I have been attempting to get used to Windows 10, but now it had
developed a problem that, if it ever happens again, will force me to
either go back to Windows 7 *OR* finally make the move to Linux.

What is happening is that I'm seeing programs which I was able to use
without issue in Windows 7 and which I have installed in Windows 10
suddenly, and completely, disappear.

Here's an example:

I installed WizMouse (https://antibody-software.com/wizmouse) and
configured it to work as it usually does. The program "allows you to
scroll the window under the mouse with your mouse wheel even if the that
window doesn't have input focus.
Windows 10 already has this functionality built in so WizMouse is most
useful if you're using earlier versions of Windows (Windows 2000, XP,
Vista, 7, 8)."

Yesterday, I noticed that the program completely disappeared. In other
words, it was uninstalled without me doing anything.

However, perhaps the most frustrating thing is that I was able to
install the drivers for my beloved Canon Canoscan 8400F scanner and it
was working perfectly. In fact, it was working better than it ever has
before. The drivers were for Windows 7, but they installed in Windows 10
without any issues and the scanner has been working for a couple of
weeks now.

Then this morning, when I attempted to use the scanner, the twain driver
was no longer available in Adobe Photoshop Elements or any other
graphics editing program I have installed, all of which used to list the
twain driver. The scanner is still listed in the Device Manager and it
says "This device is working properly."

I noticed that there was a new system notification, so I checked it out
and it said something to the effect that "Finish installing software for
a device." When I attempted to get more information about the
notification, it simply disappeared!

when I go into the Device Manager with the scanner turned on,
right-click on the listing, select "Properties" and click on the
"Events" tab, I see the following "events" listed:
__________________________________________________________________________
Events
Timestamp Description
2024-03-25 8:46:23 PM Device configured (null)
evice USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 was configured.
Driver Name: null
Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
Driver Date:
Driver Version:
Driver Provider:
Driver Section:
Driver Rank: 0x0
Matching Device Id:
Outranked Drivers:
Device Updated: false
Parent Device: USB\ROOT_HUB20\4&33ca6639&0

2024-04-10 7:48:47 AM Device deleted
Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 was deleted.
Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}

2024-04-10 7:55:03 AM Device install requested
Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 requires further installation.

2024-04-10 7:55:04 AM Driver sen/ice added (usbscan)
Driver Management has concluded the process to add Service usbscan for
Device Instance ID USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 with the
following status: 0.
__________________________________________________________________________

I *KNOW* that the drivers I installed will work with Windows 10 because
they were doing so. To me, it simply appears that the OS deliberately
fucked things up so that they wouldn't work. I have read various places
on the internet that other people who owned the same model scanner were
able to make it work when W10 first came out, but that after one of the
W10 updates it suddenly quit working.

This smacks of collusion between Microsoft and Canon in order to get
people to purchase new scanners from Canon.

As for software randomly disappearing from Windows 10 without any
notice, I am far from the only person to see this kind of thing happening:

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&as_q=windows+10+programs+get+randomly+uninstalled&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_nlo=&as_nhi=&lr=lang_en&cr=&as_qdr=all&as_sitesearch=&as_occt=any&as_filetype=&tbs=

Especially this discussion:

https://www.tenforums.com/software-apps/201227-windows-deletes-software-automatically.html

Has anybody else experienced this problem (programs being uninstalled
without permission) and if so, have any of you found a solution or at
least a reason why it's happening? This is completely unacceptable.

As for the scanner, if I can't find a way to make it work again, then
that's it for Windows 10. I won't tolerate this kind of bullshit.

--
John C.

On 4/25/2024 6:57 AM, John C. wrote:

> As for the scanner, if I can't find a way to make it work again, then
> that's it for Windows 10. I won't tolerate this kind of bullshit.
>

Usually scanners/printers will install their own applet with
the driver. That's not in the start menu? I don't know if
this will help, but after installing drivers for my HP Envy I've
found the TWAIN driver doesn't work. But WIA works fine.
The only downside is that the WIA applet is a "for dummies"
thing and the printer doesn't implement it properly. HP doesn't
respond to my WIA script witth full information about properties.
For example, the WIA applet only gives me a choice of PDF or
JPG scan output. Yet with my own WIA script I can also
choose BMP and probably other formats. (With JPG being lossy
it's a rather dumb primary output format for a scanner.)

If you're not familiar with this... TWAIN was the standard for
a long time. WIA is Windows Image Acquisition. It provides
a COM interface to talk to the scanner, get its capabilities,
and set scan options. Your problem may be entirely different,
but you can also look in PS elements or look for a Canon applet.
My PSP5 offers to scan via TWAIN and sees the scanner, but
for whatever reason the TWAIN isn't working. However, the
HP applet and my script both work via WIA.

On Thu, 25 Apr 2024 03:57:07 -0700, "John C." <r9jmg0@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>
>As for the scanner, if I can't find a way to make it work again, then
>that's it for Windows 10. I won't tolerate this kind of bullshit.

It's a long time since I had to install a TWAIN driver for a scanner,
though I see if I look at the import options for PaintShop Pro it
lists the TWAIN drivers that it can use. What printer is it? Does it
have an app for running the scanner? Usually, in my experience,
installing the scanner app installs the drivers. If you have one, try
reinstalling the scanner app. Sounds an odd scenario that you
describe.

