I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:

First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:

https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R

You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
previous version of TB.

Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:

https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy

doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
subfolders the way it did in the previous version.

This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
version 102.15.1

Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.

Feature degradation sucks.

--
John C.

On 24.12.23 15:59, John C. wrote:
> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>
> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>
> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>
> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
> previous version of TB.
>
> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>
> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>
> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>
> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
> version 102.15.1
>
> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>
> Feature degradation sucks.

Are you really sure that TB 115+ is your intrinsic problem?
If so I tend to strongly disagree.

--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)

Jörg Lorenz wrote:
> On 24.12.23 15:59, John C. wrote:
>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>
>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>
>> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>
>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>> previous version of TB.
>>
>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>
>> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>
>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>
>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>> version 102.15.1
>>
>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>
>> Feature degradation sucks.
>
> Are you really sure that TB 115+ is your intrinsic problem?
> If so I tend to strongly disagree.

What? Are you not experiencing this same issue?

Note that I don't caret about whether or not you find the feature of use
to you. *I* find the feature to be critical to the way I back up my email.

--
John C.

On 24.12.23 16:20, John C. wrote:
> Jörg Lorenz wrote:
>> On 24.12.23 15:59, John C. wrote:
>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>
>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>
>>> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>
>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>> previous version of TB.
>>>
>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>
>>> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>
>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>
>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>> version 102.15.1
>>>
>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>
>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>
>> Are you really sure that TB 115+ is your intrinsic problem?
>> If so I tend to strongly disagree.
>
> What? Are you not experiencing this same issue?
>
> Note that I don't caret about whether or not you find the feature of use
> to you. *I* find the feature to be critical to the way I back up my email.

That's OK.

--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)

John C. wrote:
> Jörg Lorenz wrote:
>> On 24.12.23 15:59, John C. wrote:
>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>
>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>
>>> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>
>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>> previous version of TB.
>>>
>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>
>>> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>
>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>
>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>> version 102.15.1
>>>
>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>
>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>
>> Are you really sure that TB 115+ is your intrinsic problem?
>> If so I tend to strongly disagree.
>
> What? Are you not experiencing this same issue?
>
> Note that I don't caret about whether or not you find the feature of use
> to you. *I* find the feature to be critical to the way I back up my email.

Forget that. I see now that you think Supernova *IS* ready for prime
time. I disagree and that's that from my viewpoint. I've just spent the
last half hour looking in the internet archives for 102.15.1 and see
that the Mozilla webmasters in the recent past wrote code into the
earlier versions of the TB home page to redirect download requests to
only allow downloading of 115.

This kind of conduct is reprehensible.

--
John C.

On 12/24/2023 9:28 AM, John C. wrote:
> John C. wrote:
>> Jörg Lorenz wrote:
>>> On 24.12.23 15:59, John C. wrote:
>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>
>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>
>>>> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>
>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>
>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>
>>>> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>
>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>
>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>
>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>>
>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>
>>> Are you really sure that TB 115+ is your intrinsic problem?
>>> If so I tend to strongly disagree.
>>
>> What? Are you not experiencing this same issue?
>>
>> Note that I don't caret about whether or not you find the feature of use
>> to you. *I* find the feature to be critical to the way I back up my email.
>
> Forget that. I see now that you think Supernova *IS* ready for prime
> time. I disagree and that's that from my viewpoint. I've just spent the
> last half hour looking in the internet archives for 102.15.1 and see
> that the Mozilla webmasters in the recent past wrote code into the
> earlier versions of the TB home page to redirect download requests to
> only allow downloading of 115.
>
> This kind of conduct is reprehensible.
>

If you're open to trying Betterbird with your Thunderbird profile, there
is a download for Betterbird 102.15.1-bb41 (13 September 2023) at the
bottom of the page.

https://www.betterbird.eu/downloads/index.php

If not, here's the Thunderbird download for v102.15.1 in their archive.

