Looking for eMail service that is:
private
anonymous
free

That does not kill my email in an app like thunderbird then ask me for
more personal stuff to get that email back working like Google does.
Google purposely does this to get more tracking date on us.

I know that there used o be a few but do not remember names.
On I know got hacked so badly they gave up, or at least that is their story.

On 8/19/2021 1:27 PM, Alley wrote:
> Looking for eMail service that is:
> private
> anonymous
> free
>
> That does not kill my email in an app like thunderbird then ask me for
> more personal stuff to get that email back working like Google does.
> Google purposely does this to get more tracking date on us.
>
> I know that there used o be a few but do not remember names.
> On I know got hacked so badly they gave up, or at least that is their story.
>

I think the free services only survive by collecting and selling your
data.

--
David E. Ross
<http://www.rossde.com/>

I am fully vaccinated against COVID-19 with Pzifer's vaccine.
Thus, I object to wearing a mask in order to protect morons
who refuse to be vaccinated.

On 20/08/2021 6:27 am, Alley wrote:
> Looking for eMail service that is:
>   private
>   anonymous
>   free
>
> That does not kill my email in an app like thunderbird then ask me for
> more personal stuff to get that email back working like Google does.
> Google purposely does this to get more tracking date on us.
>
> I know that there used o be a few but do not remember names.
> On I know got hacked so badly they gave up, or at least that is their
> story.

