Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no

https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a

OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give up?
Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy something
from them, you don't actually own it.
--

On 12/27/23 22:25, Retrograde wrote:
> Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
> From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
>
> https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
>
> OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give up?
> Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy something
> from them, you don't actually own it.

You can own digital files, just not the ones they give you. I heard
piracy is up by some big percentage since all the services started
removing things.

Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> wrote:
>Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
>From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no

I wish people would stop using the word "digital" to mean something else
unrelated to being digital.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> wrote:
> Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
> From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
>
> https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
>
> OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give up?
> Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy something
> from them, you don't actually own it.

Yes, every company wants you to rent as opposed to buy.
You can see this trend slowly moving into the Auto Industry,
there was some push back when tried on fossil fuel vehicles
(BMW), all that did was slow down the trend.

But I think once EVs are in the majority, everyone will be
"renting". This I blame on the Proprietary Software Industry,
they are making money had-over-fist due to their License and
other Industries are looking at them with envy.

I almost wonder with crisper if the for profit hospitals and
drug companies are heading that way. I just heard about a new
weight-loss drug you need to take forever. It works great,
but once you stop it, you gain the weight back.

A pretty sad world we are moving to. Maybe people will smarten
up and never use rentable products. But I doubt it :(

--
[t]csh(1) - "An elegant shell, for a more... civilized age."
- Paraphrasing Star Wars

Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> writes:

> Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
> From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
>
> https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
>
> OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give up?
> Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy something
> from them, you don't actually own it.
Easy. Don't do business with such companies. It may not be convenient,
but at the end of the day all you need is food, water, clothing and
shelter. Can't own my car in ten years? Fine, I will bike or walk.

cr0c0d1le <cr0c0d1le@cogeco.ca> writes:

> Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> writes:
>
>> Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
>> From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
>>
>> https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
>>
>> OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give up?
>> Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy something
>> from them, you don't actually own it.
>
> Easy. Don't do business with such companies. It may not be convenient,
> but at the end of the day all you need is food, water, clothing and
> shelter. Can't own my car in ten years? Fine, I will bike or walk.

Not a rural octogenarian, then, eh?

--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada

Am 27.12.2023 schrieb Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid>:

> OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give
> up? Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy
> something from them, you don't actually own it.

I don't have something by Amazon (I don't buy there) nor from SONY.

Although, my Cisco stuff includes ethernet chips from broadcom.

I don't have any DRM ebooks, nor DRM movies/music, nor subscriptions.

I am still not bored, there is so much interesting free and better stuff
available.

Am 27.12.2023 schrieb immibis <news@immibis.com>:

> On 12/27/23 22:25, Retrograde wrote:
> > Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
> > From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
> >
> > https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
> >
> > OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give
> > up? Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy
> > something from them, you don't actually own it.
>
> You can own digital files, just not the ones they give you. I heard
> piracy is up by some big percentage since all the services started
> removing things.

Isn't that the worst case for the copyright holders that they wanted to
avoid?

Am 28.12.2023 schrieb John McCue <jmccue@magnetar.jmcunx.com>:

> Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> wrote:
> > Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
> > From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
> >
> > https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
> >
> > OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give
> > up? Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy
> > something from them, you don't actually own it.
>
> Yes, every company wants you to rent as opposed to buy.
> You can see this trend slowly moving into the Auto Industry,
> there was some push back when tried on fossil fuel vehicles
> (BMW), all that did was slow down the trend.
>
> But I think once EVs are in the majority, everyone will be
> "renting". This I blame on the Proprietary Software Industry,
> they are making money had-over-fist due to their License and
> other Industries are looking at them with envy.

They already implement DRM in their combustion engine vehicles.
BMW offers a subscription for certain features.

> I almost wonder with crisper if the for profit hospitals and
> drug companies are heading that way. I just heard about a new
> weight-loss drug you need to take forever. It works great,
> but once you stop it, you gain the weight back.

People simply need to know that changing the food they eat is mostly
enough.

> A pretty sad world we are moving to. Maybe people will smarten
> up and never use rentable products. But I doubt it

I doubt too.
People love buying cheap and fast-living stuff.

Just look at the cloth stores and the people who go there multiple
times a year to buy clothes, wear them one time and give them away.

Or the electronic industry, where people love buying devices that can't
be opened to repair them.

Am 27.12.2023 schrieb cr0c0d1le <cr0c0d1le@cogeco.ca>:

> Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> writes:
>
> > Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
> > From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
> >
> > https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
> >
> > OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give
> > up? Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy
> > something from them, you don't actually own it.
> Easy. Don't do business with such companies.

That's what I mostly do.

> It may not be convenient, but at the end of the day all you need is
> food, water, clothing and shelter. Can't own my car in ten years?
> Fine, I will bike or walk.

I decided to look for a job where I can work most of the time from home
- I am sitting in front of a computer anyway.

And even if I need a car, I will simply buy a used old one, without all
the crappy assistant systems (that can't be turned off when needed) and
the electronic that can't be fixed or even has planned obsolescence
included.