John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I have been attempting to get used to Windows 10, but now it had
> developed a problem that, if it ever happens again, will force me to
> either go back to Windows 7 *OR* finally make the move to Linux.
>
> What is happening is that I'm seeing programs which I was able to use
> without issue in Windows 7 and which I have installed in Windows 10
> suddenly, and completely, disappear.
>
> Here's an example:
>
> I installed WizMouse (https://antibody-software.com/wizmouse) and
> configured it to work as it usually does. The program "allows you to
> scroll the window under the mouse with your mouse wheel even if the that
> window doesn't have input focus.
> Windows 10 already has this functionality built in so WizMouse is most
> useful if you're using earlier versions of Windows (Windows 2000, XP,
> Vista, 7, 8)."
>
> Yesterday, I noticed that the program completely disappeared. In other
> words, it was uninstalled without me doing anything.

How do you *know* the program was "removed" (uninstalled)? Was it
listed in Control Panel (-> Programs -> Programs and Features) and is it
no longer listed there?

That the program does not work anymore, doesn't mean is was removed.

> However, perhaps the most frustrating thing is that I was able to
> install the drivers for my beloved Canon Canoscan 8400F scanner and it
> was working perfectly. In fact, it was working better than it ever has
> before. The drivers were for Windows 7, but they installed in Windows 10
> without any issues and the scanner has been working for a couple of
> weeks now.
>
> Then this morning, when I attempted to use the scanner, the twain driver
> was no longer available in Adobe Photoshop Elements or any other
> graphics editing program I have installed, all of which used to list the
> twain driver. The scanner is still listed in the Device Manager and it
> says "This device is working properly."
>
> I noticed that there was a new system notification, so I checked it out
> and it said something to the effect that "Finish installing software for
> a device." When I attempted to get more information about the
> notification, it simply disappeared!
>
> when I go into the Device Manager with the scanner turned on,
> right-click on the listing, select "Properties" and click on the
> "Events" tab, I see the following "events" listed:
> __________________________________________________________________________
> Events
> Timestamp Description
> 2024-03-25 8:46:23 PM Device con?gured (null)
> evice USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 was configured.
> Driver Name: null
> Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
> Driver Date:
> Driver Version:
> Driver Provider:
> Driver Section:
> Driver Rank: 0x0
> Matching Device Id:
> Outranked Drivers:
> Device Updated: false
> Parent Device: USB\ROOT_HUB20\4&33ca6639&0
>
> 2024-04-10 7:48:47 AM Device deleted
> Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 was deleted.
> Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
>
> 2024-04-10 7:55:03 AM Device install requested
> Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 requires further installation.
>
> 2024-04-10 7:55:04 AM Driver sen/ice added (usbscan)
> Driver Management has concluded the process to add Service usbscan for
> Device Instance ID USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 with the
> following status: 0.
> __________________________________________________________________________
>
> I *KNOW* that the drivers I installed will work with Windows 10 because
> they were doing so. To me, it simply appears that the OS deliberately
> fucked things up so that they wouldn't work. I have read various places
> on the internet that other people who owned the same model scanner were
> able to make it work when W10 first came out, but that after one of the
> W10 updates it suddenly quit working.

April 10 is the Wednesday after the last 'patch Tuesday' (second
Tuesday of the month), so it looks that Windows Update downloaded and
installed new drivers which it thought (FSVSVO 'think') were newer/
better than the 'old'/installed ones.

For Windows 10 (I mainly use Windows 11) there's still a setting which
you can set to prevent this from happening (again). (For Windows 11 it's
less easy, but still possible (with third-party software).)

I don't have the Windows 10 setting handy, but others/Paul can point
you to it.

Question: Besides the scanner driver, did you install any other
scanner/Canon software? If so, was that listed in 'Programs and
Features' and now gone?

> This smacks of collusion between Microsoft and Canon in order to get
> people to purchase new scanners from Canon.

Some comment about stupidity versus malice?

> As for software randomly disappearing from Windows 10 without any
> notice, I am far from the only person to see this kind of thing happening:
>
> https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&as_q=windows+10+programs+get+randomly+uninstalled&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_nlo=&as_nhi=&lr=lang_en&cr=&as_qdr=all&as_sitesearch=&as_occt=any&as_filetype=&tbs=
>
> Especially this discussion:
>
> https://www.tenforums.com/software-apps/201227-windows-deletes-software-automatically.html
>
> Has anybody else experienced this problem (programs being uninstalled
> without permission) and if so, have any of you found a solution or at
> least a reason why it's happening? This is completely unacceptable.

My wife's system is Windows 10 and there were no programs removed from
that system. But she's no tinkerer and I tinker with that system as
little as possible.

> As for the scanner, if I can't find a way to make it work again, then
> that's it for Windows 10. I won't tolerate this kind of bullshit.

See above as to what probably happened with the scanner driver and how
to prevent it in the future. And FWIW, as I mentioned before, my 'stone
age' (2010) Epson scanner software happily moved from Vista to 8.1 and
now 11 without it being removed.

On 25 Apr 2024 14:30:57 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> How do you *know* the program was "removed" (uninstalled)? Was it
> listed in Control Panel (-> Programs -> Programs and Features) and is it
> no longer listed there?
>
> That the program does not work anymore, doesn't mean is was removed.

True dat.

Another possibility: Windows Security (formerly Windows Defender) or
the Malicious Software Removal Tool might have decided those programs
were dangerous and quarantined them.

To check that in Windows Security, open Settings; select
Update & Security »
Windows Security »
Virus & Threat Protection »
Protection History
If there are any "This app has been blocked" notations, click on each
one in turn.

The MSRT runs as a Windows update, and I don't know how to check its
logs.