Try protonmail.com -- The free version

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Maurice Helwig
~~~~~~~~~~~~

On Thu, 19 Aug 2021 13:27:46 -0700
Alley <Alley@spanless.com> wrote:

> Looking for eMail service that is:
> private
> anonymous
> free
>
> That does not kill my email in an app like thunderbird then ask me
> for more personal stuff to get that email back working like Google
> does. Google purposely does this to get more tracking date on us.
>
> I know that there used o be a few but do not remember names.
> On I know got hacked so badly they gave up, or at least that is their
> story.

I use ProtonMail. There is a free version, but I pay forty eight
dollars a year.

https://protonmail.com/

Pricing:

https://protonmail.com/pricing

Alley <Alley@spanless.com> wrote:

> Looking for eMail service that is:
> private
> anonymous
> free
>
> That does not kill my email in an app like thunderbird then ask me for
> more personal stuff to get that email back working like Google does.
> Google purposely does this to get more tracking date on us.
>
> I know that there used o be a few but do not remember names.
> On I know got hacked so badly they gave up, or at least that is their story.

Wow, trying to follow the words, a bit difficult, so my assumption of
what is asked could be wrong. Maybe I need more coffee.

Not sure what is the difference between private and anonymous. Seems
the same to me. Pro-privacy seems pro-anonymous.

I understood the "free" part.

Goggle has no control over killing anything in any local e-mail client.
It only has control over what is on their server and in your account.
How is moving a message from the Junk folder back into the Inbox going
to track you somehow? They already have, and still have, the message
regardless in which folder it resides.

What "personal stuff" does Gmail request to "get that email back"? I
just move it from Junk or Deleted into whatever other folder I want.

From what it seems the OP was asking, Proton Mail might suffice. Oops,
I see Maurice already suggested that one. I had considered it as an
alternative; however, like Gmail looking at the content of your e-mails
when received, you have no control over spying performed by whomever is
the sender's e-mail provider. You're just secreting it on your end, not
the other end. Encryption would need to be employed at both endpoints
to ensure the message was never interrogated. And, to be sure, the
encryption would need to be local at each endpoint (i.e., within a local
e-mail client), and not by the e-mail provider.

You can get crazy with this. How do you protect against someone
monitoring the varying RF from the switch for each key of your keyboard?
Put your workstation inside a grounded steel box big enough for your
computer, keyboard, desk, chair, and you?

https://lasecwww.epfl.ch/keyboard/

Do I brick over all windows in a "secured room" to prevent someone from
using a laser mic directed at windows, in case I talk out what I might
write, or to prevent using binoculars to look over my shoulder?

Lots of ways to eavesdrop.

Alley wrote:

> Looking for eMail service that is:
> private
> anonymous
> free

I use a paid email service. $20/year, totally worth it.

--
If you're smiling, I must be doing something wrong.
-- AppleSeed

Auric__ <not.my.real@email.address> wrote:

> Alley wrote:
>
>> Looking for eMail service that is:
>> private
>> anonymous
>> free
>
> I use a paid email service. $20/year, totally worth it.

Which is ....?

"VanguardLH" <V@nguard.LH> wrote

| Goggle has no control over killing anything in any local e-mail client.
| It only has control over what is on their server and in your account.
| How is moving a message from the Junk folder back into the Inbox going
| to track you somehow? They already have, and still have, the message
| regardless in which folder it resides.
| | What "personal stuff" does Gmail request to "get that email back"? I
| just move it from Junk or Deleted into whatever other folder I want.
|

I suspect what he's talking about is the way that Google makes
it very difficult to 1) use an unknown-to-them device or 2)
not give them a cellphone number to text as part of the
authentication. They find any excuse they can to track who
you are, where you are, and what devices you use.

<Alley@spanless.com> wrote

| Looking for eMail service that is:
| private
| anonymous
| free
|

I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.

If it has to be free then it sounds like protonmail is what
you want, but be warned that free options are constantly
changing, some will dump you if you don't log in often enough,
many want an email address in order to give you an email
address... Honest/private and free don't typically go together.
If you're trying to screw them then they naturally feel free
to screw you.

On Thu, 19 Aug 2021 22:15:22 -0400, Mayayana wrote:
>
> I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
> to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
> set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.

If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it? So,
that we don't need third party email server? IOTW, our outgoing emails will
be sent directly by our mail server to recipient servers, and incoming
emails will be sent directly to our email server. And there's no need to
worry abour being tracked, because its our own mail server.

In message <sfn39s$gbl$1@dont-email.me>, Mayayana
<mayayana@invalid.nospam> writes
>Honest/private and free don't typically go together.

It does seem to be asking rather a lot, especially as the OP presumably
has unstated requirements that the service should be reliable and secure
(not quite the same thing as private) as well. Just how is the provider
supposed to cover the costs of this service? Deluge the user with
adverts, perhaps, but I'd find that highly annoying.
--
John Hall "Hard work often pays off after time, but laziness always