https://archive.mozilla.org/pub/thunderbird/releases/102.15.1/win64/en-US/

On 24-Dec-2023 10:28, John C. wrote:
> John C. wrote:
>> Jörg Lorenz wrote:
>>> On 24.12.23 15:59, John C. wrote:
>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>
>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>
>>>> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>
>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>
>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>
>>>> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>
>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>
>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>
>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>>
>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>
>>> Are you really sure that TB 115+ is your intrinsic problem?
>>> If so I tend to strongly disagree.
>>
>> What? Are you not experiencing this same issue?
>>
>> Note that I don't caret about whether or not you find the feature of use
>> to you. *I* find the feature to be critical to the way I back up my email.
>
> Forget that. I see now that you think Supernova *IS* ready for prime
> time. I disagree and that's that from my viewpoint. I've just spent the
> last half hour looking in the internet archives for 102.15.1 and see
> that the Mozilla webmasters in the recent past wrote code into the
> earlier versions of the TB home page to redirect download requests to
> only allow downloading of 115.
>
> This kind of conduct is reprehensible.
>

https://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/thunderbird/releases/102.15.1/

On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>
> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>
> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>
> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
> previous version of TB.
>
> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>
> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>
> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>
> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
> version 102.15.1
>
> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>
> Feature degradation sucks.
>
Have turned on the menu bar?
or hit the alt key! Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
The 3 dots allow you to show some counts. Maybe not what you want, but they are counts.
--
Linux Mint 21.2 Cinnamon
Al

Serdu wrote:
> On 24-Dec-2023 10:28, John C. wrote:
>> John C. wrote:
>>> Jörg Lorenz wrote:
>>>> On 24.12.23 15:59, John C. wrote:
>>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the
>>>>> size
>>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes
>>>>> the
>>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>>
>>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>>
>>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>>
>>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>>
>>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>>
>>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>>
>>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue,
>>>>> but
>>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>>
>>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a
>>>>> lot
>>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm
>>>>> change.
>>>>>
>>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>>
>>>> Are you really sure that TB 115+ is your intrinsic problem?
>>>> If so I tend to strongly disagree.
>>>
>>> What? Are you not experiencing this same issue?
>>>
>>> Note that I don't caret about whether or not you find the feature of use
>>> to you. *I* find the feature to be critical to the way I back up my
>>> email.
>>
>> Forget that. I see now that you think Supernova *IS* ready for prime
>> time. I disagree and that's that from my viewpoint. I've just spent the
>> last half hour looking in the internet archives for 102.15.1 and see
>> that the Mozilla webmasters in the recent past wrote code into the
>> earlier versions of the TB home page to redirect download requests to
>> only allow downloading of 115.
>>
>> This kind of conduct is reprehensible.
>>
>
> https://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/thunderbird/releases/102.15.1/

Thanks, but AllanH already helped me over in alt.comp.freeware.

--
John C.

Big Al wrote:
> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>
>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>
>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>
>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>> previous version of TB.
>>
>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>
>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>
>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>
>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>> version 102.15.1
>>
>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>
>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>
> Have turned on the menu bar?
> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
> they are counts.

Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
message file size in KBs or MBs.

It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
then disabled automatic updating and version checking.

--
John C.

On 12/24/23 11:32 AM, John C. wrote:
> Big Al wrote:
>> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>
>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>
>>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>
>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>> previous version of TB.
>>>
>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>
>>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>
>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>
>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>> version 102.15.1
>>>
>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>
>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>
>> Have turned on the menu bar?
>> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
>> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
>> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
>> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
>> they are counts.
>
> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>
> It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
> then disabled automatic updating and version checking.
>
There is a check mark for show folder size, isn't that it?
--
Linux Mint 21.2 Cinnamon
Al

On 12/24/2023 10:32 AM, John C. wrote:
> Big Al wrote:
>> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>
>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>
>>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>
>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>> previous version of TB.
>>>
>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>
>>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>
>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>
>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>> version 102.15.1
>>>
>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>
>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>
>> Have turned on the menu bar?
>> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
>> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
>> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
>> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
>> they are counts.
>
> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>
> It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
> then disabled automatic updating and version checking.
>

I'm using 102.15.1, and I long ago disabled automatic updating--but I don't see any way to stop
Thunderbird from checking the version and nagging one to update. If there is such a way, please let
me know.

