https://dailystormer.su/massive-reddit-movement-to-ban-all-dissenting-coronavirus-information-even-harder/

Massive reddit Movement to Ban All Dissenting Coronavirus Information Even Harder

Andrew Anglin
August 29, 2021

I saw this pinned at the top of r/News:

https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/2021-08-29-09.15.00-www.reddit.com-6815c4887f3a.png

I clicked through to the thread,

https://www.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/pbe8nj/we_call_upon_reddit_to_take_action_against_the/

and found that virtually the entirety of reddit is now participating in
a campaign, organized by r/vaxxhappened, to call on reddit to start
deleting everything that disagrees with any aspect of the official CDC
narrative on the alleged virus.

What's more, they appear to be calling on even mainstream material to be
banned, if it goes against the ideology that everyone should be vaxxed
and wear masks all the time.

For example, the coroner recently ruled that a BBC presenter, Lisa Shaw,
had died from the vaccine. What the reddit thread claims is that it is
impossible to die from the vaccine, and any information which leads
people to believe it is possible to die from the vaccine should be
suppressed. That would mean that the BBC's own article about their own
presenter dying of the vaccine would have to be suppressed, and anyone
who posted it would be banned.

Probably, reddit is the purest example on earth of organized cult
groupthink in support of the government and media. But it is still
amazing to see how hardcore these people are.

Their argument, of course, is that it is the fault of people being
allowed to freely share information that the "pandemic" has not ended.
Like every other aspect of the coronavirus hoax, this is demonstrably
false. Israel has proved this.

American Association for the Advancement of Science, August 16:

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta

> Israel has among the world's highest levels of vaccination for COVID-19,
> with 78% of those 12 and older fully vaccinated, the vast majority with
> the Pfizer vaccine. Yet the country is now logging one of the world's
> highest infection rates, with nearly 650 new cases daily per million
> people. More than half are in fully vaccinated people, underscoring the
> extraordinary transmissibility of the Delta variant and stoking concerns
> that the benefits of vaccination ebb over time.
>
> The sheer number of vaccinated Israelis means some breakthrough
> infections were inevitable, and the unvaccinated are still far more
> likely to end up in the hospital or die. But Israel's experience is
> forcing the booster issue onto the radar for other nations, suggesting
> as it does that even the best vaccinated countries will face a Delta
> surge.

Obviously, introducing this "Delta variant" was simply a way to explain
why you need to keep taking more and more vaccines. But whatever you
believe about this, it is simply a fact that even if everyone believed
exactly as the media and government are telling them to believe, the
"pandemic" would still be ongoing.

https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Screen-Shot-2021-08-29-at-10.00.54-AM.png

Iceland is even more vaccinated than Israel, and they are also
experiencing a "surge" of the "Delta variant."

The health authorities have been wrong about absolutely everything, and
if the censorship policy was that no one is allowed to disagree with the
government and media, then back in early 2020, you would have been
censored for saying people should wear masks, as at that time, the
government and media were telling people not to wear masks.

We saw this with the Lab Leak hoax – Facebook had been banning people
for saying the supposed virus leaked from a lab, then when the media and
government started claiming that it leaked from a lab, Facebook
announced that they would no longer be banning people for that.

https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Screen-Shot-2021-08-29-at-10.00.03-AM.png

The ideology of mass censorship is utterly insane, and no one who
believes in objective truth can also believe in mass censorship of
information. The only people who believe in mass censorship of
information are cultists that worship authority.

This speaks to the fact that there is an underlying philosophical rot
behind this entire coronavirus hoax. To wit: a certain portion of the
population, made up primarily of women and feminized men who did not
have strong father figures, believe that the government should be their
daddy and all of the citizens should be little babies whose lives are
controlled by daddy.

https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/download-8.png

I mentioned this in an earlier piece today about the fact that New
Zealand is telling people they can't go see the whales: the initial
claim by the government that they had a right to make your decisions for
you with regards to what risk you were allowed to take was the original
folly of this entire program.

We are grown men. We have a right to make our own decisions about what
we do, about what we read, about what we think. Even if there was a
deadly virus, that would not change. If we allow all of our freedoms to
be taken away because of a virus, we never had those freedoms in the
first place, and they can now be suspended for any other reason.

https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Screen-Shot-2021-08-29-at-10.02.20-AM.png

The belief of these redditors that the government should have total
control over our lives and what we are allowed to think is incompatible
with a belief that human beings are made in the Image of God, imbued
with the ability to reason, and therefore must have the freedom to make
their own decision about their own lives. People who disagree about this
issue cannot possibly share a country together. These people who worship
authority are obsessed with forcing their will on the rest of us, and
there is no point at which they will stop. They will happily put us in
camps or simply kill us.

https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Screen-Shot-2021-08-29-at-10.02.57-AM.png

Certainly, reddit has a lot of Jewish moderators. But as we all know: we
do have many fellow citizens who believe in this hoax, and believe that
the only solution to this fake crisis is to surrender all of our
freedoms to the government and allow the establishment of a hardcore
tyranny that controls all of our thoughts and actions for the sake of
protecting us.

We need to begin a discussion about secession.

On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>
> https://dailystormer.su/massive-reddit-movement-to-ban-all-dissenting-coronavirus-information-even-harder/
>
> Massive reddit Movement to Ban All Dissenting Coronavirus Information Even Harder
>
> Andrew Anglin
> August 29, 2021
>
> I saw this pinned at the top of r/News:
>
> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - 0 9 . 1 5 . 0 0 - w w w . r e d d i t . c o m - 6 8 1 5 c 4 8 8 7 f 3 a . p n g

[Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]

"HOAX WATCH Exposing the endless series of nonsense from the J e w s
and w o m e n"

So obviously a fake news site for anti-semitism, misogyny, and probably
also the usual broad range of right-wing bigotries. No need to read
further.

> I clicked through to the thread,
>
> https://www.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/pbe8nj/we_call_upon_reddit_to_take_action_against_the/

"We call upon Reddit to take action against the rampant Coronavirus
misinformation on their website.

Everyone on this planet has been affected by the
SARS-Cov-2/Coronavirus/Covid-19 pandemic. You may have been in lockdown,
you may have been forced to work under some form of duress, you may have
lost a loved one to the disease, you may be left with long term side
effects of the illness, you may have found that regular food, housing,
and/or medical care is less attainable or more expensive now.

We could have been better off months ago, but disinformation and lies
have been allowed to spread readily through inaction and malice, and
have dragged this on at the cost of lives. There are those who deny that
the pandemic even exists, there are those who think that wearing a mask
will literally suffocate you, there are those who think it's no worse
than a regular flu virus, that it's a bioweapon, and everything in
between. This volume of blatant misinformation is problematic and dangerous.

It is clear that even after promising to tackle the problem of
misinformation on this site, nothing of substance has been done aside
from quarantining a medium sized subreddit, which barely reduces traffic
and does little to stop misinformation."

Can't disagree with that. See my sig.

> For example, the coroner recently ruled that a BBC presenter, Lisa Shaw,
> had died from the vaccine. What the reddit thread claims is that it is
> impossible to die from the vaccine, and any information which leads
> people to believe it is possible to die from the vaccine should be
> suppressed. That would mean that the BBC's own article about their own
> presenter dying of the vaccine would have to be suppressed, and anyone
> who posted it would be banned.

Lisa Shaw: Presenter's death due to complications of Covid vaccine
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-58330796

The presenter's death is unfortunate but true, so how could merely
reporting that be construed as misinformation? What would be
misinformation, as you are appearing to attempt, is to deduce from the
sad death of one person that vaccines are dangerous and should be
avoided. *THAT* would be misinformation. The slight dangers of the
vaccine itself are vastly outweighed by the *SAME* dangers from the
coronavirus itself, so vaccines represent a reduction of personal risk
against which it is irrational and nonsensical to argue.

Covid: Vaccine complications dwarfed by virus risks
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58347434

"A major review of vaccines suggests the AstraZeneca jab does raise the
risk of blood clots and another serious condition that can cause bleeding.

But the study found the risk of such problems following a coronavirus
infection was still much higher.

The University of Oxford-led team also found an increased risk of stroke
after the Pfizer jab - but again at a much lower rate than after infection.

The team said it once again showed the "substantial" benefit of
vaccination."

> Probably, reddit is the purest example on earth of organized cult
> groupthink in support of the government and media. But it is still
> amazing to see how hardcore these people are.

I don't use it, but to me, as a centrist, the above sounds like the
usual sort of right-wing bias to me.

> Their argument, of course, is that it is the fault of people being
> allowed to freely share information that the "pandemic" has not ended.

> Like every other aspect of the coronavirus hoax,

Fake news reported to a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t

If it's a hoax, how come all those people died?

> this is demonstrably false. Israel has proved this. >
> American Association for the Advancement of Science, August 16:
>
> https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta
>
>> Israel has among the world's highest levels of vaccination for COVID-19,
>> with 78% of those 12 and older fully vaccinated, the vast majority with
>> the Pfizer vaccine. Yet the country is now logging one of the world's
>> highest infection rates, with nearly 650 new cases daily per million
>> people. More than half are in fully vaccinated people, underscoring the
>> extraordinary transmissibility of the Delta variant and stoking concerns
>> that the benefits of vaccination ebb over time.
>>
>> The sheer number of vaccinated Israelis means some breakthrough
>> infections were inevitable, and the unvaccinated are still far more
>> likely to end up in the hospital or die. But Israel's experience is
>> forcing the booster issue onto the radar for other nations, suggesting
>> as it does that even the best vaccinated countries will face a Delta
>> surge.

