On 2021-08-07 11:10 a.m., Commander Kinsey wrote:
> On Thu, 05 Aug 2021 23:15:10 +0100, Snit <brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Aug 5, 2021 at 11:11:56 AM MST, ""Commander Kinsey"" wrote
>> <op.07nzh6bamvhs6z@ryzen.lan>:
>>
>>> On Mon, 02 Aug 2021 20:57:58 +0100, Snit <brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Aug 2, 2021 at 11:29:36 AM MST, ""Commander Kinsey"" wrote
>>>> <op.07igbm03mvhs6z@ryzen.lan>:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, 31 Jul 2021 20:00:50 +0100, Snit
>>>>> <brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 31, 2021 at 10:50:45 AM MST, ""Commander Kinsey"" wrote
>>>>>> <op.07eo6vjymvhs6z@ryzen.lan>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, 30 Jul 2021 19:22:12 +0100, Snit
>>>>>>> <brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 2021 at 11:13:39 AM MST, ""Commander Kinsey"" wrote
>>>>>>>> <op.07cvk1c4mvhs6z@ryzen.lan>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 28 Jul 2021 19:01:25 +0100, Snit
>>>>>>>>> <brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 28, 2021 at 10:33:10 AM MST, ""Commander Kinsey"" wrote
>>>>>>>>>> <op.0684dkasmvhs6z@ryzen.lan>:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2021 18:16:42 +0100, Snit
>>>>>>>>>>> <brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2021 at 6:39:23 AM MST, ""Commander Kinsey"" wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>> <op.06437xjnmvhs6z@ryzen.lan>:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Buying back guns from lawful owners simply means that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> when the thugs who
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> got them illegally decide to commit crimes, nobody will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be able to stop
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them. If your country gives you the right and the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ability to defend
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> yourself, why the heck would you sacrifice it?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The idea is the thugs are less likely to be able to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> obtain one (eg. by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stealing it from a legal owner).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's interesting reasoning but it doesn't seem to be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> realistic. Besides,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> considering how tyrannical the governments of the world
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have already
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> become with their reaction to the Kung Flu,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Agreed on that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> They should be requiring vaccinations for more things. End
>>>>>>>>>>>> the damned
>>>>>>>>>>>> pandemic.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Forcing anyone to do anything is always wrong.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It's just a bad flu!  Stop making a mountain out of a molehill!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It is not a flu, nor is it very similar to one other than how
>>>>>>>>>> it spreads.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It makes you feel like anything form "a bad cold" to "a horrid
>>>>>>>>> flu" from what
>>>>>>>>> people have said.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And it leaves 1/3 of those with it with lasting damage.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've not seen any evidence of this theory.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/monumental-acknowledgment-cdc-reports-long-term-covid-19-patients-n1234814
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Plenty more I can show... and we can go back to the original studies.
>>>>>
>>>>> Coronavirus hasn't been here long term yet.  Those are medium term
>>>>> problems.
>>>>
>>>> Just like the pandemic of 100 years ago was. Sure. But does not mean
>>>> we should
>>>> not work to manage things now.
>>>
>>> I'm not going to worry about such a small thing that's killing us vastly
>>> slower than the population growth.
>>>
>>>>>>>> And kills far more.
>>>>>>>> How many do you personally know who have died from it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know anyone who died, yet I know many weak people who got
>>>>>>> through it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are lucky. I know several who have died.
>>>>>
>>>>> You must hang around with weaker people.
>>>>
>>>> Or just know more people. Or just fit the common stats more.
>>>
>>> How many people do you know who have not died (including those who
>>> didn't even
>>> get it or know they had it)?
>>>
>>>>>> One of the things I find interesting with the conservative
>>>>>> worldview is how
>>>>>> things often do not matter to those on the right until it has a
>>>>>> more direct
>>>>>> impact on them. We are seeing this, some, with vaccinations. Fewer
>>>>>> people are
>>>>>> spreading misinformation and more people are opting to be vaccinated.
>>>>>
>>>>> We believe direct impacts because the government and media lie.
>>>>> "First hand
>>>>> experience" is the only thing you should ever believe.
>>>>
>>>> Hence why libertarianism cannot work -- you have impacts on others
>>>> you refuse
>>>> to admit to acknowledge. Or even see.
>>>
>>> I refuse to spend my time helping others if I don't want to. Charity
>>> must
>>> always be optional.
>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But the fact people will not even do very basic things to
>>>>>>>>>> protect each other
>>>>>>>>>> from this pandemic is a great refutation of libertarianism. It
>>>>>>>>>> simply does not
>>>>>>>>>> work in the real world.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> These things are unnecessary as the chances of you dying are
>>>>>>>>> minimal.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Already reduced the life expectancy in the US by one year.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That's a very small amount.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Compared to?
>>>>>
>>>>> Your normal life expectancy.
>>>>
>>>> What about other things impacting it?
>>>
>>> Irrelevant.
>>>
>>>>>>>> The chances of
>>>>>>>> dying going through a traffic light are very low -- so why
>>>>>>>> should I be
>>>>>>>> required to stop at red light?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You shouldn't, I don't. Especially "left on red", which is legal
>>>>>>> in the USA
>>>>>>> (although obviously yours is right).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why stop at red lights at all? Why should I be forced to drive on
>>>>>> the right?
>>>>>> It is arbitrary. You are not. What about my freedom? Can I not
>>>>>> make the best
>>>>>> choices for myself?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That is what you sound like with the vaccine.
>>>>>
>>>>> I disobey any law I believe is wrong. Do you really stop at a red
>>>>> when the
>>>>> whole junction is empty?
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's another way to go through a red safely - if the person in
>>>>> front goes
>>>>> through on green, you can go through as it turns to red, and so can
>>>>> hundreds
>>>>> behind you. The other direction won't just start driving into a
>>>>> continuous
>>>>> line of traffic.
>>>>
>>>> Why wait at all? Others can stop for you as well as you can stop for
>>>> them.
>>>>
>>>> Answer: you follow safety laws.
>>>
>>> No, I follow common sense. If I can get to where I'm going without
>>> hitting
>>> something, I go. Doesn't matter what the lights say.
>>
>> Yet you stop at red lights.
>
> No, I take them under advisement.  They stop other cars, leaving a gap
> for me to go.  But often there's a gap the lights don't know about.
>
>> You drive on the proper side of the road.
>
> That's not safety, that's efficiency.