On 12/28/23 11:36, Marco Moock wrote:
> Am 27.12.2023 schrieb immibis <news@immibis.com>:
>
>> On 12/27/23 22:25, Retrograde wrote:
>>> Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
>>> From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly no
>>>
>>> https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
>>>
>>> OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common? Give
>>> up? Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you buy
>>> something from them, you don't actually own it.
>>
>> You can own digital files, just not the ones they give you. I heard
>> piracy is up by some big percentage since all the services started
>> removing things.
>
> Isn't that the worst case for the copyright holders that they wanted to
> avoid?
>
I find a good rule of thumb is that capitalists are idiots.

On 12/28/23 03:58, cr0c0d1le wrote:
> Can't own my car in ten years? Fine, I will bike or walk.

They made it illegal to put the places you want to go to within a
distance you can bike in two hours.

Am 28.12.2023 um 19:35:25 Uhr schrieb immibis:

> On 12/28/23 11:36, Marco Moock wrote:
> > Am 27.12.2023 schrieb immibis <news@immibis.com>:
> >
> >> On 12/27/23 22:25, Retrograde wrote:
> >>> Bricking it: Do you actually own anything digital?
> >>> From ebooks, to videos and software, the answer is increasingly
> >>> no
> >>>
> >>> https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/22/opinion_column/?td=rt-3a
> >>>
> >>> OPINION What do Amazon, Sony, and Broadcom all have in common?
> >>> Give up? Each, in their own way, has made it clear that when you
> >>> buy something from them, you don't actually own it.
> >>
> >> You can own digital files, just not the ones they give you. I heard
> >> piracy is up by some big percentage since all the services started
> >> removing things.
> >
> > Isn't that the worst case for the copyright holders that they
> > wanted to avoid?
> >
> I find a good rule of thumb is that capitalists are idiots.

That is generally wrong. Every company or individual who works for
profit is a capitalist.

Some of them don't know the market nor/or the customers and for example
think DRM is a good thing.

Den 2023-12-28 skrev John McCue <jmccue@magnetar.jmcunx.com>:
> Yes, every company wants you to rent as opposed to buy.
> You can see this trend slowly moving into the Auto Industry,
> there was some push back when tried on fossil fuel vehicles
> (BMW), all that did was slow down the trend.
>
> But I think once EVs are in the majority, everyone will be
> "renting". This I blame on the Proprietary Software Industry,
> they are making money had-over-fist due to their License and
> other Industries are looking at them with envy.
>

I've worked for a company providing embedded Linux systems for
telemetry and over-the-air updates in vehicles and the auto industry
is already there since a number of years. With cars being connected to
the net, automakers are now very paranoid about the software running
in their vehicles and you won't sell an embedded system without secure
boot and signed binaries.

For the last product I worked on, there would be no way for a customer
to ever get access to the signing keys needed to sign their own
software to run on the board we supplied. The reason for wanting to
keep the customer out software-wise was mostly the fear of liability
for modifications a customer might make that cause issues.

Am 28.12.2023 schrieb Andreas Kempe <kempe@lysator.liu.se>:

> For the last product I worked on, there would be no way for a customer
> to ever get access to the signing keys needed to sign their own
> software to run on the board we supplied. The reason for wanting to
> keep the customer out software-wise was mostly the fear of liability
> for modifications a customer might make that cause issues.

Allowing the customers to modify the software means they can circumvent
any restrictions created by the manufacturer, including downgraded
motors or special features that need to be paid, but are included by
default and will simply be disabled.

Den 2023-12-29 skrev Marco Moock <mm+usenet@dorfdsl.de>:
>
> Allowing the customers to modify the software means they can circumvent
> any restrictions created by the manufacturer, including downgraded
> motors or special features that need to be paid, but are included by
> default and will simply be disabled.
>

I'm sure that's the case as well, but for the product I worked on,
there were no such features. We only had one feature set that everyone
who bought the car would get.

Andreas Kempe <kempe@lysator.liu.se> wrote:
>
>For the last product I worked on, there would be no way for a customer
>to ever get access to the signing keys needed to sign their own
>software to run on the board we supplied. The reason for wanting to
>keep the customer out software-wise was mostly the fear of liability
>for modifications a customer might make that cause issues.

I hate it when companies do this, because all you can do as a user is throw
out the whole damn control unit, hardware and software, and replace it with
your own. This is no fun.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On 12/28/23 20:57, Marco Moock wrote:
> Am 28.12.2023 um 19:35:25 Uhr schrieb immibis:
>
>> I find a good rule of thumb is that capitalists are idiots.
>
> That is generally wrong. Every company or individual who works for
> profit is a capitalist.
>
> Some of them don't know the market nor/or the customers and for example
> think DRM is a good thing.
>

A "capitalist" isn't usually just a person who participates in
capitalism - it's either a person who believes capitalism is good (and
wants to increase the amount of it, etc) or a person who derives their
income primarily by owning capital. As a rule of thumb, both groups are
idiots.