The same is happening in the UK, particularly ATM Scotland, but there is
nothing surprising about this. We'll need boosters just as we do for
the flu jabs. It was always a high possibility, and sadly is now
beginning to look a certainty. However, the good news is that smaller
proportions of those infected who have been vaccinated are ending up in
hospital or dying, so the vaccines are still being immensely helpful in
saving lives and avoiding needless suffering.

> Obviously, introducing this "Delta variant" was simply a way to explain
> why you need to keep taking more and more vaccines.

Fake news reported to a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t

> But whatever you
> believe about this, it is simply a fact that even if everyone believed
> exactly as the media and government are telling them to believe, the
> "pandemic" would still be ongoing.

Of course, no-one's denying that, but it's still the case that fake news
such as you are propagandising here is dangerous at worst, unhelpful at
best. In an ideal world, fake news traffickers like you wouldn't exist,
but as your idiotic post proves we don't live in an ideal world, and
therefore it is necessary for society to protect itself against the
peddlers of propaganda like you. Hence my reporting you to the abuse
address of your news server.

> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / S c r e e n - S h o t - 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - a t - 1 0 . 0 0 . 5 4 - A M . p n g

[Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]

> Iceland is even more vaccinated than Israel, and they are also
> experiencing a "surge" of the "Delta variant."

Again, sadly, not news, and not surprising.

> The health authorities have been wrong about absolutely everything, and
> if the censorship policy was that no one is allowed to disagree with the
> government and media, then back in early 2020, you would have been
> censored for saying people should wear masks, as at that time, the
> government and media were telling people not to wear masks.

It is a simple fact that wearing masks helps prevent infection, mostly
from the wearer to others, less so from others to the wearer, so it's a
"I'll scratch your back if you'll scratch mine" thing, I wear a mask to
protect you, you should wear a mask to protect me.

Visualizing Speech-Generated Oral Fluid Droplets with Laser Light Scattering
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2007800

8 dangerous COVID-19 face mask myths you need to stop believing
https://www.cnet.com/health/8-dangerous-covid-19-face-mask-myths-you-need-to-stop-believing/

> We saw this with the Lab Leak hoax – Facebook had been banning people
> for saying the supposed virus leaked from a lab, then when the media and
> government started claiming that it leaked from a lab, Facebook
> announced that they would no longer be banning people for that.
>
> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / S c r e e n - S h o t - 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - a t - 1 0 . 0 0 . 0 3 - A M . p n g

[Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]

On Mon, 30 Aug 2021 13:18:28 +0100
Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:

> On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:

> Fake news reported to a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t
>

Thank you.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:

>> I saw this pinned at the top of r/News:
>> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t
>> / u p l o a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - 0 9 . 1 5 .
>> 0 0 - w w w . r e d d i t . c o m - 6 8 1 5 c 4 8 8 7 f 3 a . p n g
>
> [Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]
>
> "HOAX WATCH Exposing the endless series of nonsense from the J e w s
> and w o m e n"
>
> So obviously a fake news site for anti-semitism, misogyny, and
> probably also the usual broad range of right-wing bigotries. No need
> to read further.

The Daily Stormer is an American far-right, neo-Nazi, white
supremacist, misogynist, and Holocaust denial commentary and
message board website that advocates for a second genocide of
Jews. It considers itself a part of the alt-right movement. Its
editor, Andrew Anglin, founded it on July 4, 2013, as a faster-
paced replacement for his previous website Total Fascism, which
had focused on his own long-form essays on fascism, race, and
antisemitic conspiracy theories. In contrast, The Daily Stormer
relies heavily on quoted material with exaggerated headlines.
[...]
In June 2019, a federal judge ordered Anglin to pay $4.1 million
to comedian Dean Obeidallah, whom Anglin had falsely accused of
orchestrating the Manchester Arena bombing. In July 2019, a
federal magistrate recommended that Anglin pay $14 million to
Tanya Gersh, a woman from Whitefish, Montana against whom Anglin
had organized a targeted harassment campaign.
-- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Daily_Stormer

Followup-to: comp.misc,misc.news.internet.discuss
--
/* * * Otto J. Makela <om@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
/* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
/* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */

Java Jive wrote:

> Fake news reported to   a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t

Another waste of news admin's time.

Java Jive wrote:
> On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>
>> https://dailystormer.su/massive-reddit-movement-to-ban-all-dissenting-coronavirus-information-even-harder/
>>
>>
>> Massive reddit Movement to Ban All Dissenting Coronavirus Information Even Harder
>>
>> Andrew Anglin
>> August 29, 2021
>>
>> I saw this pinned at the top of r/News:
>>
>> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o
>> a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - 0 9 . 1 5 . 0 0 - w w w . r e d
>> d i t . c o m - 6 8 1 5 c 4 8 8 7 f 3 a . p n g
>
> [Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]

Andrew Anglin and his site are banned from everything. Why would
you even bother?

> "HOAX WATCH Exposing the endless series of nonsense from the  J e w s and  w o m
> e n"
>
> So obviously a fake news site for anti-semitism, misogyny, and probably also the
> usual broad range of right-wing bigotries.  No need to read further.
>
>> I clicked through to the thread,
>>
>> https://www.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/pbe8nj/we_call_upon_reddit_to_take_action_against_the/
>>
>
> "We call upon Reddit to take action against the rampant Coronavirus
> misinformation on their website.
>
> Everyone on this planet has been affected by the SARS-Cov-2/Coronavirus/Covid-19
> pandemic. You may have been in lockdown, you may have been forced to work under
> some form of duress, you may have lost a loved one to the disease, you may be
> left with long term side effects of the illness, you may have found that regular
> food, housing, and/or medical care is less attainable or more expensive now.
>
> We could have been better off months ago, but disinformation and lies have been
> allowed to spread readily through inaction and malice, and have dragged this on
> at the cost of lives. There are those who deny that the pandemic even exists,
> there are those who think that wearing a mask will literally suffocate you,
> there are those who think it's no worse than a regular flu virus, that it's a
> bioweapon, and everything in between. This volume of blatant misinformation is
> problematic and dangerous.
>
> It is clear that even after promising to tackle the problem of misinformation on
> this site, nothing of substance has been done aside from quarantining a medium
> sized subreddit, which barely reduces traffic and does little to stop
> misinformation."
>
> Can't disagree with that.  See my sig.
>
>> For example, the coroner recently ruled that a BBC presenter, Lisa Shaw,
>> had died from the vaccine. What the reddit thread claims is that it is
>> impossible to die from the vaccine, and any information which leads
>> people to believe it is possible to die from the vaccine should be
>> suppressed. That would mean that the BBC's own article about their own
>> presenter dying of the vaccine would have to be suppressed, and anyone
>> who posted it would be banned.
>
>
> Lisa Shaw: Presenter's death due to complications of Covid vaccine
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-58330796
>
> The presenter's death is unfortunate but true, so how could merely reporting
> that be construed as misinformation?  What would be misinformation, as you are
> appearing to attempt, is to deduce from the sad death of one person that
> vaccines are dangerous and should be avoided.  *THAT* would be misinformation. 
> The slight dangers of the vaccine itself are vastly outweighed by the *SAME*
> dangers from the coronavirus itself, so vaccines represent a reduction of
> personal risk against which it is irrational and nonsensical to argue.
>
> Covid: Vaccine complications dwarfed by virus risks
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58347434
>
> "A major review of vaccines suggests the AstraZeneca jab does raise the risk of
> blood clots and another serious condition that can cause bleeding.
>
> But the study found the risk of such problems following a coronavirus infection
> was still much higher.
>
> The University of Oxford-led team also found an increased risk of stroke after
> the Pfizer jab - but again at a much lower rate than after infection.
>
> The team said it once again showed the "substantial" benefit of vaccination."
>
>> Probably, reddit is the purest example on earth of organized cult
>> groupthink in support of the government and media. But it is still
>> amazing to see how hardcore these people are.
>
> I don't use it, but to me, as a centrist, the above sounds like the usual sort
> of right-wing bias to me.
>
>> Their argument, of course, is that it is the fault of people being
>> allowed to freely share information that the "pandemic" has not ended.
>
>> Like every other aspect of the coronavirus hoax,
>
> Fake news reported to   a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t

Faggot.

> If it's a hoax, how come all those people died?

Murder by the government. Specifically, putting many of them on
ventilators that were known to not work, and withholding drugs
that may very well have saved them.

