Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
SSD.

It's a bit of a minefield buying USB sticks I know (and micro SD
cards), I have several 'fake' capacity micro-SD cards.

Thus recommendations are useful.

--
Chris Green
·

I'm using USB3-SATA-adapters caught via Ebay (before Covid days) driving
Intenso-120G-SSDs with two Pi4s running Debian/Arm64 (NetBSD-9.99 and
-10_BETA before that). It just works and feels a lot faster than µSD
cards, but I never benchmarked it.

--
I do not bite, I just want to play.

yeti <yeti@tilde.institute> wrote:
> I'm using USB3-SATA-adapters caught via Ebay (before Covid days) driving
> Intenso-120G-SSDs with two Pi4s running Debian/Arm64 (NetBSD-9.99 and
> -10_BETA before that). It just works and feels a lot faster than µSD
> cards, but I never benchmarked it.
>
Too bulky, I just want something as tiny as possible to plug directly
into one of the USB3 sockets. The pi lives behind the control panel
on my boat and space is limited.

--
Chris Green
·

On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
> Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> SSD.
>
> It's a bit of a minefield buying USB sticks I know (and micro SD
> cards), I have several 'fake' capacity micro-SD cards.
>
> Thus recommendations are useful.
>
The SATA SSDS will plug in using a converter cable.

--
Renewable energy: Expensive solutions that don't work to a problem that
doesn't exist instituted by self legalising protection rackets that
don't protect, masquerading as public servants who don't serve the public.

The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
> > Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> > sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> > need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> > SSD.
> >
> > It's a bit of a minefield buying USB sticks I know (and micro SD
> > cards), I have several 'fake' capacity micro-SD cards.
> >
> > Thus recommendations are useful.
> >
> The SATA SSDS will plug in using a converter cable.
>
As I said in response to another, too big really. I want the SSD drive
to be supported by the USB socket, this is in a rather confined space
behind an instrument panel. I.e. I want an SSD drive in a 'USB stick'
format.

--
Chris Green
·

On 11/12/2023 16:00, Chris Green wrote:
> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
>>> Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
>>> sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
>>> need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
>>> SSD.
....
>>
> As I said in response to another, too big really. I want the SSD drive
> to be supported by the USB socket, this is in a rather confined space
> behind an instrument panel. I.e. I want an SSD drive in a 'USB stick'
> format.
>

I 3d-printed a case that holds a Pi4 and a single 3.5" drive, although
the cable (actually all the cables) sticks out. I think it came from
thingiverse. Reasonably compact and robust. I leave it hanging by a
string from the monitor stand when out and about.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3974307

(IIRC I had to make a shim to allow for a my hard drive; the SSD I have
spare is a bit slimmer.)

--
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:
> As I said in response to another, too big really. I want the SSD drive
> to be supported by the USB socket, this is in a rather confined space
> behind an instrument panel. I.e. I want an SSD drive in a 'USB stick'
> format.

Look at the Sandisk Extreme Pro series. They're a USB stick containing a
real SATA SSD controller behind a USB to SATA bridge. That means they do
all the proper wear levelling etc that a SATA SSD does.

They're a bit pricey though:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/SanDisk-Extreme-Solid-State-Flash/dp/B01MU8TZRV/

One other thing to note is that the earlier versions (I have a collection of
16GB and 32GB sticks) can be a bit tetchy to boot some specific Intel
systems - since I often use them as installer or live-USB sticks this is
annoying. I haven't tried booting a Pi off one.

Theo

On 2023-12-11, Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:
> Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> SSD.
>
> It's a bit of a minefield buying USB sticks I know (and micro SD
> cards), I have several 'fake' capacity micro-SD cards.
>
> Thus recommendations are useful.

USB3 <---> SATA adapters

The unpowered ones can usually be used with 2.5in spinning disks and
SSD's. For best performance, at one time you had to be careful to get
ones supporting UASP (USB Attached SCSI protocol). Dunno if they all do now.
But even a 2.5in HD on non-uasp on USB2 adapter is far better than using
the SD card!

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:
> > As I said in response to another, too big really. I want the SSD drive
> > to be supported by the USB socket, this is in a rather confined space
> > behind an instrument panel. I.e. I want an SSD drive in a 'USB stick'
> > format.
>
> Look at the Sandisk Extreme Pro series. They're a USB stick containing a
> real SATA SSD controller behind a USB to SATA bridge. That means they do
> all the proper wear levelling etc that a SATA SSD does.
>
> They're a bit pricey though:
> https://www.amazon.co.uk/SanDisk-Extreme-Solid-State-Flash/dp/B01MU8TZRV/

Another thing to mention is there are adapters which will turn a 2230 or
2242 NVMe M.2 into a portly USB stick:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hausdec-SSD-Enclosure-Enclosure-External-Windows-Black/dp/B0C6K4SBJ1/

I've not tried them.