--
Thank you,
Jo-Anne

On 12/24/23 12:29 PM, Jo-Anne wrote:
> On 12/24/2023 10:32 AM, John C. wrote:
>> Big Al wrote:
>>> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>
>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>
>>>>     https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>
>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>
>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>
>>>>     https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>
>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>
>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>
>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>>
>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>>
>>> Have turned on the menu bar?
>>> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
>>> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
>>> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
>>> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
>>> they are counts.
>>
>> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
>> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>>
>> It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
>> then disabled automatic updating and version checking.
>>
>
> I'm using 102.15.1, and I long ago disabled automatic updating--but I don't see any way to stop Thunderbird from
> checking the version and nagging one to update. If there is such a way, please let me know.
>
In the thunderbird software folder, "C:\program files\mozilla thunderbird", create a folder called 'distribution'.
Inside that folder create a file called policies.json. Note the extension, not policies.json.txt.
Inside the json file put the 6 lines below.
Once you do, you can go to menu->help->about and you'll see it won't update.

Make backups!!!
6 lines of json file:

{
"policies":
{
"DisableAppUpdate": true
}
}

--
Linux Mint 21.2 Cinnamon
Al

On Sun, 24 Dec 2023 12:24:06 -0500, Big Al <alan@invalid.com> wrote:

>On 12/24/23 11:32 AM, John C. wrote:
>> Big Al wrote:
>>> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>
>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>
>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>
>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>
>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>
>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>
>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>
>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>
>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>>
>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>>
>>> Have turned on the menu bar?
>>> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
>>> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
>>> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
>>> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
>>> they are counts.
>>
>> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
>> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>>
>> It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
>> then disabled automatic updating and version checking.
>>
>There is a check mark for show folder size, isn't that it?

John C. is correct... the totals don't, er, add up.

e.g. I don't need/use the *size* column in the folder pane, but on TB
115.6.0 for example, *Archives* collapsed show zilch in size, though
there are several sub-folders. When *Archives* is expanded, the
sub-folders appear along wih their appropriate individual size.

In other folders with subs, any individual/separate items within a
folder are in a collapsed totalled figure, which however does *not*
include the sizes of any sub-folders.

On 12/24/23 01:05 PM, Nobody wrote:
> On Sun, 24 Dec 2023 12:24:06 -0500, Big Al <alan@invalid.com> wrote:
>
>> On 12/24/23 11:32 AM, John C. wrote:
>>> Big Al wrote:
>>>> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>>
>>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>>
>>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>>
>>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>>
>>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>>
>>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>>
>>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>>
>>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>>>
>>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>>>
>>>> Have turned on the menu bar?
>>>> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
>>>> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
>>>> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
>>>> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
>>>> they are counts.
>>>
>>> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
>>> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>>>
>>> It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
>>> then disabled automatic updating and version checking.
>>>
>> There is a check mark for show folder size, isn't that it?
>
> John C. is correct... the totals don't, er, add up.
>
> e.g. I don't need/use the *size* column in the folder pane, but on TB
> 115.6.0 for example, *Archives* collapsed show zilch in size, though
> there are several sub-folders. When *Archives* is expanded, the
> sub-folders appear along wih their appropriate individual size.
>
> In other folders with subs, any individual/separate items within a
> folder are in a collapsed totalled figure, which however does *not*
> include the sizes of any sub-folders.
Then if it's replaceable, someone should post a bug with all the screen captures that show the errors.
--
Linux Mint 21.2 Cinnamon
Al