>> this is demonstrably false. Israel has proved this. >
>> American Association for the Advancement of Science, August 16:
>>
>> https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta
>>
>>
>>> Israel has among the world's highest levels of vaccination for COVID-19,
>>> with 78% of those 12 and older fully vaccinated, the vast majority with
>>> the Pfizer vaccine. Yet the country is now logging one of the world's
>>> highest infection rates, with nearly 650 new cases daily per million
>>> people. More than half are in fully vaccinated people, underscoring the
>>> extraordinary transmissibility of the Delta variant and stoking concerns
>>> that the benefits of vaccination ebb over time.
>>>
>>> The sheer number of vaccinated Israelis means some breakthrough
>>> infections were inevitable, and the unvaccinated are still far more
>>> likely to end up in the hospital or die. But Israel's experience is
>>> forcing the booster issue onto the radar for other nations, suggesting
>>> as it does that even the best vaccinated countries will face a Delta
>>> surge.
>
> The same is happening in the UK, particularly ATM Scotland, but there is nothing
> surprising about this.  We'll need boosters just as we do for the flu jabs.  It
> was always a high possibility, and sadly is now beginning to look a certainty. 
> However, the good news is that smaller proportions of those infected who have
> been vaccinated are ending up in hospital or dying, so the vaccines are still
> being immensely helpful in saving lives and avoiding needless suffering.
>
>> Obviously, introducing this "Delta variant" was simply a way to explain
>> why you need to keep taking more and more vaccines.
>
> Fake news reported to   a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t
>
>> But whatever you
>> believe about this, it is simply a fact that even if everyone believed
>> exactly as the media and government are telling them to believe, the
>> "pandemic" would still be ongoing.
>
> Of course, no-one's denying that, but it's still the case that fake news such as
> you are propagandising here is dangerous at worst, unhelpful at best.  In an
> ideal world, fake news traffickers like you wouldn't exist, but as your idiotic
> post proves we don't live in an ideal world, and therefore it is necessary for
> society to protect itself against the peddlers of propaganda like you.  Hence my
> reporting you to the abuse address of your news server.
>
>> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o
>> a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / S c r e e n - S h o t - 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - a t - 1
>> 0 . 0 0 . 5 4 - A M . p n g
>
> [Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]
>
>> Iceland is even more vaccinated than Israel, and they are also
>> experiencing a "surge" of the "Delta variant."
>
> Again, sadly, not news, and not surprising.
>
>> The health authorities have been wrong about absolutely everything, and
>> if the censorship policy was that no one is allowed to disagree with the
>> government and media, then back in early 2020, you would have been
>> censored for saying people should wear masks, as at that time, the
>> government and media were telling people not to wear masks.
>
> It is a simple fact that wearing masks helps prevent infection,

On 31/08/2021 00:55, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>
> Java Jive wrote:
>>
>> On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>
>>> https://dailystormer.su/massive-reddit-movement-to-ban-all-dissenting-coronavirus-information-even-harder/
>>>
>>> Massive reddit Movement to Ban All Dissenting Coronavirus Information Even Harder
>>>
>>> Andrew Anglin
>>> August 29, 2021
>>>
>>> I saw this pinned at the top of r/News:
>>>
>>> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o
>>> a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - 0 9 . 1 5 . 0 0 - w w w . r e d
>>> d i t . c o m - 6 8 1 5 c 4 8 8 7 f 3 a . p n g
>>
>> [Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]
>
> Andrew Anglin and his site are banned from everything. Why would
> you even bother?

In that case, Andrew, why would you be linking to a site that nobody
trusts? Unless, of course, you want to boost your own site's rankings?

>>> Probably, reddit is the purest example on earth of organized cult
>>> groupthink in support of the government and media. But it is still
>>> amazing to see how hardcore these people are.
>>
>> I don't use it, but to me, as a centrist, the above sounds like the usual sort
>> of right-wing bias to me.
>>
>>> Their argument, of course, is that it is the fault of people being
>>> allowed to freely share information that the "pandemic" has not ended.
>>
>>> Like every other aspect of the coronavirus hoax,
>>
>> Fake news reported to   a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t
>
> Faggot.

Liar.

>> If it's a hoax, how come all those people died?
>
> Murder by the government. Specifically, putting many of them on
> ventilators that were known to not work, and withholding drugs
> that may very well have saved them.

Where is your *EVIDENCE* for this wild and paranoid assertion, liar?

>>> The health authorities have been wrong about absolutely everything, and
>>> if the censorship policy was that no one is allowed to disagree with the
>>> government and media, then back in early 2020, you would have been
>>> censored for saying people should wear masks, as at that time, the
>>> government and media were telling people not to wear masks.
>>
>> It is a simple fact that wearing masks helps prevent infection,
>
> No it doesn't.

Liar. See the evidence still linked below.

>> mostly from the
>> wearer to others, less so from others to the wearer, so it's a "I'll scratch
>> your back if you'll scratch mine" thing, I wear a mask to protect you, you
>> should wear a mask to protect me.
>>
>> Visualizing Speech-Generated Oral Fluid Droplets with Laser Light Scattering
>> https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2007800
>>
>> 8 dangerous COVID-19 face mask myths you need to stop believing
>> https://www.cnet.com/health/8-dangerous-covid-19-face-mask-myths-you-need-to-stop-believing/
>
> Droplets fall to the ground in front of whoever emits them.

But how soon depends on their size, larger droplets fall quite quickly,
but smaller droplets can continue in the air for some time, thus ...

> The virus is also airborne.

.... and, as no-one is going around licking the ground, it is this that
is important, which is why wearing masks helps to prevent infection.

>> Mass censorship is not the issue here.  In no country in the world is there has
>> there ever been such a thing as free speech.  All countries in the world have
>> laws governing what may or may not be said, and one of the most common
>> underlying principles of such laws is a requirement for truth.
>
> LOL!
>
> You of course mean, 'a requirement for official lies'.

I mean a requirement simply to tell the truth, which clearly you do not.

>> The censorship only of those who lie
>
> Questioning the official narrative is not "lying".

However, going against scientific research that proves otherwise is
lying, and that is what you are doing, lying.

> Do you believe that Big Brother should be the arbiter of what is
> and isn't the truth?

Whoever it should be, it clearly shouldn't be you or anyone like you.

>> Again an attempt to pull emotional levers rather than argue rationally, in other
>> words to inflame rather than inform.
>
> Many (if not most) people respond only to rhetoric, not dialectic,
> nor even the pseudo-dialectic you are engaging in here.

Which is why you are cynically lying in an emotive way to drum up
support for rationally insupportable lies.

>> Up til now, New Zealand has contained this virus probably better than any other
>> country, certainly better than the UK or the US or most other western nations.
>> Today, sadly, it has been reported that Australia reached its 1000th death,
>> while the UK has had over 132,000 and a few days ago when I last looked on a
>> population basis had the 21st worst death rate in the world.  Would that we had
>> been governed even half as intelligently as New Zealand or even Australia!
>
> New Zealand is an isolated island, and is run by a horse. Not an
> example of intelligent governing.

New Zealand is run by a woman whose intelligence and understanding far
exceeds most western leaders, and leaves your own in pre-history by
comparison. Australia, though an island, can hardly be described as
isolated. Korea is not isolated at all, on the contrary as a business
and commercial hub it is a good match in the east for the UK in the
west, but while our death rate is 197.3 per 110k and the US's 194.3,
theirs is just 4.5, Australia's 4.0, and New Zealand's 0.5. That tells
you all you need to know about what happens when proven liars and
incompetent buffoons like BlowJob, Trump, and yourself, are put in
charge of a country.

> Do you think people should be locked in their homes until the end
> of time?

Another attempt to pull emotional levers rather than argue rationally.

There are times when it is necessary to keep people at home for their
own and others' greater safety, for example in time of war. Until the
last few months or so, the UK annual death rate from covid-19 was
exceeding that during each of the 6 years of WW2, so if curfew is
considered acceptable in war, it should be considered acceptable for
covid-19. However, as a result of the vaccination drive, the UK, as
most western nations, are not locked in their homes now, so why are you
still asking this damn fool question?

>>> We are grown men. We have a right to make our own decisions about what
>>> we do, about what we read, about what we think. Even if there was a
>>> deadly virus, that would not change. If we allow all of our freedoms to
>>> be taken away because of a virus, we never had those freedoms in the
>>> first place, and they can now be suspended for any other reason.
>>
>> If you lived alone in the world, that would be a reasonable argument, but like
>> it or not you have to share this world with nearly 8 billion other people, and
>> therefore there are times when your personal freedoms are impositions on other
>> people's freedom, and your so-called 'rights' have to be balanced against the
>> equally valid 'rights' of others. Didn't your parents teach you these
>> infantilely obvious points when you were a toddler?

I take it that's a 'no' then, and that your parents spoilt you by
allowing you to be a selfish shit.

> Do you think people should be locked in their homes until the end
> of time?

Yet another attempt to pull emotional levers rather than argue
rationally. See above.

>> You have no scientific proof that such an unlikely thing as 'God' exists,
>
> Okay, now we all know who we're dealing with here.
>
> Provide "scientific proof" that YOU exist.

You're reading my posts, so if I don't exist, neither do you.

>> still
>> less that man with all his terrible faults and failings could possibly be made
>> in his image.   Within the last two or three years there was a poll that showed
>> that the majority of the UK's population did not believe in any form of 'god', I
>> suspect that proportion can only continue to grow.
>>
>>> People who disagree about this
>>> issue cannot possibly share a country together.
>>
>> Says who?
>
> Anyone sane.

Clearly that excludes you.

>> They can if bigoted religious zealots like you would stop trying to
>> impose your personal beliefs, irrational as they are, on to the rest of the
>> world.
>
> In this Clownworld created by the progs, there is NOBODY on the
> Christian right that has ANY power WHATSOEVER to impose their
> personal beliefs on you.
>
> The only people allowed to impose their beliefs upon others in
> Clownworld are progs and other Leftists, Jews, and faggots.

On 30/08/2021 15:02, Andy Burns wrote:
>
> Java Jive wrote:
>
>> Fake news reported to   a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t
>
> Another waste of news admin's time.