Theo

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:
> > As I said in response to another, too big really. I want the SSD drive
> > to be supported by the USB socket, this is in a rather confined space
> > behind an instrument panel. I.e. I want an SSD drive in a 'USB stick'
> > format.
>
> Look at the Sandisk Extreme Pro series. They're a USB stick containing a
> real SATA SSD controller behind a USB to SATA bridge. That means they do
> all the proper wear levelling etc that a SATA SSD does.
>
> They're a bit pricey though:
> https://www.amazon.co.uk/SanDisk-Extreme-Solid-State-Flash/dp/B01MU8TZRV/
>
> One other thing to note is that the earlier versions (I have a collection of
> 16GB and 32GB sticks) can be a bit tetchy to boot some specific Intel
> systems - since I often use them as installer or live-USB sticks this is
> annoying. I haven't tried booting a Pi off one.
>
Thanks, that's the sort of thing I wanted and information like this is
hard to come by.

--
Chris Green
·

On Mon, 11 Dec 2023 15:01:09 +0000
Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:

> Too bulky, I just want something as tiny as possible to plug directly
> into one of the USB3 sockets. The pi lives behind the control panel
> on my boat and space is limited.

USB/M2 NVMe enclosure perhaps - you'll want USB 3.2 10Gb/s to get
even close to the performance of the SSD.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
Host: Beautiful Theory meet Inconvenient Fact
Obit: Beautiful Theory died today of factual inconsistency

On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
> Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> SSD.

The Samsung T7 is a small format portable SSD with a built in USB 3
interface.

---druck

On 11/12/2023 14:31, yeti wrote:
> I'm using USB3-SATA-adapters caught via Ebay (before Covid days) driving
> Intenso-120G-SSDs with two Pi4s running Debian/Arm64 (NetBSD-9.99 and
> -10_BETA before that). It just works and feels a lot faster than µSD
> cards, but I never benchmarked it.
>
Read Benchmarks hdparm -Ttv

Amazon basic SDCard : 40 MB/s
rpi5 fast SDCard : 75 MB/s
2.5 hdd via USB rpi4 : 96 MB/s
SSD via USB rpi4 : 137 MB/s
NVME opi5 : 186 MB/s

On 12/11/23 8:34 AM, Chris Green wrote:
> Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> SSD.
>
> It's a bit of a minefield buying USB sticks I know (and micro SD
> cards), I have several 'fake' capacity micro-SD cards.
>
> Thus recommendations are useful.

Hmm ... I've been using a Pi3 with a magnetic
Samsung 3tb USB/HDD for years. The Pi produces
just enough power. Never a prob.

And the drive is almost exactly the same size as
the Pi. I literally rubber-banded them together
and a 4" cable connects.

NOW, I'd rec a Samsung USB/SSD instead of the
magnetic, the price/TB is finally pretty good.

In either case you may want to write a little
Python script to ensure the drive always gets
mounted to the SAME place regardless of how
the BIOS sees it. In my app I find and umount
it after boot, then re-mount to a predictable
place. Not much code involved.

Anyway, what you're asking is VERY do-able. Has
been for several years.

As for "sticks" ... some last forever, others
die a horrible death almost immediately. Brand
is irrelevant. They are NOT good for mass long-
term storage. Mostly they're the latest version
of "sneaker-net". Oh, ever noticed how HOT
they get and NO heat-sinks. The real "stick" is
just a circuit-board maybe 8mmx10mm no matter
the physical size of the stick you buy.

On 11/12/2023 15:01, Chris Green wrote:
> yeti <yeti@tilde.institute> wrote:
>> I'm using USB3-SATA-adapters caught via Ebay (before Covid days) driving
>> Intenso-120G-SSDs with two Pi4s running Debian/Arm64 (NetBSD-9.99 and
>> -10_BETA before that). It just works and feels a lot faster than µSD
>> cards, but I never benchmarked it.
>>
> Too bulky, I just want something as tiny as possible to plug directly
> into one of the USB3 sockets. The pi lives behind the control panel
> on my boat and space is limited.
>

The footprint of my PI is almost the same as an SSD. I am at the moment
working on 3D CAD to design a case for them

The USB to SATA cables are very short.

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Odds%20and%20Ends/server.png (3D CAD print)

Yes, it does increase the overall length of the unit a bit, but it
should fit behind a panel OK.

If you don't use a cable, you are going to extend the length even more
though. By at least the length of the SSD.

--
"Nature does not give up the winter because people dislike the cold."

