On Sat, 7 Aug 2021 at 18:09:02, mel <mel@no-mail.com> wrote (my
responses usually follow points raised):
[]
>I really hate getting into this kind of stuff...but -
>
>Keep doing what you're doing, Vanguard. I see your posts regularly in
>groups. There ain't hardly any of your kind left on Usenet.

Echoed.

My view of the hierarchy on several of the 'groups:

Paul. Knows lots about lots (including hardware). Usually gives an
exhaustive answer, that is nevertheless often followable and also
informative (_can_ give too much information [but we are all guilty of
that!]); I've learnt a lot from Paul's posts (or would have, if I could
remember it!). Paul used to think (or seem to) that Windows is great,
though in latter years has I think more moved to agree with the rest of
us that it's manageable, but has quirks. (All versions of Windows.)

Mayayana and VanguardLH. I'm afraid I confuse these two, because I think
they are very similar in character. One loves GUI and hates command
line, the other vice versa - I forget which is which. Both - one more
than the other - give _very_ lengthy answers (from which, again, I've
learnt a lot). One of them has a website - jsware - which contains both
useful utilities and informative essays. One (I _think_ it's Mayayana)
can go into a rant, usually combined with his lengthy answers. (Being
told they're similar - to the extent that I confuse them! - will
probably infuriate them both!)

I've learnt (and forgotten) a lot from all three of the above.

Third tier and below - about half a dozen mostly helpful people. I'd put
myself here: I'm not deep depth, but sometimes I think I give a short
answer where that's all that's required, and/or see what is being asked
when one (sometimes several) of the others doesn't (don't). I can go on
too long as well, and have wrong ideas about some things, at least in
some people's opinion - currently, for example, POP vs. IMAP, and SSDs.

There are of course assorted trolls, Appleseeds, Linux fanatics (Paul
-and maybe others - sometimes _use(s)_ Linux [e. g. to access Windows
files that are normally inaccessible], but doesn't push it as a _better_
alternative), and worse - many of whom are in my killfile. (One in
particular used to [may still but I don't see] ask apparently genuine
questions, but tweak the following discussion; produced _some_ useful
input, such as lists of utilities to do things [sometimes with useful
notes on each alternative], but I found I was wasting a _lot_ of time on
hir threads, and concluded that often - possibly always - they weren't
started for the apparent reason. Became abusive when crossed. A
notorious nymshifter.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Whoever decided to limit tagline length to 68 characters can kiss my

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

> There are of course assorted trolls, Appleseeds, Linux fanatics (Paul
> -and maybe others - sometimes _use(s)_ Linux

They're all tools.

Some tools are more useful than others.

The tools also tend to copy one another, which
controls their uniqueness. No purpose is served
by doing that.

I can barely scroll stuff on any platform, and
get pixel perfect accuracy of placement. That's how
scroll bar design has advanced over the years.

Paul

"J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote

| My view of the hierarchy on several of the 'groups:
| | Paul. Knows lots about lots (including hardware). Usually gives an
| exhaustive answer, that is nevertheless often followable and also
| informative (_can_ give too much information [but we are all guilty of
| that!]); I've learnt a lot from Paul's posts (or would have, if I could
| remember it!). Paul used to think (or seem to) that Windows is great,
| though in latter years has I think more moved to agree with the rest of
| us that it's manageable, but has quirks. (All versions of Windows.)
| | Mayayana and VanguardLH. I'm afraid I confuse these two, because I think
| they are very similar in character. One loves GUI and hates command
| line, the other vice versa - I forget which is which. Both - one more
| than the other - give _very_ lengthy answers (from which, again, I've
| learnt a lot). One of them has a website - jsware - which contains both
| useful utilities and informative essays. One (I _think_ it's Mayayana)
| can go into a rant, usually combined with his lengthy answers. (Being
| told they're similar - to the extent that I confuse them! - will
| probably infuriate them both!)
| | I've learnt (and forgotten) a lot from all three of the above.
| | Third tier and below - about half a dozen mostly helpful people. I'd put
| myself here: I'm not deep depth, but sometimes I think I give a short
| answer where that's all that's required, and/or see what is being asked
| when one (sometimes several) of the others doesn't (don't). I can go on
| too long as well, and have wrong ideas about some things, at least in
| some people's opinion - currently, for example, POP vs. IMAP, and SSDs.
| | There are of course assorted trolls, Appleseeds, Linux fanatics (Paul
| -and maybe others - sometimes _use(s)_ Linux [e. g. to access Windows
| files that are normally inaccessible], but doesn't push it as a _better_
| alternative), and worse - many of whom are in my killfile. (One in
| particular used to [may still but I don't see] ask apparently genuine
| questions, but tweak the following discussion; produced _some_ useful
| input, such as lists of utilities to do things [sometimes with useful
| notes on each alternative], but I found I was wasting a _lot_ of time on
| hir threads, and concluded that often - possibly always - they weren't
| started for the apparent reason. Became abusive when crossed. A
| notorious nymshifter.)