--
Stan Brown, Tehachapi, California, USA https://BrownMath.com/
Shikata ga nai...

In message <v0dcu6$2v9ts$1@dont-email.me>, John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com>
writes
<big snip>
>Has anybody else experienced this problem (programs being uninstalled
>without permission)

I've been using 10 for about five years and, to the best of my
knowledge, have never had that happen. Could your anti-virus have
quarantined the program as suspicious without your being aware of it? It
might be worth checking.
--
John Hall
"Acting is merely the art of keeping a large group of people
from coughing."
Sir Ralph Richardson (1902-83)

John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I installed WizMouse (https://antibody-software.com/wizmouse) and
> configured it to work as it usually does. The program "allows you to
> scroll the window under the mouse with your mouse wheel even if the
> that window doesn't have input focus. Windows 10 already has this
> functionality built in so WizMouse is most useful if you're using
> earlier versions of Windows (Windows 2000, XP, Vista, 7, 8).
>
> Yesterday, I noticed that the program completely disappeared. In other
> words, it was uninstalled without me doing anything.

Did you check the install folder to see if it still existed, and, if so,
if the program's files are still there?

> However, perhaps the most frustrating thing is that I was able to
> install the drivers for my beloved Canon Canoscan 8400F scanner and
> it was working perfectly. In fact, it was working better than it ever
> has before. The drivers were for Windows 7, but they installed in
> Windows 10 without any issues and the scanner has been working for a
> couple of weeks now.
>
> Then this morning, when I attempted to use the scanner, the twain
> driver was no longer available in Adobe Photoshop Elements or any
> other graphics editing program I have installed, all of which used to
> list the twain driver. The scanner is still listed in the Device
> Manager and it says "This device is working properly."
>
> __________________________________________________________________________
> Events
> Timestamp Description
> 2024-03-25 8:46:23 PM Device configured (null)
> evice USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 was configured.
> Driver Name: null
> Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
> Driver Date:
> Driver Version:
> Driver Provider:
> Driver Section:
> Driver Rank: 0x0
> Matching Device Id:
> Outranked Drivers:
> Device Updated: false
> Parent Device: USB\ROOT_HUB20\4&33ca6639&0
>
> 2024-04-10 7:48:47 AM Device deleted
> Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 was deleted.
> Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
>
> 2024-04-10 7:55:03 AM Device install requested
> Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 requires further installation.
>
> 2024-04-10 7:55:04 AM Driver sen/ice added (usbscan)
> Driver Management has concluded the process to add Service usbscan for
> Device Instance ID USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 with the
> following status: 0.
> __________________________________________________________________________

Since the scanner is still listed in Device Manager, that device was NOT
uninstalled. Didn't the scanner come bundled with some software either
with the scanner, or you were given a URL of where to download it?

Not many drivers are dynamic (can be loaded after Windows has loaded,
and loaded by the user). Many require they load while Windows is
loading. That means you have to reboot when you install a new driver.
Did you yet restart Windows?

Also, do NOT let Microsoft update drivers. It does an unreliable job.
A device in a family line all under the same model number may have
different versions, and that versioning could be due to changes in
hardware, and you need to get the driver that matches on the hardware.
The same model number doesn't mean the same hardware. However,
Microsoft can only detect the product and model, not when version
numbering reflects a major change in the hardware. So, the WU client
picks a driver for a model, but for the wrong version of the hardware.
*YOU* should be the only one doing driver updates.

Just because there is a new driver version does not mean you want it or
need it. Newer is NOT always better. For example, many video drivers
get updates to be compatible with newer games (that you may not have,
and may never have), but you suffer loss of compatibility with older
games (that you do have). Compatibility code is added to support the
newer games, but then old compatibility code with old games is lost.
When reviewing a driver update, you need to decide if you need it. Does
it address a security issue? Does it fix an issue you are actually
experiencing with the current driver? Will it work with your new
software or hardware AND your old software and hardware? Read the
release notes for all versions to the newest one, and all those after
the version you have, to determine if there really is a need for the new
driver version.

Disable hardware (driver) updates in Windows, and relegate that
responsibility to yourself. Rather than describe the registry hack to
disable driver updating, I use WinAero Tweaker. Most tweaks are have
links to description pages on how they work, like:

https://winaero.com/how-to-turn-off-driver-updates-in-windows-update-in-windows-10/

Search on "update", and use it to disable hardware updates. You can
even use it to disable Windows updates; however, some features in
Windows won't work if WU is disabled, like you won't be able to review
the update history, or use the Windows Store app to find apps that way
(but you can still use their Store web site). I permanently disable
hardware updates. I make the choice if the current driver is broken,
has flaws, or if a new version actually gives me anything. If no bang
for the buck, I pass on the new driver version. I disable WU for a
month, or two, maybe longer, until *I* am ready and prepared, like
saving an image backup (providing a means to escape backwards rather
than burn the bridge), before allowing those updates.

Another problem with hardware or WU updates is the time to reflect new
driver versions in the WU catalog (an MS site). Takes times for a
vendor to get their new version validated and appear in the catalog. In
that time, they may find (or users report to them) there are problems
with a new version, so the vendor has to go through the complete
submission process again. In the meantime, the catalog is pushing out
the bad version. There is no yanking of a bad version to immediate
retrograde to a prior version (that process takes time, too). In the
meantime, users are getting afflicting with the bad version. Could be a
couple months before the vendor gets a new -- and fixed new -- version
put into the catalog, and everyone that got stuck with the bad version
can finally get the new and fixed version.