Having been a system administrator for other types of server, I would
expect that a news admin's job includes preventing abuse of his/her servers.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

Java Jive wrote:
> On 31/08/2021 00:55, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>
>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>
>>> On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>
>>>> https://dailystormer.su/massive-reddit-movement-to-ban-all-dissenting-coronavirus-information-even-harder/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Massive reddit Movement to Ban All Dissenting Coronavirus Information Even
>>>> Harder
>>>>
>>>> Andrew Anglin
>>>> August 29, 2021
>>>>
>>>> I saw this pinned at the top of r/News:
>>>>
>>>> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o
>>>> a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - 0 9 . 1 5 . 0 0 - w w w . r e d
>>>> d i t . c o m - 6 8 1 5 c 4 8 8 7 f 3 a . p n g
>>>
>>> [Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]
>>
>> Andrew Anglin and his site are banned from everything. Why would
>> you even bother?
>
> In that case, Andrew, why would you be linking to a site that nobody trusts? 
> Unless, of course, you want to boost your own site's rankings?

I'm not Andrew Anglin.

>>>> Probably, reddit is the purest example on earth of organized cult
>>>> groupthink in support of the government and media. But it is still
>>>> amazing to see how hardcore these people are.
>>>
>>> I don't use it, but to me, as a centrist, the above sounds like the usual sort
>>> of right-wing bias to me.
>>>
>>>> Their argument, of course, is that it is the fault of people being
>>>> allowed to freely share information that the "pandemic" has not ended.
>>>
>>>> Like every other aspect of the coronavirus hoax,
>>>
>>> Fake news reported to   a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t
>>
>> Faggot.
>
> Liar.
>
>>> If it's a hoax, how come all those people died?
>>
>> Murder by the government. Specifically, putting many of them on
>> ventilators that were known to not work, and withholding drugs
>> that may very well have saved them.
>
> Where is your *EVIDENCE* for this wild and paranoid assertion, liar?

https://apnews.com/article/health-us-news-ap-top-news-international-news-virus-outbreak-8ccd325c2be9bf454c2128dcb7bd616d

"80% or more of coronavirus patients placed on the machines
in New York City have died, state and city officials say."

https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/medical-advances/494274-nearly-half-of-all-patients-placed-on

"New data confirms that out of 1151 patients placed on mechanical
ventilation, 282, or 24.5 percent, died. A corresponding 72.2
percent remained in hospital care, while 3.3 percent were discharged
alive."

Both ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine have been politicized by the
Left, and has been withheld from patients, despite there being strong
and moderate evidence, respectively, as to their early treatment
potential.

>>>> The health authorities have been wrong about absolutely everything, and
>>>> if the censorship policy was that no one is allowed to disagree with the
>>>> government and media, then back in early 2020, you would have been
>>>> censored for saying people should wear masks, as at that time, the
>>>> government and media were telling people not to wear masks.
>>>
>>> It is a simple fact that wearing masks helps prevent infection,
>>
>> No it doesn't.
>
> Liar.  See the evidence still linked below.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2493952/pdf/annrcse01509-0009.pdf
https://www.cochranelibrary.com/cdsr/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD006207.pub5/full

>>> mostly from the
>>> wearer to others, less so from others to the wearer, so it's a "I'll scratch
>>> your back if you'll scratch mine" thing, I wear a mask to protect you, you
>>> should wear a mask to protect me.
>>>
>>> Visualizing Speech-Generated Oral Fluid Droplets with Laser Light Scattering
>>> https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2007800
>>>
>>> 8 dangerous COVID-19 face mask myths you need to stop believing
>>> https://www.cnet.com/health/8-dangerous-covid-19-face-mask-myths-you-need-to-stop-believing/
>>>
>>
>> Droplets fall to the ground in front of whoever emits them.
>
> But how soon depends on their size, larger droplets fall quite quickly, but
> smaller droplets can continue in the air for some time, thus ...

Droplets are NOT the primary means of transmission.

>> The virus is also airborne.
>
> ... and, as no-one is going around licking the ground, it is this that is
> important, which is why wearing masks helps to prevent infection.

No it doesn't. See above.

>>> Mass censorship is not the issue here.  In no country in the world is there has
>>> there ever been such a thing as free speech.  All countries in the world have
>>> laws governing what may or may not be said, and one of the most common
>>> underlying principles of such laws is a requirement for truth.
>>
>> LOL!
>>
>> You of course mean, 'a requirement for official lies'.
>
> I mean a requirement simply to tell the truth, which clearly you do not.

So who gets to decide what is the truth?

>>> The censorship only of those who lie
>>
>> Questioning the official narrative is not "lying".
>
> However, going against scientific research that proves otherwise is lying, and
> that is what you are doing, lying.
>
>> Do you believe that Big Brother should be the arbiter of what is
>> and isn't the truth?
>
> Whoever it should be, it clearly shouldn't be you or anyone like you.

Neither should it be you.

>>> Again an attempt to pull emotional levers rather than argue rationally, in other
>>> words to inflame rather than inform.
>>
>> Many (if not most) people respond only to rhetoric, not dialectic,
>> nor even the pseudo-dialectic you are engaging in here.
>
> Which is why you are cynically lying in an emotive way to drum up support for
> rationally insupportable lies.
>
>>> Up til now, New Zealand has contained this virus probably better than any other
>>> country, certainly better than the UK or the US or most other western nations.
>>> Today, sadly, it has been reported that Australia reached its 1000th death,
>>> while the UK has had over 132,000 and a few days ago when I last looked on a
>>> population basis had the 21st worst death rate in the world.  Would that we had
>>> been governed even half as intelligently as New Zealand or even Australia!
>>
>> New Zealand is an isolated island, and is run by a horse. Not an
>> example of intelligent governing.
>
> New Zealand is run by a woman whose intelligence and understanding far exceeds
> most western leaders,

LOL! Like most women, the horse is a hysteric and believes it to be
possible for people to live life with ZERO risk whatsoever.

> and leaves your own in pre-history by comparison. 
> Australia, though an island, can hardly be described as isolated.  Korea is not
> isolated at all, on the contrary as a business and commercial hub it is a good
> match in the east for the UK in the west, but while our death rate is 197.3 per
> 110k and the US's 194.3, theirs is just 4.5, Australia's 4.0, and New Zealand's
> 0.5.  That tells you all you need to know about what happens when proven liars
> and incompetent buffoons like BlowJob, Trump, and yourself, are put in charge of
> a country.
>
>> Do you think people should be locked in their homes until the end
>> of time?
>
> Another attempt to pull emotional levers rather than argue rationally.

Evasion noted.

> There are times when it is necessary to keep people at home for their own and
> others' greater safety, for example in time of war.  Until the last few months
> or so, the UK annual death rate from covid-19 was exceeding that during each of
> the 6 years of WW2, so if curfew is considered acceptable in war, it should be
> considered acceptable for covid-19.  However, as a result of the vaccination
> drive, the UK, as most western nations, are not locked in their homes now, so
> why are you still asking this damn fool question?

We're talking about New Zealand, which you're holding up as a model.

They are currently in a strict lockdown.

>>>> We are grown men. We have a right to make our own decisions about what
>>>> we do, about what we read, about what we think. Even if there was a
>>>> deadly virus, that would not change. If we allow all of our freedoms to
>>>> be taken away because of a virus, we never had those freedoms in the
>>>> first place, and they can now be suspended for any other reason.
>>>
>>> If you lived alone in the world, that would be a reasonable argument, but like
>>> it or not you have to share this world with nearly 8 billion other people, and
>>> therefore there are times when your personal freedoms are impositions on other
>>> people's freedom, and your so-called 'rights' have to be balanced against the
>>> equally valid 'rights' of others. Didn't your parents teach you these
>>> infantilely obvious points when you were a toddler?
>
> I take it that's a 'no' then, and that your parents spoilt you by allowing you
> to be a selfish shit.

On 01/09/2021 04:11, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>
> Java Jive wrote:
>>
>> On 31/08/2021 00:55, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>
>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>
>>>> [Fake news URL removed to prevent it being boosted in search engines]
>>>
>>> Andrew Anglin and his site are banned from everything. Why would
>>> you even bother?
>>
>> In that case, Andrew, why would you be linking to a site that nobody trusts?
>> Unless, of course, you want to boost your own site's rankings?
>
> I'm not Andrew Anglin.

Then why did you link multiple times to his site, and almost exclusively
to his site, when you yourself acknowledged that "Andrew Anglin and his
site are banned from everything"? Why would you be trying to boost the
rankings of a condemned and banned site if you are not its owner?

>>>> If it's a hoax, how come all those people died?
>>>
>>> Murder by the government. Specifically, putting many of them on
>>> ventilators that were known to not work, and withholding drugs
>>> that may very well have saved them.
>>
>> Where is your *EVIDENCE* for this wild and paranoid assertion, liar?
>
> https://apnews.com/article/health-us-news-ap-top-news-international-news-virus-outbreak-8ccd325c2be9bf454c2128dcb7bd616d
>
> https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/medical-advances/494274-nearly-half-of-all-patients-placed-on

No those are not evidence for your wild and paranoid claim; both are
about doctors learning to treat a new disease better in the early stages
of the pandemic, neither supply any evidence at all for your claimed
"Murder by the government". So, as everyone reading will have known,
probably including yourself, that was just another of your absurd and
paranoid lies.

> Both ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine have been politicized by the
> Left, and has been withheld from patients, despite there being strong
> and moderate evidence, respectively, as to their early treatment
> potential.

No, they were politicised by the right, specifically by Trump pushing
them on zero evidential basis, most 'studies' being quoted in support of
either having absurdly small sample sizes*, while around the world
independent studies with large enough sample sizes have not found any
benefit from either:

[* It cannot be overemphasised that where a drug or other intervention
has a very low percentage claimed benefit, studies require sample sizes
of many thousands or tens of thousands before any conclusions can be drawn.]

Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.

https://www.fda.gov/animal-veterinary/product-safety-information/fda-letter-stakeholders-do-not-use-ivermectin-intended-animals-treatment-covid-19-humans

"FDA Letter to Stakeholders: Do Not Use Ivermectin Intended for Animals
as Treatment for COVID-19 in Humans

The FDA’s Center for Veterinary Medicine has recently become aware of
increased public visibility of the antiparasitic drug ivermectin after
the announcement of a research article that described the effect of
ivermectin on SARS-CoV-2 in a laboratory setting. The Antiviral Research
pre-publication paper, “The FDA-approved drug ivermectin inhibits the
replication of SARS-CoV-2 in vitroExternal Link Disclaimer,” documents
how SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) responded to ivermectin
when exposed in a petri dish. This type of study is commonly used in the
early stages of drug development. Ivermectin was not given to people or
animals in this study. Additional testing is needed to determine whether
ivermectin might be safe or effective to prevent or treat coronavirus or
COVID-19."

So that's the FDA itself, under Trump's own Presidency, saying don't use
this animal drug on humans.

Hydroxychloroquine was even more highly politicised by Trump, despite
from quite early days being proven ineffective, this report from August
last year mentions those earlier results:

Science In Action 28/08/2020
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3cszh0s

The bulk of the programme covers Convalescent Plasma Therapy (CPT) -
another medical treatment whose efficacy or otherwise was then under
risk of being obscured by the unfortunate political intervention of
Trump - but includes this exchange between presenter Roland Pease and
guest scientific commentator Martin Landray, Professor of Medicine and
Epidemiology at Nuffield Department of Population Health, Oxford
University, who was then and probably still is conducting randomised
control trials of various covid-19 treatments, including CPT:

13:32

RP: "I was interested because one of your first results was with
hydroxychloroquine, which was one of those early hopes, I guess, in the
treatment options, and you were pretty quickly able, actually, to say
that wasn't doing any good; dexamethasone, an anti-inflammatory, was one
that you actually called out very quickly as being beneficial [asks
about numbers so far in trial for CPT]"

ML: "We're not close to those sorts of numbers at the moment, each of
those required several thousand patients. There are some lessons there
though: Hydroxychloroquine, a good scientific basis for thinking it
might be effective, actually quite a lot of expectation and no little
hype, if you like, that it might be effective, very widely used on the
basis of essentially no evidence, do the randomised trials, and it turns
out it doesn't work for patients in hospital. Dexamethasone, by
contrast, there was a lot of scepticism about that, whether that would
work, whether suppressing the body's immune system when it's trying to
fight a virus would really be a good thing, or might even be a harmful
thing; we did the trial and it turned out to be a remarkably effective
drug reducing the risk of mortality, of death, by about a third of the
people on ventilators. So I think what that tells us is, you can have
good theory, you can have good scientific understanding and rationale,
you can even have high expectation, but it's not until you get the
information from the randomised trial that you really know what's going
on, which treatments are really effective and which are not."

Or take this about HCL:

https://www.fda.gov/emergency-preparedness-and-response/mcm-legal-regulatory-and-policy-framework/emergency-use-authorization#coviddrugs

"On June 15, 2020, based on FDA’s continued review of the scientific
evidence available for hydroxychloroquine sulfate (HCQ) and chloroquine
phosphate (CQ) to treat covid-19, FDA has determined that the statutory
criteria for EUA as outlined in Section 564(c)(2) of the Food, Drug, and
Cosmetic Act are no longer met. Specifically, FDA has determined that
CQ and HCQ are unlikely to be effective in treating covid-19 for the
authorized uses in the EUA. Additionally, in light of ongoing serious
cardiac adverse events and other serious side effects, the known and
potential benefits of CQ and HCQ no longer outweigh the known and
potential risks for the authorized use. This warrants revocation of the
EUA for HCQ and CQ for the treatment of covid-19."

.... and clicking the links there eventually leads to (PDF) statements
directly contradicting widespread claims ...

"- We now believe that the suggested dosing regimens for CQ and HCQ as
detailed in the Fact Sheets are unlikely to produce an antiviral effect.
- Earlier observations of decreased viral shedding with HCQ or CQ
treatment have not been consistently replicated and recent data from a
randomized controlled trial assessing probability of negative conversion
showed no difference between HCQ and standard of care alone."

So why did Trump intervene in favour of HCL? He read and believed fake
news put out by liars like you! This is how HCL made it into the news
(my caps):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misinformation_related_to_the_2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pandemic

On 11 March, Adrian Bye, a tech startup leader who is not a doctor,
suggested to cryptocurrency investors Gregory Rigano and James Todaro
that “chloroquine will keep most people out of hospital." (BYE LATER
ADMITTED THAT HE HAD REACHED THIS CONCLUSION THROUGH "PHILOSOPHY" RATHER
THAN MEDICAL RESEARCH.) Two days later, Rigano and Todaro promoted
chloroquine in a self-published article THAT FALSELY CLAIMED AFFILIATION
WITH THREE INSTITUTIONS. Google removed the article.[349]"

If you want a fuller version of this story, read this, it's a both
fascinating but also highly alarming study in exactly how much of the
fake news shit that you wallow in gets started:

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/trump-hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus-fox-news_n_5ebaffdbc5b65b5fd63dac80?ri18n=true&guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9kdWNrZHVja2dvLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAB3eNpl0id2L2KS4kYyOCY9EINBe91aS1GZBCky_UVmsfNS6ITIFWufaa78W0rnXU9M2nXkNULWUsifGXWCEZ-uQZOjnFmj7xtQFDUsbct2Vn2PL7jTL-GDCAsIZ5ECuCRzok7AS4F8A_aP9dioKtptDTbQ_OLyDcEWI9H65pooP

In message <sgnn9m$1ph$1@gioia.aioe.org> Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
> Why would you be trying to boost the rankings of a condemned and
> banned site if you are not its owner?

He's an ignorant antivaxx shithead. Killfile and move on.

[400 lines of shit removed]

--
"Are you pondering what I'm pondering?"
"Yes, I am!"

On 01/09/2021 21:20, Lewis wrote:
>
> He's an ignorant antivaxx shithead. Killfile and move on.

You know that, I know that, everyone else knows that, and possibly even
he knows that, but unfortunately that's beside the point. The way these
people work is to leave shit everywhere they go, in the hope that if
enough of it goes unanswered by people ignoring/killfiling them, then it
hangs around and thus, simply by its very ubiquity coupled with the fact
that it goes unanswered, attains some measure of legitimacy for people
coming along later and stepping in it, thus shit becomes 'truth', black
becomes 'white', and white becomes 'black'.

My answer to this tactic whenever I happen to encounter it - I
certainly don't go looking for it - is to rip to bits every post such
people make in an as aggressive, insulting, and belittling way as
possible so that they endure maximum discomfort and embarrassment in
making them. It usually works, but can take a while before it does so,
and therefore can be tedious for a while.

You and others should just killfile the thread, and move on. I'll
remain on the job.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

Java Jive wrote:
> On 01/09/2021 04:11, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>
>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>
>>> On 31/08/2021 00:55, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> [Fake news URL removed to prevent it being boosted in search engines]
>>>>
>>>> Andrew Anglin and his site are banned from everything. Why would
>>>> you even bother?
>>>
>>> In that case, Andrew, why would you be linking to a site that nobody trusts?
>>> Unless, of course, you want to boost your own site's rankings?
>>
>> I'm not Andrew Anglin.
>
> Then why did you link multiple times to his site, and almost exclusively to his
> site, when you yourself acknowledged that "Andrew Anglin and his site are banned
> from everything"?  Why would you be trying to boost the rankings of a condemned
> and banned site if you are not its owner?

Because I think that what he wrote needs wider distribution. The
multiple links were links to the images that compliment the story,
so I included them inline.

>>>>> If it's a hoax, how come all those people died?
>>>>
>>>> Murder by the government. Specifically, putting many of them on
>>>> ventilators that were known to not work, and withholding drugs
>>>> that may very well have saved them.
>>>
>>> Where is your *EVIDENCE* for this wild and paranoid assertion, liar?
>>
>> https://apnews.com/article/health-us-news-ap-top-news-international-news-virus-outbreak-8ccd325c2be9bf454c2128dcb7bd616d
>>
>>
>> https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/medical-advances/494274-nearly-half-of-all-patients-placed-on
>>
>
> No those are not evidence for your wild and paranoid claim; both are about
> doctors learning to treat a new disease better in the early stages of the
> pandemic, neither supply any evidence at all for your claimed "Murder by the
> government".  So, as everyone reading will have known, probably including
> yourself, that was just another of your absurd and paranoid lies.

Data from Wuhan, which was available BEFORE either of those articles
was published said that ventilators don't work, that he majority of
those put on them DIE.

>> Both ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine have been politicized by the
>> Left, and has been withheld from patients, despite there being strong
>> and moderate evidence, respectively, as to their early treatment
>> potential.
>
> No, they were politicised by the right, specifically by Trump pushing them on
> zero evidential basis, most 'studies' being quoted in support of either having
> absurdly small sample sizes*, while around the world independent studies with
> large enough sample sizes have not found any benefit from either:

Trump mentioned it. Then, the entire Left that went batshit insane
over it like they always do.