On 12/24/23 02:30 PM, Big Al wrote:
> On 12/24/23 01:05 PM, Nobody wrote:
>> On Sun, 24 Dec 2023 12:24:06 -0500, Big Al <alan@invalid.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/24/23 11:32 AM, John C. wrote:
>>>> Big Al wrote:
>>>>> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>>>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>      https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>      https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>>>
>>>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Have turned on the menu bar?
>>>>> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
>>>>> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
>>>>> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
>>>>> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
>>>>> they are counts.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
>>>> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>>>>
>>>> It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
>>>> then disabled automatic updating and version checking.
>>>>
>>> There is a check mark for show folder size, isn't that it?
>>
>> John C. is correct... the totals don't, er, add up.
>>
>> e.g. I don't need/use the *size* column in the folder pane, but on TB
>> 115.6.0 for example, *Archives* collapsed show zilch in size, though
>> there are several sub-folders.  When *Archives* is expanded, the
>> sub-folders appear along wih their appropriate individual size.
>>
>> In other folders with subs, any individual/separate items within a
>> folder are in a collapsed totalled figure, which however does *not*
>> include the sizes of any sub-folders.
> Then if it's replaceable, someone should post a bug with all the screen captures that show the errors.
I just turn the counts on and the only thing I can look at (without making folders) is the Trash in my unified folders.
It shows 163 total, expanded it shows 124,3 and 10. That's 137! where is the other 26?
Not sure this is right but you might be onto something.

....oops. I just collapsed the trash and the total changed to 137. Maybe IMAP folders are not a good test!
--
Linux Mint 21.2 Cinnamon
Al

On 24.12.23 18:24, Big Al wrote:
> On 12/24/23 11:32 AM, John C. wrote:
>> Big Al wrote:
>>> On 12/24/23 09:59 AM, John C. wrote:
>>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>>
>>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>>
>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>>
>>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>>> previous version of TB.
>>>>
>>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>>
>>>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>>
>>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>>
>>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>>> version 102.15.1
>>>>
>>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>>
>>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>>>
>>> Have turned on the menu bar?
>>> or hit the alt key!  Look at View->Layout-Message Header Bar
>>> With that showing at the top of the folder list window, you'll see a
>>> large "new message" and beside it is 3 dots.
>>> The 3 dots allow you to show some counts.  Maybe not what you want, but
>>> they are counts.
>>
>> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
>> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>>
>> It's all moot now anyway though, since I just went back to 102.15.1 and
>> then disabled automatic updating and version checking.
>>
> There is a check mark for show folder size, isn't that it?

Too late: User agent:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Win64; x64; rv:102.0)
Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.15.1

--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)

On 24 Dec 2023 15:59, John C. wrote:
> Although I can see the size
> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
> subfolders.

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1870641

--
Viele Grüße, Jörg
Sent with Betterbird. Simply better. www.betterbird.eu
Es ist immer wieder erstaunlich: Kaum macht man's richtig, schon
funktioniert's!

Am 24.12.23 um 17:32 schrieb John C.:
> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
> message file size in KBs or MBs.

https://up.picr.de/46827552mu.png

It works perfectly. What else do you need?
BTW: 115.5.2 (64-Bit) on a macOS 14.

--
"Gutta cavat lapidem." (Ovid)

On Mon, 25 Dec 2023 10:20:28 +0100, Jörg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.net>
wrote:

>Am 24.12.23 um 17:32 schrieb John C.:
>> Thanks, but counts aren't what I was looking for. I was looking for
>> message file size in KBs or MBs.
>
>https://up.picr.de/46827552mu.png
>
>It works perfectly. What else do you need?
>BTW: 115.5.2 (64-Bit) on a macOS 14.

As always, the dogmatism of your wagging tail prevents you from
reading and understanding details.

As John C. raised originally, as I proved later, and as even Jörg
Knobloch (of the seeming beloved Butterbird) agreed, it is the *total*
size of a folder *containing sub-folders* which is, in Anglo-Saxon
terms, buggered.

On 26 Dec 2023 04:06, Nobody wrote:
> As John C. raised originally, as I proved later, and as even Jörg
> Knobloch (of the seeming beloved Butterbird) agreed, it is the*total*
> size of a folder*containing sub-folders* which is, in Anglo-Saxon
> terms, buggered.

A TB dev is working on the issue and a fix is available. We'll ship it
in the next release, likely (no promises made) 115.6.1 on 2nd January.

If someone is really desperate to have it, we could spin a 115.6.0
"latest build" including the fix earlier.

--
Viele Grüße, Jörg
Sent with Betterbird. Simply better. www.betterbird.eu
Es ist immer wieder erstaunlich: Kaum macht man's richtig, schon
funktioniert's!