I never allow hardware updates. I make those choices. I disable
Windows updates until I hear of some that are really important, but even
then I decide if and when to apply the update (just because there is a
security update means you might be vulnerable, not that you will be
hit). Besides scheduled backups, I save an image backup before every
update whether hardware or software, and the same before I install any
software (far more accurate to restore from an image backup to get back
the exact state of my drive rather than rely on uninstallers, and more
accurate than using System Restore). Pause all updates, you decide when
to apply any, and prepare by saving an image backup and allocate the
time (including the outage of your computer during the backup and any
needed reboots).

Also, just because an update doesn't declare that a reboot is not needed
(you're not told a reboot is required) doesn't mean you shouldn't
reboot. File versions can get out of sync: old files may still be left
around, especially if they were in use, with a mix of new files, and
failures can occur when trying to use the old files with new ones. Do a
reboot after an update to ensure the file set is in sync.

Earlier today, I wrote:
[...]

> April 10 is the Wednesday after the last 'patch Tuesday' (second
> Tuesday of the month), so it looks that Windows Update downloaded and
> installed new drivers which it thought (FSVSVO 'think') were newer/
> better than the 'old'/installed ones.
>
> For Windows 10 (I mainly use Windows 11) there's still a setting which
> you can set to prevent this from happening (again). (For Windows 11 it's
> less easy, but still possible (with third-party software).)
>
> I don't have the Windows 10 setting handy, but others/Paul can point
> you to it.

I checked my notes and found my notes on how to stop automatic driver
updates.

It's apparently the same setting for Windows 10 and 11. Credits go to
Paul [1] for mentioning the basic method (method 1. in the article) and
for pointing to the MakeUseOf article:

'How to Stop Automatic Driver Updates on Windows'
<https://www.makeuseof.com/windows-stop-automatic-driver-updates>

FWIW, I checked with method 3. (Registry Editor) on my Windows 11
system and the SearchOrderConfig key is indeed set to the default value
1 (Automatic Driver Updates are enabled).

Hope this helps.

[...]

[1] Paul's post:
From: Paul <nospam@needed.invalid>
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Windows 10 updating drivers
Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2022 18:09:02 -0500
Message-ID: <tod9if$3dbha$1@dont-email.me>

Stan Brown <the_stan_brown@fastmail.fm> wrote:

> Frank Slootweg wrote:
>
>> How do you *know* the program was "removed" (uninstalled)? Was it
>> listed in Control Panel (-> Programs -> Programs and Features) and
>> is it no longer listed there?
>>
>> That the program does not work anymore, doesn't mean is was removed.
>
> Another possibility: Windows Security (formerly Windows Defender) or
> the Malicious Software Removal Tool might have decided those programs
> were dangerous and quarantined them.
>
> To check that in Windows Security, open Settings; select
> Update & Security »
> Windows Security »
> Virus & Threat Protection »
> Protection History
> If there are any "This app has been blocked" notations, click on each
> one in turn.
>
> The MSRT runs as a Windows update, and I don't know how to check its
> logs.

I downloaded the portable version of WizMouse (so I could see the files
instead of the installer executable). I submitted wizmouse.exe and
wizmouse.dll to VirusTotal. The .exe had a couple hits on obscure AVs,
but those are insignificant. The .dll had no hits. I don't think
Defender saw wizmouse as malware, but only looking it its logs might
show it decided it was a PUP (Probably Unwanted Program) or PUA
(Potentially Unwanted Application).

Not sure why the OP still wants to use WizMouse under Windows 10 where
the program seems superfluous. WizMouse isn't even listed at the
author's home page (https://antibody-software.com/). The .exe and .dll
haven't been updated since Sept 2013. It's ancient. It's long dead.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on 25 Apr 2024 14:30:57 GMT, Frank Slootweg
<this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote:

>
>> This smacks of collusion between Microsoft and Canon in order to get
>> people to purchase new scanners from Canon.
>
> Some comment about stupidity versus malice?

Not even stupidity. It's awfully hard to test updates with every device
out there to make sure it's still compatible. That's why Apple doesn't
let every Tom, Dick and Harry write software, etc for their products,
but it's also why there are far fewer programs to run.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 25 Apr 2024 03:57:07 -0700, "John C."
<r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>
>I installed WizMouse (https://antibody-software.com/wizmouse) and
>configured it to work as it usually does. The program "allows you to
>scroll the window under the mouse with your mouse wheel even if the that
>window doesn't have input focus.
>Windows 10 already has this functionality built in so WizMouse is most
>useful if you're using earlier versions of Windows (Windows 2000, XP,
>Vista, 7, 8)."
>
>Yesterday, I noticed that the program completely disappeared. In other
>words, it was uninstalled without me doing anything.

Why not just install it again? I see two possibilities. It only got
uninstalled because something related got installed on the 2nd Tuesday
update, OR a check is made every 2nd Tuesday and it will get uninstalled
in a month , every month. I think it's the first and you won't have
more problems for years, but I'm guessing. Others here might know how
that actually works.

Peter Johnson wrote:
> John C. wrote:
>>
>> As for the scanner, if I can't find a way to make it work again, then
>> that's it for Windows 10. I won't tolerate this kind of bullshit.
>
> It's a long time since I had to install a TWAIN driver for a scanner,
> though I see if I look at the import options for PaintShop Pro it
> lists the TWAIN drivers that it can use. What printer is it?