That is absolutely for safety.

>
>> Stop pretending basic safety measures are unreasonable. It is absurd.
>> Stop denying
>> a horrid pandemic which is killing hundreds of thousands and leaving
>> countless
>> more harmed for life.
>
> A fraction of a percent.  New people are being born faster than this.

So by that measure, there's no need to fight any disease or ailment.

Got it.

>
>> It is deeply immature and irrational... and the fact so
>> many people do that is why the pandemic causes so much harm. The very
>> people
>> whining about wearing masks and having lockdowns are the ones making
>> those
>> things more needed. I have precisely no sympathy for folks who think
>> their
>> ignorance is a reason to cause others harm, or even risk harm.
>
> Stop caring about others and look after yourself, things are much easier
> that way.

For a dick, yes.

>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am not sure that as an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> American, I would be willing to make it even easier for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them to bully me
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> around than it already is.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The UK manages without guns.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> They are "tyrannical" with that, eh?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> We don't think anything of it. Nobody here except madmen have
>>>>>>>>>>> a desire to own
>>>>>>>>>>> a gun.  People do not feel threatened and want to defend
>>>>>>>>>>> themselves. Mainly
>>>>>>>>>>> because of the lack of criminals with guns.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But you want to control people and deny them their guns, eh?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Libertarianism allows for a small amount of control - eg.
>>>>>>>>> locking up murderers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who pays?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A very small income tax.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What if I do not want to pay?
>>>>>
>>>>> It would be so small you wouldn't care.
>>>>
>>>> Add up all these small things and it adds up.
>>>
>>> At the moment we have thousands of things funded by the government. The
>>> Libertarians would have two. Minimal military for defending only, and
>>> police
>>> for serious crimes only.
>>
>> So no rules of the road? No fire departments. No safety measures. A
>> deeply
>> immature and unworkable system.
>
> No, rules are not required because people can think for themselves.

No. Rules are required because people don't need to figure out
everything from first principles.