pays off now." Anon

JJ wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Aug 2021 22:15:22 -0400, Mayayana wrote:
>> I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
>> to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
>> set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.
>
> If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it? So,
> that we don't need third party email server? IOTW, our outgoing emails will
> be sent directly by our mail server to recipient servers, and incoming
> emails will be sent directly to our email server. And there's no need to
> worry abour being tracked, because its our own mail server.

With your rental setup, you will be stopped from offering
a service that allows email spamming.

Paul

"JJ" <jj4public@gmail.com> wrote

| >
| > I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
| > to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
| > set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.
| | If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it?

You mean like Hillary? :) I've never done that. I'm using
webhosting. Your method would require running your own
server computer, managing its security, and then you still
need to pay for a direct line to the Internet. ISPs generally
don't allow running your own server.

_nospam@jhall.co.uk> wrote

| >Honest/private and free don't typically go together.
| | It does seem to be asking rather a lot, especially as the OP presumably
| has unstated requirements that the service should be reliable and secure
| (not quite the same thing as private) as well. Just how is the provider
| supposed to cover the costs of this service? Deluge the user with
| adverts, perhaps, but I'd find that highly annoying.

I don't understand what you're asking. If you own your own
domain and pay a few dollars per month to have it hosted,
full service email accounts usually come with that. No ads.
No hanky panky. Because you're paying for it. Reliable and
secure is a big part of their product. No one would pay for
hosting if it were spotty service. They cover their costs by
doing a volume business.

The only ads I know of are with free hosting. Those used
to be very popular. You could host a webpage and they'd
put ads on it. For example, geocities, xoom... In fact, ISPs
used to offer free webspace. That's how I had my first
website. Things like www.verizon.com/username/

People today often don't understand that they can have
their own front door on the Internet. The "communal" information
superhighway has turned into a corporate shopping and services
venue. People using apps on cellphones are far removed from
a sense of the actual Internet.

There's $3/month hosting that probably won't provide email and
likely won't allow any kind of website other than a few pages.
Things like dreamhost or godaddy. They may have higher tier
service, but they're known for hosting 1 webpage cheap, for
small businesses that will never be visited and the customer will
forget that their charge card is being debited $3/month. They
usually specifically say you can't provide binaries for download.
In other words, their business depends on no one really using it.
(I think it's godaddy that advertises on TV. A very strange ad
with an elderly woman walking through a tunnel, swaggering. I
suppose that reflects the fact that most people don't understand
webhosting. So instead of advertising their service they just
show an elderly non-geek "killing it" in some sort of artificial
gaming landscape. In the background is a deep-voiced, growling
woman who's sort of singing but mostly just yelling, and sounds
like she might be the B&D act at a kinky nightclub. :)

But once you get into the range of about $10/month
you get real hosting, sometimes on a dedicated machine, and
the host manages full email service for your domain. But you
have to be careful. I once set up a site for a friend on Network
Solutions, figuring that would be quality hosting. It was overpriced,
yet they only provided email in one direction. (I've forgotten
whether it was POP or SMTP that was missing. I think it was POP.)
And they didn't make that clear until the deal was done. They'd
said they provided email accounts, but when I looked up in their
support to set it up it told me to use your ISP email for outgoing!

Aside from that, the hosts I've used have been very good. I used
futurequest.net for years. They were very good, with personal
service. But awhile back their whole system went kaput and they
neglected to let anyone know what was going on. Big mess. And
I was missing my personal+business email. So I regretfully quit
them after several days of having no idea when they'd get their
servers up again. Before that I was on Earthlink for a long time.
But I think they got sold. They subcontracted the webhosting
and email. The whole thing went south. I finally quit them when
nmy server logs were missing entries.

Now I'm using Knownhost. So far very dependable, and I was
able to reach support people on the phone when I needed to.
Though a host like that expects you to pretty much know what
you're doing. If you want full customer service the prices go
way up and you're in corporate customer range.

I found Knownhost from a webmasters Reddit group.
The group recommended 5 hosts. Knownhost was the only one with
a fully functioning website and clear explanations of exactly what
their packages included. (Ironic and bizarre... but hosting companies
often don't have very functional websites.)

VanguardLH wrote:

> Auric__ <not.my.real@email.address> wrote:
>
>> Alley wrote:
>>
>>> Looking for eMail service that is:
>>> private
>>> anonymous
>>> free
>>
>> I use a paid email service. $20/year, totally worth it.
>
> Which is ....?

My old ISP. When I canceled my internet service, they prorated my last
month's fee and applied the remainder to an email-only account. It's not
anonymous, being in the form of firstname.lastname@isp, but that was a choice