Printer? What are you talking about? I'm talking about a scanner. A
stand-alone scanner. As I said in the OP, "my beloved Canon Canoscan
8400F scanner."

> Does it have an app

I'm not running my scanner from a "smart" phone, I'm running it from my
desktop computer. The software it uses is referred to correctly as an
"application".

> for running the scanner? Usually, in my experience,
> installing the scanner app

Again, you mean "application". Or program. Yes, I did try installing it
but it was a separate install from the drivers and did not include the
drivers. The scanner remained inoperative.

> installs the drivers. If you have one, try
> reinstalling the scanner app. Sounds an odd scenario that you
> describe.

No, there's nothing odd about it at all. This is the way things were
done when I first purchased the scanner.

Regardless, since I posted the first message to this thread, I've found
a freeware program that's able to access the twain driver I installed
for my scanner.

--
John C. No ad, CD, cripple, demo, nag, pay, pirated, share, spy,
time-limited, trial or web wares for me please.

So that I don't see them, I filter out crossposts (messages sent to
multiple newsgroups at a time) and from various trolls (like "al" AKA
"Bill Bennett".)
If you do the same, the group will be easier for you to read.

VanguardLH wrote:
> Stan Brown <the_stan_brown@fastmail.fm> wrote:
>
>> Frank Slootweg wrote:
>>
>>> How do you *know* the program was "removed" (uninstalled)? Was it
>>> listed in Control Panel (-> Programs -> Programs and Features) and
>>> is it no longer listed there?

I know because I just installed the program. It runs in the background
with an icon on the Tray. I noticed when I started up the system a
couple of days ago that the icon was missing. When I tried to find the
program in my Start Menu, it wasn't there. When I looked in "Programs
and Features", it was no longer listed as an installed program.

I did NOT uninstall the program myself. Period.

>>> That the program does not work anymore, doesn't mean is was removed.

In this case, yes, it did mean that.

>> Another possibility: Windows Security (formerly Windows Defender) or
>> the Malicious Software Removal Tool might have decided those programs
>> were dangerous and quarantined them.

There was no notification and not mention of it being uninstalled that I
was able to find anywhere.

>> To check that in Windows Security, open Settings; select
>> Update & Security »
>> Windows Security »
>> Virus & Threat Protection »
>> Protection History
>> If there are any "This app has been blocked" notations, click on each
>> one in turn.
>>
>> The MSRT runs as a Windows update, and I don't know how to check its
>> logs.
>
> I downloaded the portable version of WizMouse (so I could see the files
> instead of the installer executable). I submitted wizmouse.exe and
> wizmouse.dll to VirusTotal. The .exe had a couple hits on obscure AVs,
> but those are insignificant. The .dll had no hits. I don't think
> Defender saw wizmouse as malware, but only looking it its logs might
> show it decided it was a PUP (Probably Unwanted Program) or PUA
> (Potentially Unwanted Application).
>
> Not sure why the OP still wants to use WizMouse under Windows 10 where
> the program seems superfluous. WizMouse isn't even listed at the
> author's home page (https://antibody-software.com/). The .exe and .dll
> haven't been updated since Sept 2013. It's ancient. It's long dead.

Although the program "allows you to scroll the window under the mouse
with your mouse wheel even if the that window doesn't have input focus.
Windows 10 already has this functionality built in...", I was going to
explore whether or not MS's implementation of the feature did things
like automatically move the background window to the foreground when I
scrolled it. I do not want this to happen. However, before I was able to
determine if this was the case or not, the program disappeared.

--
John C. No ad, CD, cripple, demo, nag, pay, pirated, share, spy,
time-limited, trial or web wares for me please.

So that I don't see them, I filter out crossposts (messages sent to
multiple newsgroups at a time) and from various trolls (like "al" AKA
"Bill Bennett".)
If you do the same, the group will be easier for you to read.

Frank Slootweg wrote:
> Earlier today, I wrote:
> [...]
>
>> April 10 is the Wednesday after the last 'patch Tuesday' (second
>> Tuesday of the month), so it looks that Windows Update downloaded and
>> installed new drivers which it thought (FSVSVO 'think') were newer/
>> better than the 'old'/installed ones.
>>
>> For Windows 10 (I mainly use Windows 11) there's still a setting which
>> you can set to prevent this from happening (again). (For Windows 11 it's
>> less easy, but still possible (with third-party software).)
>>
>> I don't have the Windows 10 setting handy, but others/Paul can point
>> you to it.
>
> I checked my notes and found my notes on how to stop automatic driver
> updates.
>
> It's apparently the same setting for Windows 10 and 11. Credits go to
> Paul [1] for mentioning the basic method (method 1. in the article) and
> for pointing to the MakeUseOf article:
>
> 'How to Stop Automatic Driver Updates on Windows'
> <https://www.makeuseof.com/windows-stop-automatic-driver-updates>
>
> FWIW, I checked with method 3. (Registry Editor) on my Windows 11
> system and the SearchOrderConfig key is indeed set to the default value
> 1 (Automatic Driver Updates are enabled).
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> [...]
>
> [1] Paul's post:
> From: Paul <nospam@needed.invalid>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10
> Subject: Re: Windows 10 updating drivers
> Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2022 18:09:02 -0500
> Message-ID: <tod9if$3dbha$1@dont-email.me>

Thanks, Frank. The info in the article was slightly different from what
I found in the Group Policy Editor, but I still found the setting and
enabled it.

--
John C. No ad, CD, cripple, demo, nag, pay, pirated, share, spy,
time-limited, trial or web wares for me please.