> [* It cannot be overemphasised that where a drug or other intervention has a
> very low percentage claimed benefit, studies require sample sizes of many
> thousands or tens of thousands before any conclusions can be drawn.]
>
> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.

It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.

> https://www.fda.gov/animal-veterinary/product-safety-information/fda-letter-stakeholders-do-not-use-ivermectin-intended-animals-treatment-covid-19-humans
>
>
> "FDA Letter to Stakeholders: Do Not Use Ivermectin Intended for Animals as
> Treatment for COVID-19 in Humans
>
> The FDA’s Center for Veterinary Medicine has recently become aware of increased
> public visibility of the antiparasitic drug ivermectin after the announcement of
> a research article that described the effect of ivermectin on SARS-CoV-2 in a
> laboratory setting. The Antiviral Research pre-publication paper, “The
> FDA-approved drug ivermectin inhibits the replication of SARS-CoV-2 in
> vitroExternal Link Disclaimer,”  documents how SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes
> COVID-19) responded to ivermectin when exposed in a petri dish. This type of
> study is commonly used in the early stages of drug development. Ivermectin was
> not given to people or animals in this study. Additional testing is needed to
> determine whether ivermectin might be safe or effective to prevent or treat
> coronavirus or COVID-19."

But now we have this: https://ivmmeta.com/

> So that's the FDA itself, under Trump's own Presidency, saying don't use this
> animal drug on humans.
>
> Hydroxychloroquine was even more highly politicised by Trump, despite from quite
> early days being proven ineffective, this report from August last year mentions
> those earlier results:
>
> Science In Action 28/08/2020
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3cszh0s
>
> The bulk of the programme covers Convalescent Plasma Therapy (CPT)  - another
> medical treatment whose efficacy or otherwise was then under risk of being
> obscured by the unfortunate political intervention of Trump  - but includes this
> exchange between presenter Roland Pease and guest scientific commentator Martin
> Landray, Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology at Nuffield Department of
> Population Health, Oxford University, who was then and probably still is
> conducting randomised control trials of various covid-19 treatments, including CPT:
>
> 13:32
>
> RP:  "I was interested because one of your first results was with
> hydroxychloroquine, which was one of those early hopes, I guess, in the
> treatment options, and you were pretty quickly able, actually, to say that
> wasn't doing any good; dexamethasone, an anti-inflammatory, was one that you
> actually called out very quickly as being beneficial [asks about numbers so far
> in trial for CPT]"
>
> ML:  "We're not close to those sorts of numbers at the moment, each of those
> required several thousand patients. There are some lessons there though: 
> Hydroxychloroquine, a good scientific basis for thinking it might be effective,
> actually quite a lot of expectation and no little hype, if you like, that it
> might be effective, very widely used on the basis of essentially no evidence, do
> the randomised trials, and it turns out it doesn't work for patients in
> hospital.  Dexamethasone, by contrast, there was a lot of scepticism about that,
> whether that would work, whether suppressing the body's immune system when it's
> trying to fight a virus would really be a good thing, or might even be a harmful
> thing; we did the trial and it turned out to be a remarkably effective drug
> reducing the risk of mortality, of death, by about a third of the people on
> ventilators.  So I think what that tells us is, you can have good theory, you
> can have good scientific understanding and rationale, you can even have high
> expectation, but it's not until you get the information from the randomised
> trial that you really know what's going on, which treatments are really
> effective and which are not."
>
> Or take this about HCL:
>
> https://www.fda.gov/emergency-preparedness-and-response/mcm-legal-regulatory-and-policy-framework/emergency-use-authorization#coviddrugs
>
>
> "On June 15, 2020, based on FDA’s continued review of the scientific evidence
> available for hydroxychloroquine sulfate (HCQ) and chloroquine phosphate (CQ) to
> treat covid-19, FDA has determined that the statutory criteria for EUA as
> outlined in Section 564(c)(2) of the Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act are no longer
> met.  Specifically, FDA has determined that CQ and HCQ are unlikely to be
> effective in treating covid-19 for the authorized uses in the EUA. Additionally,
> in light of ongoing serious cardiac adverse events and other serious side
> effects, the known and potential benefits of CQ and HCQ no longer outweigh the
> known and potential risks for the authorized use. This warrants revocation of
> the EUA for HCQ and CQ for the treatment of covid-19."

LOL! But yet remdesivir is still used, is of questionable efficacy,
with even more serious side-effects.

And there's also this: https://hcqmeta.com/

> ... and clicking the links there eventually leads to (PDF) statements directly
> contradicting widespread claims ...
>
> "- We now believe that the suggested dosing regimens for CQ and HCQ as detailed
> in the Fact Sheets are unlikely to produce an antiviral effect.
> - Earlier observations of decreased viral shedding with HCQ or CQ treatment have
> not been consistently replicated and recent data from a randomized controlled
> trial assessing probability of negative conversion showed no difference between
> HCQ and standard of care alone."
>
> So why did Trump intervene in favour of HCL?  He read and believed fake news put
> out by liars like you!  This is how HCL made it into the news (my caps):
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misinformation_related_to_the_2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pandemic
>
>
> On 11 March, Adrian Bye, a tech startup leader who is not a doctor, suggested to
> cryptocurrency investors Gregory Rigano and James Todaro that “chloroquine will
> keep most people out of hospital." (BYE LATER ADMITTED THAT HE HAD REACHED THIS
> CONCLUSION THROUGH "PHILOSOPHY" RATHER THAN MEDICAL RESEARCH.) Two days later,
> Rigano and Todaro promoted chloroquine in a self-published article THAT FALSELY
> CLAIMED AFFILIATION WITH THREE INSTITUTIONS. Google removed the article.[349]"
>
> If you want a fuller version of this story, read this, it's a both fascinating
> but also highly alarming study in exactly how much of the fake news shit that
> you wallow in gets started:
>
> https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/trump-hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus-fox-news_n_5ebaffdbc5b65b5fd63dac80?ri18n=true&guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9kdWNrZHVja2dvLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAB3eNpl0id2L2KS4kYyOCY9EINBe91aS1GZBCky_UVmsfNS6ITIFWufaa78W0rnXU9M2nXkNULWUsifGXWCEZ-uQZOjnFmj7xtQFDUsbct2Vn2PL7jTL-GDCAsIZ5ECuCRzok7AS4F8A_aP9dioKtptDTbQ_OLyDcEWI9H65pooP

Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
> On 31/08/2021 00:55, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>
>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>
>>> On 30/08/2021 02:05, A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>
>>>> https://dailystormer.su/massive-reddit-movement-to-ban-all-dissenting-coronavirus-information-even-harder/
>>>>
>>>> Massive reddit Movement to Ban All Dissenting Coronavirus Information Even Harder
>>>>
>>>> Andrew Anglin
>>>> August 29, 2021
>>>>
>>>> I saw this pinned at the top of r/News:
>>>>
>>>> h t t p s : / / d a i l y s t o r m e r . s u / w p - c o n t e n t / u p l o
>>>> a d s / 2 0 2 1 / 0 8 / 2 0 2 1 - 0 8 - 2 9 - 0 9 . 1 5 . 0 0 - w w w . r e d
>>>> d i t . c o m - 6 8 1 5 c 4 8 8 7 f 3 a . p n g
>>>
>>> [Fake news URL munged to prevent it being boosted in search engines]
>>
>> Andrew Anglin and his site are banned from everything. Why would
>> you even bother?
>
> In that case, Andrew, why would you be linking to a site that nobody
> trusts? Unless, of course, you want to boost your own site's rankings?
>
>>>> Probably, reddit is the purest example on earth of organized cult
>>>> groupthink in support of the government and media. But it is still
>>>> amazing to see how hardcore these people are.
>>>
>>> I don't use it, but to me, as a centrist, the above sounds like the usual sort
>>> of right-wing bias to me.
>>>
>>>> Their argument, of course, is that it is the fault of people being
>>>> allowed to freely share information that the "pandemic" has not ended.
>>>
>>>> Like every other aspect of the coronavirus hoax,
>>>
>>> Fake news reported to   a b u s e @ m i x m i n . n e t
>>
>> Faggot.
>
> Liar.
>
>>> If it's a hoax, how come all those people died?
>>
>> Murder by the government. Specifically, putting many of them on
>> ventilators that were known to not work, and withholding drugs
>> that may very well have saved them.
>
> Where is your *EVIDENCE* for this wild and paranoid assertion, liar?
>
>>>> The health authorities have been wrong about absolutely everything, and
>>>> if the censorship policy was that no one is allowed to disagree with the
>>>> government and media, then back in early 2020, you would have been
>>>> censored for saying people should wear masks, as at that time, the
>>>> government and media were telling people not to wear masks.
>>>
>>> It is a simple fact that wearing masks helps prevent infection,
>>
>> No it doesn't.
>
> Liar. See the evidence still linked below.

Comparison of different types of masks to prevent virus spread
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24229526/

Mask wearing is associated with transmission control of COVID.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landig/article/PIIS2589-7500%2820%2930293-4/fulltext

Denying the facts has the potential to accelerate your own death.
https://www.pennlive.com/nation-world/2021/08/texas-anti-mask-freedom-defender-dies-of-covid-at-age-30.html

A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
> Java Jive wrote:

<snip>

>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>
> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>

Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
if you have Covid virus then no.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>> Java Jive wrote:
>
><snip>
>
>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>
>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>
>
>Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
>if you have Covid virus then no.

Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind never
find other suitable uses? If so, you would be gravely mistaken. Consider
Viagra as an example:

https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/

> Despite the drug’s popularity today, the researchers who discovered it
> weren’t even looking for it. Sildenafil, the active ingredient in Viagra,
> was originally developed to treat cardiovascular problems. It was meant
> to dilate the heart’s blood vessels by blocking a particular protein
> called PDE-5. In animal tests, it seemed to work moderately well:
> researchers could find evidence that it was impeding PDE-5, and the
> animals weren’t having any obvious negative side effects. So, it was
> brought into a phase one clinical trial in the early 1990s, to test
> whether humans can tolerate a new compound.

It was in the human trials that followed that nurses took note of a certain
side effect in men that eventually led to its by now more common use as a
"boner pill."

_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( https://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

Scott Alfter wrote:
> In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
> Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>> A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>>
>>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>>
>>
>> Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
>> if you have Covid virus then no.
>
> Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind never
> find other suitable uses? If so, you would be gravely mistaken. Consider
> Viagra as an example:
>
> https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/

It can be true in one case but cannot be extrapolated to all cases. For
Ivermectin the fact is it is not the case. Studies have not found it to
be ineffective and using horse wormer or cattle *pour on* is definitely
harmful.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On Thu, 2 Sep 2021 08:14:42 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
<lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:

>A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>> Java Jive wrote:
>
><snip>
>
>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>
>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>
>
>Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
>if you have Covid virus then no.

If you put Invermectin in your system it does what it does. If you
have worms it gets rid of the worms. If you have COVID and have taken
several other medications you ameliiorate or even get rid of Covid. Of
course, in all cases, the use of the correct dosage is paramount.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

On Thu, 2 Sep 2021 19:24:33 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
<lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:

>Scott Alfter wrote:
>> In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
>> Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>>>
>>>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
>>> if you have Covid virus then no.
>>
>> Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind never
>> find other suitable uses? If so, you would be gravely mistaken. Consider
>> Viagra as an example:
>>
>> https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/
>
>It can be true in one case but cannot be extrapolated to all cases. For
>Ivermectin the fact is it is not the case. Studies have not found it to
>be ineffective and using horse wormer or cattle *pour on* is definitely
>harmful.

And yet:
https://rclutz.com/2021/08/19/greenlight-for-ivermectin-in-japan/

https://www.thedesertreview.com/opinion/columnists/indias-ivermectin-blackout---part-iii-the-lesson-of-kerala/article_ccecb97e-044e-11ec-9112-2b31ae87887a.html
or https://tinyurl.com/3u937bsr

https://gumshoenews.com/2021/08/22/ivermectin-wins-in-india/

https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2021/06/india-could-sentence-who-chief-scientist-to-death-for-misleading-over-ivermectin-and-killing-indians.html
or https://tinyurl.com/ymwzw4wr
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

On Fri, 03 Sep 2021 16:11:48 +1200, Eric Stevens
<eric.stevens@sum.co.nz> wrote:

>Ivermectin

Below is a small part of an article at this site -
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2052297521000883

sciencedirect.com
Ivermectin: a multifaceted drug of Nobel prize-honoured distinction
with indicated efficacy against a new global scourge, COVID-19
Abstract

In 2015, the Nobel Committee for Physiology or Medicine, in its only
award for treatments of infectious diseases since six decades prior,
honoured the discovery of ivermectin (IVM), a multifaceted drug
deployed against some of the world’s most devastating tropical
diseases. Since March 2020, when IVM was first used against a new
global scourge, COVID-19, more than 20 randomized clinical trials
(RCTs) have tracked such inpatient and outpatient treatments. Six of
seven meta-analyses of IVM treatment RCTs reporting in 2021 found
notable reductions in COVID-19 fatalities, with a mean 31% relative
risk of mortality vs. controls. During mass IVM treatments in Peru,
excess deaths fell by a mean of 74% over 30 days in its ten states
with the most extensive treatments. Reductions in deaths correlated
with the extent of IVM distributions in all 25 states with p < 0.002.
Sharp reductions in morbidity using IVM were also observed in two
animal models, of SARS-CoV-2 and a related betacoronavirus. The
indicated biological mechanism of IVM, competitive binding with
SARS-CoV-2 spike protein, is likely non-epitope specific, possibly
yielding full efficacy against emerging viral mutant strains.

On 2021-09-02 7:24 p.m., Jonathan N. Little wrote:
> Scott Alfter wrote:
>> In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
>> Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>>>
>>>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
>>> if you have Covid virus then no.
>>
>> Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind never
>> find other suitable uses? If so, you would be gravely mistaken. Consider
>> Viagra as an example:
>>
>> https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/
>
> It can be true in one case but cannot be extrapolated to all cases. For
> Ivermectin the fact is it is not the case. Studies have not found it to
> be ineffective and using horse wormer or cattle *pour on* is definitely
> harmful.

Two people who thought your statement was bullshit are Milo Yiannopoulos
and Joe Rogan, both of which decided to use Ivermectin to treat their
COVID infections and found success in doing so. Yiannopoulos said "The
medication I have to thank is IVERMECTIN. The moment I started taking
it, recovery was dramatic and immediate. Studies worldwide show that it
reduces viral load very effectively."

I trust first-hand experience a lot more than what the media tells us in
an effort to force us to buy more expensive and less effective medicine.
If you prefer to get a vaccine, a second jab and then another every five
months, feel free to do so. However, Ivermectin has been proven to work,
costs nothing and:

Ivermectin: an award-winning drug with expected antiviral activity
against COVID-19

<https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7539925/>

Hint: the media is lying to you again.

--
@RabidHussar

Eric Stevens wrote:
> On Thu, 2 Sep 2021 19:24:33 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
> <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Scott Alfter wrote:
>>> In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
>>> Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>> <snip>
>>>>
>>>>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>>>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>>>>
>>>> Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
>>>> if you have Covid virus then no.
>>> Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind never
>>> find other suitable uses? If so, you would be gravely mistaken. Consider
>>> Viagra as an example:
>>>
>>> https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/
>> It can be true in one case but cannot be extrapolated to all cases. For
>> Ivermectin the fact is it is not the case. Studies have not found it to
>> be ineffective and using horse wormer or cattle *pour on* is definitely
>> harmful.
>

"Ivermectin to be investigated as a possible treatment
for COVID-19 in Oxford’s PRINCIPLE trial" 23 Jun 2021

https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2021-06-23-ivermectin-be-investigated-possible-treatment-covid-19-oxford-s-principle-trial

"People aged 18 to 64 with certain underlying health conditions
or shortness of breath from COVID-19, or aged over 65, are eligible
to join the trial within the first 14 days of experiencing COVID-19
symptoms or receiving a positive test.

People with severe liver disease, who are on the blood-thinning
medication warfarin, or taking other treatments known to interact
with ivermectin, will be excluded.
"

None of the credible trials suggest taking it like daily
aspirin or something, as a "Prophylactic shield" in place
of a vaccine. If it has any value, it would be right
after you have a positive test result. Or as a ring prophylactic.
where you test positive, so your wife and kids get a couple doses.
If you get it right after getting a positive test result,
then you might as well see your doctor, as head off to the
farm supply store and deworm your cow.

Since there are some potential side effects (such as seizure),
there might be some need for observation. (Or at least to not
be taking it by yourself somewhere. A person seizing, may benefit
from a partner clearing their airway or turning them so they
can breathe.) We'd need to see the page in the Pharmaceutical Index
on it, to see what the list of contraindications is (we had
a copy at home, donated by a friend).

Even the advice to take daily aspirin was rescinded. It was
previously proposed for old people to be taking it like candy.
But the advice now, is "daily aspirin (81mg) under doctors advice".
Which means if you have indicative factors, then daily aspirin
might be recommended to reduce the risk of stroke. Aspirin is
no longer recommended as a blanket panacea.

The sample size in the Oxford trial is still a bit small. I suppose
it would depend on the enrollment rate, and how many additional
people sign the form, as to what the eventual enrollment would be.

The topic also seems to be popular with paywall sites, as a
couple attempts to read recent material had the usual prompt
on the page.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/the-shaky-science-behind-ivermectin-as-a-covid-19-cure

"Also, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported that in
the week ending August 13, 2021, more than 88,000 prescriptions
were written for ivermectin, representing a 24-fold increase from
the pre-pandemic baseline of 3,600 prescriptions per week. That
meant some physicians were prescribing the drug for COVID-19,
despite the FDA’s stand."

I suppose it's that, or the patient deworms their cow and
achieves an incorrect dosage.

At least one of the foreign "trials", they were giving the
patients ivermectin alright, but also "throwing in the kitchen
sink", so the patient also got a "dash of horseradish" and so on.
It helps if the trial does not include co-factors that can
interfere with a clear result. The rest of the trials did not
seem to make that mistake.

There's nothing to indicate this stuff is candy. It's
highly unlikely to ever be approved for human usage
as if it was aspirin. It'll be by prescription, and presumably
only enough doses to treat a suspected COVID case. That's
the info missing from the "24-fold increase" above, is
whether the doctor is writing a script for a thousand tabs,
or three tabs.