I made when signing up -- they would have accepted auric@isp if I'd asked for
it.

NordVPN has an article called "The best free anonymous email accounts in
2021" -- it agrees with Maurice Helwig and Johnny re: Protonmail:

https://nordvpn.com/blog/free-anonymous-email-account/

Personally, I like the idea of Tutanota.

--
Is that backfire I smell?

On 8/19/2021 4:41 PM, Maurice Helwig wrote:
> On 20/08/2021 6:27 am, Alley wrote:
>> Looking for eMail service that is:
>> private
>> anonymous
>> free
>>
>> That does not kill my email in an app like thunderbird then ask me for
>> more personal stuff to get that email back working like Google does.
>> Google purposely does this to get more tracking date on us.
>>
>> I know that there used o be a few but do not remember names.
>> On I know got hacked so badly they gave up, or at least that is their
>> story.
>
> Try protonmail.com -- The free version
>

That is the only one that I can think of.

On 8/19/2021 10:15 PM, Mayayana wrote:
> <Alley@spanless.com> wrote
>
> | Looking for eMail service that is:
> | private
> | anonymous
> | free
> |
>
> I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
> to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
> set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.
>
> If it has to be free then it sounds like protonmail is what
> you want, but be warned that free options are constantly
> changing, some will dump you if you don't log in often enough,
> many want an email address in order to give you an email
> address... Honest/private and free don't typically go together.
> If you're trying to screw them then they naturally feel free
> to screw you.
>

Yes, your best bet is to have your own domain and pay for a service. I
regularly use my 16+ year old MSN account and 12+ year old Yahoo
account, as well as my ISP e-mail. If I were to change e-mail
providers, the only route I'd go would be a paid host for my own domain.

On 8/20/2021 3:21 PM, Michael Trew wrote:
> On 8/19/2021 10:15 PM, Mayayana wrote:
>> <Alley@spanless.com> wrote
>>
>> | Looking for eMail service that is:
>> | private
>> | anonymous
>> | free
>> |
>>
>> I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
>> to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
>> set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.
>>
>> If it has to be free then it sounds like protonmail is what
>> you want, but be warned that free options are constantly
>> changing, some will dump you if you don't log in often enough,
>> many want an email address in order to give you an email
>> address... Honest/private and free don't typically go together.
>> If you're trying to screw them then they naturally feel free
>> to screw you.
>>
>
> Yes, your best bet is to have your own domain and pay for a service. I
> regularly use my 16+ year old MSN account and 12+ year old Yahoo
> account, as well as my ISP e-mail. If I were to change e-mail
> providers, the only route I'd go would be a paid host for my own domain.
>

Possibly as early as 2002, I had my own personalized domain. Since
then, I have changed the hosts of my E-mail and Web site twice without
notifying anyone other than the hosts. The hosts arranged for updating
the DNS system so that there were never interruptions in my E-mail
service or access to my Web site.

--
David E. Ross
<http://www.rossde.com/>

I am fully vaccinated against COVID-19 with Pfizer's vaccine.
Thus, I object to wearing a mask in order to protect morons
who refuse to be vaccinated.

On Fri, 20 Aug 2021 05:28:17 -0400, Paul wrote:
> JJ wrote:
>> On Thu, 19 Aug 2021 22:15:22 -0400, Mayayana wrote:
>>> I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
>>> to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
>>> set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.
>>
>> If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it? So,
>> that we don't need third party email server? IOTW, our outgoing emails will
>> be sent directly by our mail server to recipient servers, and incoming
>> emails will be sent directly to our email server. And there's no need to
>> worry abour being tracked, because its our own mail server.
>
> With your rental setup, you will be stopped from offering
> a service that allows email spamming.

It due to that DKMS thingy?

On Fri, 20 Aug 2021 08:34:53 -0400, Mayayana wrote:
> "JJ" <jj4public@gmail.com> wrote
>
>|>
>|> I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
>|> to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
>|> set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.
>|
>| If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it?
>
> You mean like Hillary? :)

Huh? I don't know what you meant. Is that a software or a person?

> Your method would require running your own
> server computer, managing its security, and then you still
> need to pay for a direct line to the Internet.

Having my own domain doesn't always mean that my own home computer be made
the server. The computer can be from a web hosting which is customizable
enough to be installed with anything I want.

> ISPs generally don't allow running your own server.

My question is for web hostings or server providers which actually provides
some freedom for users to setup/install any type of server.

JJ wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Aug 2021 05:28:17 -0400, Paul wrote:
>> JJ wrote:
>>> On Thu, 19 Aug 2021 22:15:22 -0400, Mayayana wrote:
>>>> I have my own domain. That may be more that you want
>>>> to deal with. But for $8-10/month you can get good hosting,
>>>> set up your own website, and have 20+ email addresses.
>>> If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it? So,
>>> that we don't need third party email server? IOTW, our outgoing emails will
>>> be sent directly by our mail server to recipient servers, and incoming
>>> emails will be sent directly to our email server. And there's no need to