So that I don't see them, I filter out crossposts (messages sent to
multiple newsgroups at a time) and from various trolls (like "al" AKA
"Bill Bennett".)
If you do the same, the group will be easier for you to read.

micky wrote:
> In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on 25 Apr 2024 14:30:57 GMT, Frank Slootweg
> <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote:
>
>>
>>> This smacks of collusion between Microsoft and Canon in order to get
>>> people to purchase new scanners from Canon.
>>
>> Some comment about stupidity versus malice?
>
> Not even stupidity. It's awfully hard to test updates with every device
> out there to make sure it's still compatible. That's why Apple doesn't
> let every Tom, Dick and Harry write software, etc for their products,
> but it's also why there are far fewer programs to run.

The scanner not only worked for me for a while in Windows 10, but many
other Canoscan 8400F users experienced the same thing for a few years
before a Microsoft updated rendered their scanners non-functional as well.

Am I supposed to be happy about this kind of thing? My scanner still
works physically and if I were to set up one of my older computers
(something I don't have the room for in my house), I could easily attach
the scanner to it and prove that it works.

Would YOU be happy about being forced to purchase a new scanner? The
only scanners being made these days that combine negative and slide
scanning capability are very, very expensive. >80(>

--
John C. No ad, CD, cripple, demo, nag, pay, pirated, share, spy,
time-limited, trial or web wares for me please.

So that I don't see them, I filter out crossposts (messages sent to
multiple newsgroups at a time) and from various trolls (like "al" AKA
"Bill Bennett".)
If you do the same, the group will be easier for you to read.

John Hall wrote:
> In message <v0dcu6$2v9ts$1@dont-email.me>, John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com>
> writes
> <big snip>
>> Has anybody else experienced this problem (programs being uninstalled
>> without permission)
>
> I've been using 10 for about five years and, to the best of my
> knowledge, have never had that happen. Could your anti-virus have
> quarantined the program as suspicious without your being aware of it? It
> might be worth checking.

That was about the first thing I checked. Nope, the program just
disappeared.

--
John C. No ad, CD, cripple, demo, nag, pay, pirated, share, spy,
time-limited, trial or web wares for me please.

So that I don't see them, I filter out crossposts (messages sent to
multiple newsgroups at a time) and from various trolls (like "al" AKA
"Bill Bennett".)
If you do the same, the group will be easier for you to read.

VanguardLH wrote:
> John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> I installed WizMouse (https://antibody-software.com/wizmouse) and
>> configured it to work as it usually does. The program "allows you to
>> scroll the window under the mouse with your mouse wheel even if the
>> that window doesn't have input focus. Windows 10 already has this
>> functionality built in so WizMouse is most useful if you're using
>> earlier versions of Windows (Windows 2000, XP, Vista, 7, 8).
>>
>> Yesterday, I noticed that the program completely disappeared. In other
>> words, it was uninstalled without me doing anything.
>
> Did you check the install folder to see if it still existed, and, if so,
> if the program's files are still there?

Yes, and it wasn't.

>> However, perhaps the most frustrating thing is that I was able to
>> install the drivers for my beloved Canon Canoscan 8400F scanner and
>> it was working perfectly. In fact, it was working better than it ever
>> has before. The drivers were for Windows 7, but they installed in
>> Windows 10 without any issues and the scanner has been working for a
>> couple of weeks now.
>>
>> Then this morning, when I attempted to use the scanner, the twain
>> driver was no longer available in Adobe Photoshop Elements or any
>> other graphics editing program I have installed, all of which used to
>> list the twain driver. The scanner is still listed in the Device
>> Manager and it says "This device is working properly."
>>
>> __________________________________________________________________________
>> Events
>> Timestamp Description
>> 2024-03-25 8:46:23 PM Device configured (null)
>> evice USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 was configured.
>> Driver Name: null
>> Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
>> Driver Date:
>> Driver Version:
>> Driver Provider:
>> Driver Section:
>> Driver Rank: 0x0
>> Matching Device Id:
>> Outranked Drivers:
>> Device Updated: false
>> Parent Device: USB\ROOT_HUB20\4&33ca6639&0
>>
>> 2024-04-10 7:48:47 AM Device deleted
>> Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 was deleted.
>> Class Guid: {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
>>
>> 2024-04-10 7:55:03 AM Device install requested
>> Device USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2c2ab93d&0&5 requires further installation.
>>
>> 2024-04-10 7:55:04 AM Driver sen/ice added (usbscan)
>> Driver Management has concluded the process to add Service usbscan for
>> Device Instance ID USB\VID_04A9&PID_221E\5&2C2AB93D&0&5 with the
>> following status: 0.
>> __________________________________________________________________________
>
> Since the scanner is still listed in Device Manager, that device was NOT
> uninstalled. Didn't the scanner come bundled with some software either
> with the scanner, or you were given a URL of where to download it?

Yes, it was installed. I was able to use the scanner for a couple of
weeks before the twain driver was no longer available in any of my image
editing programs.

> Not many drivers are dynamic (can be loaded after Windows has loaded,
> and loaded by the user). Many require they load while Windows is
> loading. That means you have to reboot when you install a new driver.
> Did you yet restart Windows?

Yes, and I tried this but it didn't change anything.

> Also, do NOT let Microsoft update drivers. It does an unreliable job.

Totally agree. And I've since disabled driver updates.