Jeeez. What a long rant. I can't figure out what you're on about. :)

Mayayana <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote:

> "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote
>
>| My view of the hierarchy on several of the 'groups:
>|
>| Paul. Knows lots ...
>| Mayayana and VanguardLH ...
>| I've learnt (and forgotten) a lot from all three of the above.
>| Third tier and below - about half a dozen mostly helpful people. ...
>| I'd put myself here ...
>| There are of course assorted trolls, ...
>
> Jeeez. What a long rant. I can't figure out what you're on about. :)

Still trying to squelch the participants, I see, with berating retorts.

Must be a bad week for you. It happens, and affects your mood. I, too,
have bad days, and am not so friendly as others may like, but then I'm
not getting paid to be here, either, and can be however I want.

At one time, I forget by who, I was invited to be an MVP. That was back
when Microsoft was carrying the microsoft.public.* newsgroups on their
NNTP server. I considered it for a moment, and politely declined. It
would repress my sometimes variable behavior by making me feel I had to
be amicable with everyone in Usenet, as though I had to behave like how
others expect an MVP to behave.

On Sun, 8 Aug 2021 at 11:23:47, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote (my
responses usually follow points raised):
>J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>
>> There are of course assorted trolls, Appleseeds, Linux fanatics (Paul
>>-and maybe others - sometimes _use(s)_ Linux
>
>They're all tools.
>
>Some tools are more useful than others.
>
>The tools also tend to copy one another, which
>controls their uniqueness. No purpose is served
>by doing that.

Yes; the number of GUIs for ffmpeg is hilarious. (I have it in: Skype;
VirtualDub; Deshaker; ClipGrab; downloadhelper; get_iplayer; Pazera
Audio Extractor; K-Lite; Bigasoft downloader; KMplayer; Any Video
Converter; Best Video Converter; and probably others that rename it.)
>
>I can barely scroll stuff on any platform, and
>get pixel perfect accuracy of placement. That's how
>scroll bar design has advanced over the years.

Scroll bars have definitely gone downhill. (!) Nowadays, by default,
they're invisible until you happen to move over them, skinny (and
variable width), and - YouTube at least - have lost the arrow buttons at
their ends.
>
> Paul
John
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"In the _car_-park? What are you doing there?" "Parking cars, what else does
one
do in a car-park?" (First series, fit the fifth.)

On Sun, 8 Aug 2021 at 11:42:57, Mayayana <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote
(my responses usually follow points raised):
>
>"J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote
>
>| My view of the hierarchy on several of the 'groups:
>|
>| Paul. Knows lots about lots (including hardware). Usually gives an
[]
>| Mayayana and VanguardLH. I'm afraid I confuse these two, because I think
[]
>| I've learnt (and forgotten) a lot from all three of the above.
>|
>| Third tier and below - about half a dozen mostly helpful people. I'd put
[]
>| There are of course assorted trolls, Appleseeds, Linux fanatics (Paul
[]
>Jeeez. What a long rant. I can't figure out what you're on about. :)
>
(-:
>
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Everyone looks sun-kissed and beautiful and as you watch it ["Bondi Rescue"],
pale and flabby on your sofa, you find yourself wondering if your life could
ever be that exotic. (It couldn't. You're British.) - Russell Howard, in
Radio Times, 20-26 April 2013

"VanguardLH" <V@nguard.LH> wrote

| > Jeeez. What a long rant. I can't figure out what you're on about. :)
| | Still trying to squelch the participants, I see, with berating retorts.
|

That was a joke, V. Take a breath.