>>> worry abour being tracked, because its our own mail server.
>> With your rental setup, you will be stopped from offering
>> a service that allows email spamming.
>
> It due to that DKMS thingy?

One of the tools used for such things, is the
Deep Packet Inspection box, which can recognize
attempts to use SMTP protocol and stop it.

One way a DPI box stops traffic, is by shooting
RST packets towards both ends of a measured connection.
Protocol-wise, this is a valid protocol used to indicate
a server is unwilling to listen to a request right now.
And you can send RST in both directions, making both ends
think the other end "is not ready".

ISPs have a standard defensive structure, a "set of features"
that they implement. This makes them good network citizens,
so they will get to keep their good reputations. The rules
they enforce, are not even all listed in the TOS. The features
are standard enough, that they don't even tell a customer
"you may not operate SMTP email servers". They just shoot
down attempts to reach such devices, with their DPI box.
Since every ISP does this, there is no reason to be explaining
to customers, how these things work.

Paul

"JJ" <jj4public@gmail.com> wrote

| >| If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it?
| >
| > You mean like Hillary? :)
| | Huh? I don't know what you meant. Is that a software or a person?
|

Hillary Clinton. She got in trouble because she was running
her own email server for US gov't email. That was a joke.
Never mind. :)

| > Your method would require running your own
| > server computer, managing its security, and then you still
| > need to pay for a direct line to the Internet.
| | Having my own domain doesn't always mean that my own home computer be made
| the server. The computer can be from a web hosting which is customizable
| enough to be installed with anything I want.

| My question is for web hostings or server providers which actually
provides
| some freedom for users to setup/install any type of server.

It may be possible but I've never seen such an option.
That's why I assumed it would have to be on your own server.
In my experience, webhosting usually provides lots of things,
like their own email server, PHP, etc. But they're
usually very restricted about what they'll let you use, because
they don't want to allow security risks. You choose what things
you need and they set it up for you. For instance, if you want
PHP support you tell them and their admin sets it up. They don't
let you fiddle directly with their computer.

With email you can set up your accounts, adjust spam filtering,
etc, but the backend part is not accessible. You get a "control
panel" webpage.

In most cases you
wouldn't even have a dedicated computer. Your domain address
will just point to a folder on a computer. If they did give you a
dedicated computer on which you can do whatever you want
then you'd really just be renting a PC with a direct cable online.

So I don't know enough to be sure of exactly what's possible
with webhosting, but I'd be surprised if any of them let you install
your own POP/SMTP operation. If they did I'd expect it to be
quite expensive.

That makes me think of Wordpress, which has become famous
for malware sites because people are able to install plugins, but
don't know what they're doing, don't bother with security patches,
and end up being hacked by Chinese wiseguys who then use
their site to do "driveby" installs of malware. And that's just with
very limited access that the Wordpress hosting provides.

JJ <jj4public@gmail.com> wrote:

> If we have our own domain, can't we just setup an email server on it?
> So, that we don't need third party email server? IOTW, our outgoing
> emails will be sent directly by our mail server to recipient servers,
> and incoming emails will be sent directly to our email server. And
> there's no need to worry abour being tracked, because its our own
> mail server.

Lease a domain (you never own them). Get an x.509 site certificate to
incorporate into your server, or use PGP (I think Sendmail uses PGP).
SMTP is not an encrypted protocol. Either both sending and receiving
clients would need to employ encryptions, or you would have to use SMTPS
which means any sending server connecting to yours would also have to
support SMTPS (SMTP via TLS). What server software are you going to use
to handle SMTP, POP, and IMAP traffic? Be prepared for a steep learning
curve. This is a Windows newsgroup. If you use Postfix for SMTP, and
Dovecot for POP and IMAP, you'll need to use and learn *NIX. Then you
need to setup a nameserver to add the necessary records, and setup up
SPF or DKIM, or both, and DMARC. Then you have to pay extra with your
ISP to have a business account since few or no ISPs allow operating a
publicly accessible server over a personal-use service tier. Then you
need to have your server located in a non-FiveEyes country, especially
outside of one that can issue a National Security Letter, or similar, to
squelch you from divulging that your server has been compromized by the
gov't, like having to keep logs and let the gov't have access to them
along with your message stores. Figure out how to secure your server
against DDOS, and DMZ to control access and protect the rest of your
intranetwork. And on and on it goes.

Without details, my guess is Mayanana is using someone else's e-mail
services rather than going through all the above. That means he is as
or secure and private, or not, as those other-party services permit.
Rolling your own and private service isn't easy, and highly unlikely to
be cost-free.

Note: I wasn't going to repair to screwed up attributions, so I just
show the following cited posters for context to my reply.

JJ wrote:
>
> Mayanana wrote:
>
>> You mean like Hillary? :)
>
> Huh? I don't know what you meant. Is that a software or a person?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-31806907