> A device in a family line all under the same model number may have
> different versions, and that versioning could be due to changes in
> hardware, and you need to get the driver that matches on the hardware.
> The same model number doesn't mean the same hardware. However,
> Microsoft can only detect the product and model, not when version
> numbering reflects a major change in the hardware. So, the WU client
> picks a driver for a model, but for the wrong version of the hardware.
> *YOU* should be the only one doing driver updates.

Agreed, but the driver is still installed and if the twain driver can be
accessed, it functions. I determined this by installing this freeware
program:

https://www.naps2.com/

My scanner problem is now solved.

I'll keep your reply archived in case the problem arises again. Thanks
for your effort, VanguardLH. I really appreciate your help.

--
John C. No ad, CD, cripple, demo, nag, pay, pirated, share, spy,
time-limited, trial or web wares for me please.

So that I don't see them, I filter out crossposts (messages sent to
multiple newsgroups at a time) and from various trolls (like "al" AKA
"Bill Bennett".)
If you do the same, the group will be easier for you to read.

micky wrote:
> John C. wrote:
>>
>> I installed WizMouse (https://antibody-software.com/wizmouse) and
>> configured it to work as it usually does. The program "allows you to
>> scroll the window under the mouse with your mouse wheel even if the that
>> window doesn't have input focus.
>> Windows 10 already has this functionality built in so WizMouse is most
>> useful if you're using earlier versions of Windows (Windows 2000, XP,
>> Vista, 7, 8)."
>>
>> Yesterday, I noticed that the program completely disappeared. In other
>> words, it was uninstalled without me doing anything.
>
> Why not just install it again? I see two possibilities. It only got
> uninstalled because something related got installed on the 2nd Tuesday
> update, OR a check is made every 2nd Tuesday and it will get uninstalled
> in a month , every month. I think it's the first and you won't have
> more problems for years, but I'm guessing. Others here might know how
> that actually works.

Thanks, but I did that already. Seems to be working. I read online that
other people who were experiencing the same problem as me were able to
get programs to stay installed by reinstalling them two or three times.

--
John C. No ad, CD, cripple, demo, nag, pay, pirated, share, spy,
time-limited, trial or web wares for me please.

So that I don't see them, I filter out crossposts (messages sent to
multiple newsgroups at a time) and from various trolls (like "al" AKA
"Bill Bennett".)
If you do the same, the group will be easier for you to read.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sun, 28 Apr 2024 07:49:23 -0700, "John C."
<r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:

>micky wrote:
>> In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on 25 Apr 2024 14:30:57 GMT, Frank Slootweg
>> <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>> This smacks of collusion between Microsoft and Canon in order to get
>>>> people to purchase new scanners from Canon.
>>>
>>> Some comment about stupidity versus malice?
>>
>> Not even stupidity. It's awfully hard to test updates with every device
>> out there to make sure it's still compatible. That's why Apple doesn't
>> let every Tom, Dick and Harry write software, etc for their products,
>> but it's also why there are far fewer programs to run.
>
>The scanner not only worked for me for a while in Windows 10, but many
>other Canoscan 8400F users experienced the same thing for a few years
>before a Microsoft updated rendered their scanners non-functional as well.
>
>Am I supposed to be happy about this kind of thing? My scanner still
>works physically and if I were to set up one of my older computers
>(something I don't have the room for in my house), I could easily attach
>the scanner to it and prove that it works.
>
>Would YOU be happy about being forced to purchase a new scanner? The

I never said you should be happy. I said it's hard to test every OS
modification to see if it works with every piece of software written by
1000's, tens of 1000's, of software companies.

>only scanners being made these days that combine negative and slide
>scanning capability are very, very expensive. >80(>

John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:

> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> Stan Brown <the_stan_brown@fastmail.fm> wrote:
>>
>>> Frank Slootweg wrote:
>>>
>>>> How do you *know* the program was "removed" (uninstalled)? Was it
>>>> listed in Control Panel (-> Programs -> Programs and Features) and
>>>> is it no longer listed there?
>
> I know because I just installed the program. It runs in the background
> with an icon on the Tray. I noticed when I started up the system a
> couple of days ago that the icon was missing. When I tried to find the
> program in my Start Menu, it wasn't there. When I looked in "Programs
> and Features", it was no longer listed as an installed program.
>
> I did NOT uninstall the program myself. Period.

There are installable and portable versions of WizMouse. The installer
likely adds the Start menu and desktop shortcuts, and probably defaults
to showing a systray icon. For the portable version, you merely copy
the files (no shortcuts unless you create them). Could be there is an
option of whether or not to show a systray icon, especially for the
portable version (but then it really isn't portable if it gets added as
a startup program since affects the registry for startup proggies).

Seems you moved from Windows 7 to 10. Was that an upgrade from 7 to 10?
Or did you do a fresh install of Win10, and then install (not copy the
portable version of) WizMouse?

Do you run any cleanup tools (e.g., CCleaner, Bleachbit, etc)? Where
was the install folder for WizMouse? Is that folder, or its parent, a
target for a cleanup tool?

>>> Another possibility: Windows Security (formerly Windows Defender) or
>>> the Malicious Software Removal Tool might have decided those programs
>>> were dangerous and quarantined them.
>
> There was no notification and not mention of it being uninstalled that
> I was able to find anywhere.
>
>>> To check that in Windows Security, open Settings; select
>>> Update & Security
>>> Windows Security
>>> Virus & Threat Protection
>>> Protection History
>>> If there are any "This app has been blocked" notations, click on each
>>> one in turn.