Paul

RabidHussar wrote:
> On 2021-09-02 7:24 p.m., Jonathan N. Little wrote:
>> Scott Alfter wrote:
>>> In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
>>> Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>>
>>>> <snip>
>>>>
>>>>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then
>>>> yes,
>>>> if you have Covid virus then no.
>>>
>>> Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind
>>> never
>>> find other suitable uses?  If so, you would be gravely mistaken. 
>>> Consider
>>> Viagra as an example:
>>>
>>> https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/
>>>
>>
>> It can be true in one case but cannot be extrapolated to all cases. For
>> Ivermectin the fact is it is not the case. Studies have not found it to
>> be ineffective and using horse wormer or cattle *pour on* is definitely
>> harmful.
>
> Two people who thought your statement was bullshit are Milo Yiannopoulos
> and Joe Rogan, both of which decided to use Ivermectin to treat their
> COVID infections and found success in doing so. Yiannopoulos said "The
> medication I have to thank is IVERMECTIN. The moment I started taking
> it, recovery was dramatic and immediate. Studies worldwide show that it
> reduces viral load very effectively."

Right...two giants in the fields of epidemiology and virology. I'm going
to get my medical advice from them...

>
> I trust first-hand experience a lot more than what the media tells us in
> an effort to force us to buy more expensive and less effective medicine.
> If you prefer to get a vaccine, a second jab and then another every five
> months, feel free to do so. However, Ivermectin has been proven to work,
> costs nothing and:
>
> Ivermectin: an award-winning drug with expected antiviral activity
> against COVID-19
>
> <https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7539925/>
>
> Hint: the media is lying to you again.
>

Okay, first what works in mice does not always translate to working in
humans...often not. Next they are doing studies but paper admits that
the studies are in the early stages and are not conclusive at all.There
are other recent papers that show Ivermectin is ineffective in human for
Covid on the NIH site. Meanwhile what IS MOST EFFECTIVE RIGHT NOW is the
vaccines which aside of immediate availability has two benefits: 1)
Prevents the majority of infection, hospitalization, transmission and
death of people, and 2) by preventing the replication of the virus
prevents the virus from evolving into something even more deadly than it
already is.

$25 shot is also more cost effective that $$$$$$ in treatment, medicine,
hospitalization, and possible mortuary costs. That is ignoring the the
other toll of suffering, lost, and *harm to others* the unvaccinated
cause. **the worst selfish aspect of all this.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On 03/09/2021 13:29, Paul wrote:
>
> Eric Stevens wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 2 Sep 2021 19:24:33 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
>> <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Scott Alfter wrote:
>>>> In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
>>>> Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>>> <snip>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>>>>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then
>>>>> yes,
>>>>> if you have Covid virus then no.
>>>> Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind
>>>> never
>>>> find other suitable uses?  If so, you would be gravely mistaken.
>>>> Consider
>>>> Viagra as an example:
>>>>
>>>> https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/
>>>>
>>> It can be true in one case but cannot be extrapolated to all cases. For
>>> Ivermectin the fact is it is not the case. Studies have not found it to
>>> be ineffective and using horse wormer or cattle *pour on* is definitely
>>> harmful.

I think this is the same team that has already debunked
hydroxychloroquine (HCL) ...

> "Ivermectin to be investigated as a possible treatment
>  for COVID-19 in Oxford’s PRINCIPLE trial"   23 Jun 2021
>
> https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2021-06-23-ivermectin-be-investigated-possible-treatment-covid-19-oxford-s-principle-trial
>
>
>   "People aged 18 to 64 with certain underlying health conditions
>    or shortness of breath from COVID-19, or aged over 65, are eligible
>    to join the trial within the first 14 days of experiencing COVID-19
>    symptoms or receiving a positive test.
>
>    People with severe liver disease, who are on the blood-thinning
>    medication warfarin, or taking other treatments known to interact
>    with ivermectin, will be excluded.
>   "

But also:

"Even though ivermectin is used routinely in some countries to treat
COVID-19, there is little evidence from large-scale randomised
controlled trials to demonstrate that it can speed up recovery from the
illness or reduce hospital admission."

So clearly a properly controlled trial is needed, and presumably this
will be one.

> Since there are some potential side effects (such as seizure),
> there might be some need for observation. (Or at least to not
> be taking it by yourself somewhere. A person seizing, may benefit
> from a partner clearing their airway or turning them so they
> can breathe.) We'd need to see the page in the Pharmaceutical Index
> on it, to see what the list of contraindications is (we had
> a copy at home, donated by a friend).

This is precisely the sort of reason why self-administration of
unapproved medications should not be contemplated. In this particular
example, the so-called 'cure' could very easily turn out far worse than
the disease, and is a reason why some of the previous laissez-faire
trials of some of these treatments smack of desperation and have had a
questionable ethical basis.

For another example that would be laughable if it wasn't tragic, towards
the end of April last year, after Trump's bleach gaff in a news
conference, as a joke to make a serious point, I wrote the following:

<quote>

Homer: See what Trump said Marge, gee, that'll stop me coughing, I'll
go and get some bleach!

Marge: Well, I dunno ...

[Homer pours a glass of bleach, knocks it back in one, and is
immediately wracked in pain. He is rushed to hospital, we don't know
whether he would actually live or not, but let us suppose that on top of
Covid-19, it's too much for him, and he dies.]

Lawyer: Let me understand, Mrs. Simpson, you say your husband was
watching the President on TV, the President suggested drinking
disinfectant could cure Covid-19, so your husband took a great swig of
some, was rushed to hospital, where shortly later he died. Is that correct?

Marge: That's right, that's exactly what happened.

Lawyer: And what did the doctors attending him say was the cause of
death?

Marge: That he'd drunk that stuff that the President said was OK to
drink.

Later an x million dollar damages claim is delivered to the White House.

No wonder his aides very quickly told him to say he was being 'ironic'!

<\quote>

I could claim that as a prophesy, except that the following sad incident
actually occurred earlier than I wrote the above, so you're probably not
going to believe me when I say that I only discovered it some time
later. Nevertheless, it happens to be true, and the fact that I
bothered to write the above actually proves it, because of course
otherwise simply I'd've linked to the earlier story. The only thing I
got wrong was the bleach, it was actually chloroquine:

"Coronavirus: Man dies taking fish tank cleaner as virus drug"
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/52012242

> https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/the-shaky-science-behind-ivermectin-as-a-covid-19-cure
>
>
>    "Also, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported that in
>     the week ending August 13, 2021, more than 88,000 prescriptions
>     were written for ivermectin, representing a 24-fold increase from
>     the pre-pandemic baseline of 3,600 prescriptions per week. That
>     meant some physicians were prescribing the drug for COVID-19,
>     despite the FDA’s stand."
>
> I suppose it's that, or the patient deworms their cow and
> achieves an incorrect dosage.

Yup, that's what fake news does.

> At least one of the foreign "trials", they were giving the
> patients ivermectin alright, but also "throwing in the kitchen
> sink", so the patient also got a "dash of horseradish" and so on.
> It helps if the trial does not include co-factors that can
> interfere with a clear result. The rest of the trials did not
> seem to make that mistake.

I think quite a lot of these sorts of trials were actually trials of
combination treatments, seemingly zinc additives and Vitamin D are
common features of the mix.

I'm reminded of the guys in IT at work, who would try and fix a problem
unsystematically by 'blunderbuss' approach, trying a whole lot of
different things in one go, and then if they did happen to fix it, would
never know exactly what they did that fixed the problem, so next time
that particular problem re-occurred, they would be back to square one
wasting time trying lots of stuff that already hadn't worked. I found
having my previous scientific training very useful in this process. I
invested time in varying one thing and one thing only, and then testing
the results of that thoroughly, until I found something that fixed the
problem, so nearly always I knew exactly what I'd done to fix the
problem, thus saving much more time later on every subsequent
re-occurrence of that particular problem.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

On 2021-09-03 12:11 a.m., Eric Stevens wrote:
> On Thu, 2 Sep 2021 19:24:33 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
> <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Scott Alfter wrote:
>>> In article <sgqf7k$11n$1@dont-email.me>,
>>> Jonathan N. Little <lws4art@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> A Voice in the Wilderness? wrote:
>>>>> Java Jive wrote:
>>>>
>>>> <snip>
>>>>
>>>>>> Ivermectin is an ANIMAL drug used to tread parasitic worms.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's been used in HUMANS for DECADES, and is safer than aspirin.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes true, for the treatment of WORMS. If you have guinea worms then yes,
>>>> if you have Covid virus then no.
>>>
>>> Do you assert that drugs that are developed with one purpose in mind never
>>> find other suitable uses? If so, you would be gravely mistaken. Consider
>>> Viagra as an example:
>>>
>>> https://qz.com/1070732/viagras-famously-surprising-origin-story-is-actually-a-pretty-common-way-to-find-new-drugs/
>>
>> It can be true in one case but cannot be extrapolated to all cases. For
>> Ivermectin the fact is it is not the case. Studies have not found it to
>> be ineffective and using horse wormer or cattle *pour on* is definitely
>> harmful.
>
> And yet:
> https://rclutz.com/2021/08/19/greenlight-for-ivermectin-in-japan/
>
> https://www.thedesertreview.com/opinion/columnists/indias-ivermectin-blackout---part-iii-the-lesson-of-kerala/article_ccecb97e-044e-11ec-9112-2b31ae87887a.html
> or https://tinyurl.com/3u937bsr
>
> https://gumshoenews.com/2021/08/22/ivermectin-wins-in-india/
>
> https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2021/06/india-could-sentence-who-chief-scientist-to-death-for-misleading-over-ivermectin-and-killing-indians.html
> or https://tinyurl.com/ymwzw4wr

For my own life, I would much rather use Ivermectin than use a vaccine.
Of course, it should be noted that long-term use of the drug will cause
damage to a person's kidneys.

--
@RabidHussar