Joe Schmo brings it down with some hobby
> equipment. :D
>
>
> * SLMR 2.1a * Those who live by the sword... kill those who don't.
>
The ballon flew at 66,000 feet. Off the shelf GPS modules do not operate at
speeds over 1000 knots and altitudes over 60,000 feet. You need a fighter
jet or a missile to intercept it.

---
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: MRO to Moondog on Sat Feb 04 2023 04:22 pm

> Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
> By: Moondog to Nightfox on Sat Feb 04 2023 12:20 pm
>
> > Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
> > By: Nightfox to Gamgee on Fri Feb 03 2023 10:30 pm
> >
> > > Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
> > > By: Gamgee to MRO on Fri Feb 03 2023 09:20 pm
> >
> > > MR>> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.
> >
> > > Ga> Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000
> > > Ga> feet altitude? Thanks.
> >
> > > Ga> Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.
>
>
> oh i see my buddy gamgee who i block is replying to me.
> I'm sure the govt has drones that can fly that high. also the altitude
> from the balloon was changing. the govt certainly has unmanned aircraft tha
>
> BALLOON SO HARD! SO HARD TO GET BALLOON!
>
> i can tell you voted for biden, gamgee.
>
> > Civiliian GPS is hobbled so it has an altitude and speed restriction. Th
> > gov 't is afraid of people making ballistic missiles.
>
> people could see the huge balloon. it was also somewhat manuverable.

It was also at 66,000 feet. Non-military GPS limits altitude to 60,000 feet a
nd speds under 1000 knots. Whatever you want to hit it with would have
operate outside the bounds of commercial grade equipment

---
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Re: Re: Up, Up, and away, in
By: Gamgee to Moondog on Sat Feb 04 2023 08:08 pm

> -=> Moondog wrote to Gamgee <=-
>
> > MR> exactly. very pathetic.
> > MR> too bad nobody flew a drone up there to pierce it or something.
>
> > Can you tell me where I can buy a drone that can fly up to 60,000 feet
> > altitude? Thanks.
> >
> > Oh, and it's gotta have a "piercer" on it too.
>
> Mo> Commercial GPS modules are limited by the gov't regarding
> Mo> operation range. hy are restricted in speed and altitude. They
> Mo> don't want home brew guided mnissiles.
> Mo> 20 years ago a New Zealander made aclaim it is possible to build
> Mo> a cruise missile for under $15000 at the time, and he wasn't
> Mo> taken very seriously. He started a build log, leaving out
> Mo> technical stuff to a minimum. When he scheduled a flightplan
> Mo> with the New Zealand version of the FAA, they took him seriously.
> Mo> And so did the US. He sells high end model planes and he was
> Mo> restricted in selling certain technology to customers in the
> Mo> Middle East. In order to function with commercial GPS chips, he
> Mo> kept his flight plan to lower altitudes and lower speeds. In
> Mo> stead of making a mach 4 missile he made a WWII style pulse jet
> Mo> similar to a V-1 rocket. It would fly along at 300-400 mph and
> Mo> fly a level course along several waypoints (low altitude object
> Mo> avoidance, fly below radar.)
>
> Cool story. Not sure what it's got to do with the topic under
> discussion..., but still cool.
>
>
>
> ... Diplomacy is saying 'Nice Doggy' until you find a rock.

If a civillian wanted build a missile to shoot something like that down, it
would have to travel at speeds less than 1000 knots and be guided in some
other way than GPS over 60,000 feet. 20 years ago a cruise missile could be
made ofr $15,000. I imagine one could made for under $10k

---
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Re: Up, Up, and away, in my..
By: Moondog to MRO on Sun Feb 05 2023 11:25 am

> It's route was over a bunch of sites they could easily keep track of with
> satellite. A ballon would take weeks to get here over the North Pole and
> Canada so if they wanted to catch or observe something special, they would
> have to have ample time to know what and where to look for. It was left up
> there to draw attention to the antics of the Chinese government. Any
> signals that came from it could've been captured and decrypted by the CIA.

This very large balloon, manuverable with sensors. Perhaps
the sensors on the airship were more advanced than satellite tech.
---
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