To verify, did you check where Slootweg mentioned in Defender's history?

>> I downloaded the portable version of WizMouse (so I could see the files
>> instead of the installer executable). I submitted wizmouse.exe and
>> wizmouse.dll to VirusTotal. The .exe had a couple hits on obscure AVs,
>> but those are insignificant. The .dll had no hits. I don't think
>> Defender saw wizmouse as malware, but only looking it its logs might
>> show it decided it was a PUP (Probably Unwanted Program) or PUA
>> (Potentially Unwanted Application).
>
> I was going to explore whether or not MS's implementation of the
> feature did things like automatically move the background window to
> the foreground when I scrolled it. I do not want this to happen.
> However, before I was able to determine if this was the case or not,
> the program disappeared.

In Win10 settings, go to Mouse, and check if the option "Scroll inactive
windows when I hover over them" is enabled. Scrolling the inactive
window does not change focus (the inactive window does rise to the top).

For what you do not want for now (make the scrolled inactive window rise
to the top), another option might look at is to make a window rise to
the top just by hovering the mouse over it. This is called the X-mouse
function. See:

https://winaero.com/enable-xmouse-window-tracking-windows-10/

Scrolling an inactive window means part of that window could be
partially obliterated by another window. The x-mouse function lets you
pop the target window to the top that you could then scroll. Hover the
mouse over the prior window to have it get focus again. However, if I
need the scrolled window to be completely visible, I just click on it.

John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I'm not running my scanner from a "smart" phone, I'm running it from my
> desktop computer. The software it uses is referred to correctly as an
> "application".

Microsoft confused and conflated the terminology. Programs and
applications meant the same thing (Win32 programs), so application was
often abbreviated to "app". Then Microsoft came out with UWP (Universal
Windows Platform) apps. They didn't call them applications, or UWPs, or
newapps, but just apps. This confused the new UWP apps with the old
Win32 apps. So, now "app" means a UWP application, and application or
program means a Win32 application. Which terminology you lean towards
depends on how long you've been using PCs.

"John C." <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:

> John Hall wrote:
>
>> John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> WROTE:
>>
>>> Has anybody else experienced this problem (programs being uninstalled
>>> without permission)
>>
>> I've been using 10 for about five years and, to the best of my
>> knowledge, have never had that happen. Could your anti-virus have
>> quarantined the program as suspicious without your being aware of it? It
>> might be worth checking.
>
> That was about the first thing I checked. Nope, the program just
> disappeared.

With mention of anti-virus comes to mind possible other-actor malicious
action whether deliberate or accidental.

Have you enabled RDP to allow remote access to your computer? Is Remote
Assistance disabled? See:

https://winaero.com/disable-remote-assistance-windows-10/

I disabled that long ago. Don't need it, won't allow it, and disabled
it should there be any vulnerabilities.

Running any other remoting software (e.g., VNC, TeamViewer)? I have
used both in the past, but never left them running (as a server to
accept new outside connects).

What you described I've not seen happen: suddenly installed programs
disappearing. So, I'd make sure no one can remote into your computer to
perform accidental or malicious actions.

There is one condition where I've seen programs disappear: a corrupted
Windows profile. There are online articles on how to mend, but I
usually don't bother, create a new Windows profile, and start again. In
fact, you can backup your Windows profile: run sysdm.cpl, Advanced tab,
User Profiles, Copy To.

However, I resort to using an image backup to restore the drives back to
the exact state as before. The backups are scheduled. Relying on the
user to perform a backup means unreliable backups. Do you have image
backups to which you could restore your computer to when you saw the now
missing programs? You could try using System Restore, but that does not
revert the drive(s) back to their exact state as before. Restoring from
image backups does. If you don't do backups then nothing on your
computer is important.

If you already did a restore from backup, could be the backup from which
you restored was created before you installed the software or drivers.

On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 13:58:55 -0500, VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> wrote:

>John C. <r9jmg0@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm not running my scanner from a "smart" phone, I'm running it from my
>> desktop computer. The software it uses is referred to correctly as an
>> "application".
>
>Microsoft confused and conflated the terminology. Programs and
>applications meant the same thing (Win32 programs), so application was
>often abbreviated to "app". Then Microsoft came out with UWP (Universal
>Windows Platform) apps. They didn't call them applications, or UWPs, or
>newapps, but just apps. This confused the new UWP apps with the old
>Win32 apps. So, now "app" means a UWP application, and application or
>program means a Win32 application. Which terminology you lean towards
>depends on how long you've been using PCs.

In my understanding and usage "app" is short for "application program"
and is distingushed from other programs by what it is used for. There
are programs like "utilities" that are for maintaining the computer's
running, or system programs that are not apps.

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Steve Hayes:

> In my understanding and usage "app" is short for
> "application program" and is distingushed from other
> programs by what it is used for. There are programs like
> "utilities" that are for maintaining the computer's
> running, or system programs that are not apps.

You are correct. I find `app' exceedingly vulgar, and
prefer the normal terms `program' and `application'.

--
() ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org -- against proprietary attachments

Anton Shepelev wrote:

>> In my understanding and usage "app" is short for
>> "application program" and is distingushed from other
>> programs by what it is used for. There are programs like
>> "utilities" that are for maintaining the computer's
>> running, or system programs that are not apps.
>
> You are correct. I find `app' exceedingly vulgar, and
> prefer the normal terms `program' and `application'.

To me they are all programs. I only use "app" about programs on my
mobile when talking with other people.

--
Bertel
Kolt, Denmark