On Tue, 26 Dec 2023 11:56:18 +0100, Jörg Knobloch <jorgk@jorgk.com>
wrote:

>On 26 Dec 2023 04:06, Nobody wrote:
>> As John C. raised originally, as I proved later, and as even Jörg
>> Knobloch (of the seeming beloved Butterbird) agreed, it is the*total*
>> size of a folder*containing sub-folders* which is, in Anglo-Saxon
>> terms, buggered.
>
>A TB dev is working on the issue and a fix is available. We'll ship it
>in the next release, likely (no promises made) 115.6.1 on 2nd January.
>
>If someone is really desperate to have it, we could spin a 115.6.0
>"latest build" including the fix earlier.

We knew that.

Is there an echo from a Swish alpine horn now?

So why did you post the smarty-pants' response (with linked ludicrous
graphic) very conveniently edited away, claiming the *total* already
worked?

John C. wrote:
> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>
> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>
> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>
> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
> previous version of TB.
>
> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>
> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>
> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>
> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
> version 102.15.1
>
> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>
> Feature degradation sucks.

I gave up. I've successfully been able to restore everything to what it
was before I updated to Supernova 115. I lost no email because I was
able to back up my 115 profile before reverting back to the earlier
version, and after replacing my 115 profile with my previously backed up
102.15.1 profile, I simply replaced files in it with files from the Mail
and News folders from the backed up 115 profile.

After that, I did a registry hack to turn off updating in TB altogether.

IMO (YMMV), Supernova lost too many features I depend on and as a
result, is a failure just like Australis was for Firefox.

--
John C.

Am 27.12.23 um 13:25 schrieb John C.:
> John C. wrote:
>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>
>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>
>> https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>
>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>> previous version of TB.
>>
>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>
>> https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>
>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>
>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>> version 102.15.1
>>
>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>
>> Feature degradation sucks.
>
> I gave up. I've successfully been able to restore everything to what it
> was before I updated to Supernova 115. I lost no email because I was
> able to back up my 115 profile before reverting back to the earlier
> version, and after replacing my 115 profile with my previously backed up
> 102.15.1 profile, I simply replaced files in it with files from the Mail
> and News folders from the backed up 115 profile.

Thank you Lord!

--
"Gutta cavat lapidem." (Ovid)

Jörg Lorenz wrote:
> Am 27.12.23 um 13:25 schrieb John C.:
>> John C. wrote:
>>> I use and depend on Thunderbird's ability to show me the total size of
>>> folders, including subfolders in the total. Although I can see the size
>>> of folders, since Supernova (115) the size of folders only includes the
>>> messages directly in those folders, but no longer includes the size of
>>> subfolders. Here's what I'm talking about:
>>>
>>> First, here's a screenshot of my Archives folder expanded:
>>>
>>>    https://imgur.com/a/3vijQ6R
>>>
>>> You can see in this image that the total size of the Archives folder
>>> isn't shown. That's all right though, because that's how it was in the
>>> previous version of TB.
>>>
>>> Collapsing the folder to hide its subfolders:
>>>
>>>    https://imgur.com/a/62EzEvy
>>>
>>> doesn't add up the total size of the Archives folder including its
>>> subfolders the way it did in the previous version.
>>>
>>> This is the breaking point for me. I've tried to correct the issue, but
>>> can't find a way to do it. I'm dumping Supernova and going back to TB
>>> version 102.15.1
>>>
>>> Supernova isn't ready for prime time yet IMO. The developers have a lot
>>> of problems to resolve before I'll ever use this major paradigm change.
>>>
>>> Feature degradation sucks.
>>
>> I gave up. I've successfully been able to restore everything to what it
>> was before I updated to Supernova 115. I lost no email because I was
>> able to back up my 115 profile before reverting back to the earlier
>> version, and after replacing my 115 profile with my previously backed up
>> 102.15.1 profile, I simply replaced files in it with files from the Mail
>> and News folders from the backed up 115 profile.
>
> Thank you Lord!

Over time, I've learned to take precautions before doing a major program
update of any kind. Doing this has saved me a lot of time and prevented
data loss.

--
John C.