― Confucius

Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> wrote:
> On 11/12/2023 14:31, yeti wrote:
> > I'm using USB3-SATA-adapters caught via Ebay (before Covid days) driving
> > Intenso-120G-SSDs with two Pi4s running Debian/Arm64 (NetBSD-9.99 and
> > -10_BETA before that). It just works and feels a lot faster than µSD
> > cards, but I never benchmarked it.
> >
> Read Benchmarks hdparm -Ttv
>
> Amazon basic SDCard : 40 MB/s
> rpi5 fast SDCard : 75 MB/s
> 2.5 hdd via USB rpi4 : 96 MB/s
> SSD via USB rpi4 : 137 MB/s
> NVME opi5 : 186 MB/s
>
The extra speed of the SSD is nice but what I'm really after is the
greater robustness with lots of disk writes. This is going to be a
headless system which is inaccessible (in France) for most of the time
so long term reliability is the most important issue.

--
Chris Green
·

druck <news@druck.org.uk> wrote:
> On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
> > Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> > sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> > need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> > SSD.
>
> The Samsung T7 is a small format portable SSD with a built in USB 3
> interface.
>
USB 3 doesn't mean that it plugs directly into the USB socket on the
Pi though, that's what I'm really after.

I also only need 32Gb or so, I suppose much larger capacities give
more resilience but they really aren't useful. I'm currently using 9%
of a 32Gb micro SD card and that's unlikely to increase much.

I was hoping that someone would be making an 'SSD in a USB stick' but
there doesn't seem to be any such thing. The "SanDisk Extreme PRO
128GB USB 3.2" drives seem to be the nearest thing to what I want.

--
Chris Green
·

On 11/12/2023 16:00, Chris Green wrote:
> I.e. I want an SSD drive in a 'USB stick'
> format.
>
Tough shit then, because they aren't made in that format, and that would
be just as long as a U shaped cable folding back to place a standard SSD
right behind the Pi.

The best you will be able to do is a load of extra height and an NVME card.
And you may need a i 5 for that. I am not sure the interface used here
is available on earlier models

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXWu4SUsaY8

BUT if you are using the USB sockets AT ALL you will have to accomodate
cables, that will be just as bad as my suggested USB->SATA cable.

--
A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on
its shoes.

On 12/12/2023 09:21, Chris Green wrote:
> Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> wrote:
>> On 11/12/2023 14:31, yeti wrote:
>>> I'm using USB3-SATA-adapters caught via Ebay (before Covid days) driving
>>> Intenso-120G-SSDs with two Pi4s running Debian/Arm64 (NetBSD-9.99 and
>>> -10_BETA before that). It just works and feels a lot faster than µSD
>>> cards, but I never benchmarked it.
>>>
>> Read Benchmarks hdparm -Ttv
>>
>> Amazon basic SDCard : 40 MB/s
>> rpi5 fast SDCard : 75 MB/s
>> 2.5 hdd via USB rpi4 : 96 MB/s
>> SSD via USB rpi4 : 137 MB/s
>> NVME opi5 : 186 MB/s
>>
> The extra speed of the SSD is nice but what I'm really after is the
> greater robustness with lots of disk writes. This is going to be a
> headless system which is inaccessible (in France) for most of the time
> so long term reliability is the most important issue.
>

Get an Orange Pi 5. They take a 2242 NVME drive on the back of the
board, but the board is about 10mm wider and longer than a Raspberry Pi.
The Opi5 is also low power, compared to a Raspberry Pi 5.

Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:
> druck <news@druck.org.uk> wrote:
> > On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
> > > Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> > > sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> > > need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> > > SSD.
> >
> > The Samsung T7 is a small format portable SSD with a built in USB 3
> > interface.
> >
> USB 3 doesn't mean that it plugs directly into the USB socket on the
> Pi though, that's what I'm really after.
>
> I also only need 32Gb or so, I suppose much larger capacities give
> more resilience but they really aren't useful. I'm currently using 9%
> of a 32Gb micro SD card and that's unlikely to increase much.
>
> I was hoping that someone would be making an 'SSD in a USB stick' but
> there doesn't seem to be any such thing. The "SanDisk Extreme PRO
> 128GB USB 3.2" drives seem to be the nearest thing to what I want.

A few more options include:

A Pi 5 with NVMe HAT

A CM4 with onboard eMMC

A CM4 plus an NVMe baseboard

An eMMC plus a USB-eMMC carrier board:
https://www.odroid.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=853
https://www.odroid.co.uk/odroid-accessories/odroid-os?product_id=1118

An eMMC plus eMMC to SD card adapter:
https://www.odroid.co.uk/odroid-accessories/odroid-os?product_id=843

eMMC uses the SD interface but is usually much more reliable than regular
SD cards.