On Sun, 8 Aug 2021 at 23:28:12, Mayayana <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote
(my responses usually follow points raised):
>"VanguardLH" <V@nguard.LH> wrote
>
>| > Jeeez. What a long rant. I can't figure out what you're on about. :)
>|
>| Still trying to squelch the participants, I see, with berating retorts.
>|
>
>That was a joke, V. Take a breath.
>
>
Yes, I saw it as one, and it was I who posted the original (-:
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"Get off my turf!" screamed Pooh, as he shot at Paddington.

On Mon, 9 Aug 2021 at 03:40:32, John Doe <always.look@message.header>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>Firstly... This sort of post should be labeled "OT..."

You're right, I probably should have, though arguably it's about posters
in the four 'groups chosen. (I didn't include free.spam.)
>
>Also, it shouldn't have been re-crossposted under a new subject line.

(Not sure what you mean by re-crossposted.) I wanted to follow-up (agree
with, as it happens) a post that was defending either VanguardLH or
Mayayana (I forget which). Thus it was a followup. I changed the subject
line as my post no longer had anything to do with the original subject -
in the RFC-approved manner ["<new subject> (was: Re: <old subject>"],
which some clients (not mine, and clearly not yours) recognise and strip
the "was" part on further responses.
>
>Also, attacking other posters in the subject line is a troll.

I don't think there was any attack, certainly not in the subject line.
OK, I described the _foibles_ of the three main leading lights of these
'groups, but in I hope an affectionate manner - and criticised myself
too.
>
>This is the same troll that used weird formatting when posting
>to the blind users' group...
>
This from the poster who reposted my entire post - _including the
header_ (as received by him) - but _after_ a valid .sig separator line
(-:
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"Get off my turf!" screamed Pooh, as he shot at Paddington.

"J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote

| >| > Jeeez. What a long rant. I can't figure out what you're on about. :)
| >|
| >| Still trying to squelch the participants, I see, with berating retorts.
| >|
| >
| >That was a joke, V. Take a breath.
| >
| >
| Yes, I saw it as one, and it was I who posted the original (-:

Maybe we should all just accept our anachronistic,
aging existence and stick to arguing about Trump and
Johnson. That way, any opinion is valid. And who cares
about Windows anymore, anyway? Most of the talk since
Win10 is about what the latest forced update messed up. :)

Mayayana <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote:

> "VanguardLH" <V@nguard.LH> wrote
>
>|> Jeeez. What a long rant. I can't figure out what you're on about. :)
>|
>| Still trying to squelch the participants, I see, with berating retorts.
>|
>
> That was a joke, V. Take a breath.

I see smilies after a retort the same as when folks say "I was just
saying", or "I just said", as though that alters what they said. Sorry.

But of course the difference is I'm posting
to a group of SIGHTED people...