Theo

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:
> > druck <news@druck.org.uk> wrote:
> > > On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
> > > > Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> > > > sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> > > > need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> > > > SSD.
> > >
> > > The Samsung T7 is a small format portable SSD with a built in USB 3
> > > interface.
> > >
> > USB 3 doesn't mean that it plugs directly into the USB socket on the
> > Pi though, that's what I'm really after.
> >
> > I also only need 32Gb or so, I suppose much larger capacities give
> > more resilience but they really aren't useful. I'm currently using 9%
> > of a 32Gb micro SD card and that's unlikely to increase much.
> >
> > I was hoping that someone would be making an 'SSD in a USB stick' but
> > there doesn't seem to be any such thing. The "SanDisk Extreme PRO
> > 128GB USB 3.2" drives seem to be the nearest thing to what I want.
>
> A few more options include:
>
> A Pi 5 with NVMe HAT
>
Yes, but I don't really need a Pi 5 and it costs £60.

> A CM4 with onboard eMMC
>
> A CM4 plus an NVMe baseboard
>
As above, cost money! :-)

> An eMMC plus a USB-eMMC carrier board:
> https://www.odroid.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=853
> https://www.odroid.co.uk/odroid-accessories/odroid-os?product_id=1118
>
> An eMMC plus eMMC to SD card adapter:
> https://www.odroid.co.uk/odroid-accessories/odroid-os?product_id=843
>
>
> eMMC uses the SD interface but is usually much more reliable than regular
> SD cards.
>
Quite, the BBB has on-board 4Gb EMMC, my BBB (that the RPi is going to
replace) has churned away reliably using its EMMC for many years now.

I have another reason (other than my original reasons at start of
thread) for moving to a Pi. The pigpio library will allow me to
measure some short[ish] times which I can't do so easily on the BBB.

--
Chris Green
·

On 2023-12-11, Chris Green wrote:

> Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> SSD.
>
> It's a bit of a minefield buying USB sticks I know (and micro SD
> cards), I have several 'fake' capacity micro-SD cards.
>
> Thus recommendations are useful.

Not quite "USB stick format" as you mention elsewhere in the thread,
but I've used a "Samsung T7 Portable SSD 500 GB USB 3.2 Gen.2 External
SSD" (model MU-PC500T/WW). The specs say 85 x 57 x 8 mm.

I had it plugged into a Pi's USB port with the cable bent in a U and
the drive sitting on top of the Pi case with a rubber band holding it
in place. IIRC the drive didn't stick out, other than the 8 mm
vertically and the U-shape of the cable.

On 12/12/2023 15:00, Chris Green wrote:

>> A Pi 5 with NVMe HAT
>>
> Yes, but I don't really need a Pi 5 and it costs £60.
>
And the rest, you need the PSU, + cooler, + probably sensible to have a
case, + the NVME hat.

>
>> A CM4 with onboard eMMC
>>
>> A CM4 plus an NVMe baseboard
>>
> As above, cost money! :-)
>

Too, right, Chris didn't get to own a super yacht, moored in Nice, by
being careless with his money.

<https://uk.pcmag.com/storage/140187/samsung-says-its-pro-endurance-memory-cards-are-wear-out-proof>

On 2023-12-12, Chris Green wrote:

> druck <news@druck.org.uk> wrote:
>> On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
>> > Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
>> > sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
>> > need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
>> > SSD.
>>
>> The Samsung T7 is a small format portable SSD with a built in USB 3
>> interface.
>>
> USB 3 doesn't mean that it plugs directly into the USB socket on the
> Pi though, that's what I'm really after.

I don't understand this --- I've used a Samsung T7 (as mentioned in
another post a few minutes ago) and IME the supplied cable does plug
directly into the USB A socket.

> I also only need 32Gb or so, I suppose much larger capacities give
> more resilience but they really aren't useful. I'm currently using 9%
> of a 32Gb micro SD card and that's unlikely to increase much.
>
> I was hoping that someone would be making an 'SSD in a USB stick' but
> there doesn't seem to be any such thing. The "SanDisk Extreme PRO
> 128GB USB 3.2" drives seem to be the nearest thing to what I want.
>

Adam Funk <a24061@ducksburg.com> wrote:
> On 2023-12-12, Chris Green wrote:
>
> > druck <news@druck.org.uk> wrote:
> >> On 11/12/2023 13:34, Chris Green wrote:
> >> > Are there any 'proper' SSDs that plug directly into the Pi's USB-3.0
> >> > sockets? If so can anyone recommend particular makes/models? I only
> >> > need 32Gb (maybe 64Gb) but I'd like the extra reliability/life of an
> >> > SSD.
> >>
> >> The Samsung T7 is a small format portable SSD with a built in USB 3
> >> interface.
> >>
> > USB 3 doesn't mean that it plugs directly into the USB socket on the
> > Pi though, that's what I'm really after.
>
> I don't understand this --- I've used a Samsung T7 (as mentioned in
> another post a few minutes ago) and IME the supplied cable does plug
> directly into the USB A socket.
>
What I mean is something like a USB stick that plugs straight into the
USB3 socket, no cable at all.

--
Chris Green
·