--
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!border1.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer1.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!nntp.brightview.co.uk!news.brightview.co.uk.POSTED!not-for-mail
> NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2021 05:31:07 -0500
> Message-ID: <84qP1QkcOQEhFwbN@255soft.uk>
> Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2021 11:29:48 +0100
> From: "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk>
> Newsgroups: microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
> Subject: Re: Windows newsgroup characters (was: Re: My external drive names were changed.)
> References: <asxv1klavuyu$.8ez0kfibnvm0.dlg@40tude.net> <6aed571o7ypm$.dlg@v.nguard.lh> <15hq79hw0ez6y$.8br915i61yuk$.dlg@40tude.net> <1xe16svr9vjqx$.1uzzsggjxlhh3.dlg@40tude.net> <selso3$khk$1@dont-email.me> <1wn8rubjqot4b$.dlg@v.nguard.lh> <semt23$hc8$1@dont-email.me> <17qcrua5uy1oh$.dlg@v.nguard.lh> <oo1y0ns5c7wj.1swwzswql0eb8.dlg@40tude.net> <SMNEIVKdB$DhFw0w@255soft.uk> <seq83f$gq7$1@dont-email.me>
> Organization: 255 software
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed
> User-Agent: Turnpike/6.07-M (<HhmDL0dr8kyV3DEgF5dACwy0Yx>)
> Lines: 34
> X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
> X-Trace: sv3-uNyeTtJZVvKuz1lnfZYks3ASi4/OD4knE4bS3+ESUgzDpvv/JVUL4Go7MClGkdZwODNQb2+THc4Mn8B!AwHY52VvfdaSTA7jWsbyKwNGyuNjnPnwl2XYDRwJy8D8gnTy3wgO6BbZUg/OkFHQjZidCu3a
> X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
> X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
> X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
> X-Original-Bytes: 3049
> Xref: reader02.eternal-september.org microsoft.public.windowsxp.general:148243 microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion:17530 alt.windows7.general:195460 alt.comp.os.windows-10:150689
>
> On Mon, 9 Aug 2021 at 03:40:32, John Doe <always.look@message.header>
> wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
>>Firstly... This sort of post should be labeled "OT..."
>
> You're right, I probably should have, though arguably it's about posters
> in the four 'groups chosen. (I didn't include free.spam.)
>>
>>Also, it shouldn't have been re-crossposted under a new subject line.
>
> (Not sure what you mean by re-crossposted.) I wanted to follow-up (agree
> with, as it happens) a post that was defending either VanguardLH or
> Mayayana (I forget which). Thus it was a followup. I changed the subject
> line as my post no longer had anything to do with the original subject -
> in the RFC-approved manner ["<new subject> (was: Re: <old subject>"],
> which some clients (not mine, and clearly not yours) recognise and strip
> the "was" part on further responses.
>>
>>Also, attacking other posters in the subject line is a troll.
>
> I don't think there was any attack, certainly not in the subject line.
> OK, I described the _foibles_ of the three main leading lights of these
> 'groups, but in I hope an affectionate manner - and criticised myself
> too.
>>
>>This is the same troll that used weird formatting when posting
>>to the blind users' group...
>>
> This from the poster who reposted my entire post - _including the
> header_ (as received by him) - but _after_ a valid .sig separator line
> (-:
> --
> J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
>
> "Get off my turf!" screamed Pooh, as he shot at Paddington.
>
>

John Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote in news:ses9fs$vd7$1@dont-
email.me:

> But of course the difference is I'm posting
> to a group of SIGHTED people...
>

Top-posting, none-the-less, so...

On Tue, 10 Aug 2021 at 13:48:51, DanS
<t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote (my responses
usually follow points raised):
>John Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote in news:ses9fs$vd7$1@dont-
>email.me:
>
>> But of course the difference is I'm posting
>> to a group of SIGHTED people...
>>
>
>Top-posting, none-the-less, so...

And quoting full header.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Society has the right to punish wrongdoing; it doesn't have the right to make
punishment a form of entertainment. This is where things have gone wrong:
humiliating other people has become both a blood sport and a narcotic.
- Joe Queenan, RT 2015/6/27-7/3

On 10/08/2021 23:27, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
> On Tue, 10 Aug 2021 at 13:48:51, DanS
> <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote (my responses
> usually follow points raised):
>> John Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote in news:ses9fs$vd7$1@dont-
>> email.me:
>>
>>> But of course the difference is I'm posting
>>> to a group of SIGHTED people...
>>
>> Top-posting, none-the-less, so...
>
> And quoting full header.

He mentioned posting to a blind user group, so maybe he has vision
problems and it's his accessibility software that's responsible for the
top-posting and header inclusion. Be that as it may, ISTR that I've
plonked someone under the name 'John Doe' in the past, so he may not be
worth reading anyway.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk